To multiclass or not to multiclass

[Vastly]

So, I'm playing a Hexblade, pact of the blade, warlock and had originally planned to stay pure warlock the whole time. However, after some chatting with my DM, the idea of maybe multiclassing into paladin, path of conquest, has taken hold. So I'm looking for advice on whether I should multiclass into paladin, and if I do what level split would be optimal.

For some background, I'm already a lvl 6 Warlock, I'm taking GWM, Polearm Mastery, and Elven Accuracy, and my DM is willing to let me trade out invocations and spells when I level up as a paladin as if I'd taken a level in Warlock. AKA I can drop thirsting blade when I get extra attack, or armor of agathys from my warlock spells known when I get it as conquest. I'm also the front line combatant of the group.

[Man_Over_Game]

So, I'm playing a Hexblade, pact of the blade, warlock and had originally planned to stay pure warlock the whole time. However, after some chatting with my DM, the idea of maybe multiclassing into paladin, path of conquest, has taken hold. So I'm looking for advice on whether I should multiclass into paladin, and if I do what level split would be optimal.

For some background, I'm already a lvl 6 Warlock, I'm taking GWM, Polearm Mastery, and Elven Accuracy, and my DM is willing to let me trade out invocations and spells when I level up as a paladin as if I'd taken a level in Warlock. AKA I can drop thirsting blade when I get extra attack, or armor of agathys from my warlock spells known when I get it as conquest. I'm also the front line combatant of the group.

If you're already invested into Warlock and are considering Paladin, I'd start leveling into Paladin right away. 2 levels of Paladin will get you access to Divine Smite (powerful with Warlock), and you'll be able to use Paladin spell slots to fuel things like Shield or Hex without wasting your high level Warlock slots.

Mostly, though, consider how much your DM likes to use Short Rests. If your table uses less than 2 Short Rests per day, then going Paladin will result in a lot more value out of your levels.

[MaxWilson]

So, I'm playing a Hexblade, pact of the blade, warlock and had originally planned to stay pure warlock the whole time. However, after some chatting with my DM, the idea of maybe multiclassing into paladin, path of conquest, has taken hold. So I'm looking for advice on whether I should multiclass into paladin, and if I do what level split would be optimal.

For some background, I'm already a lvl 6 Warlock, I'm taking GWM, Polearm Mastery, and Elven Accuracy, and my DM is willing to let me trade out invocations and spells when I level up as a paladin as if I'd taken a level in Warlock. AKA I can drop thirsting blade when I get extra attack, or armor of agathys from my warlock spells known when I get it as conquest. I'm also the front line combatant of the group.

What would Paladin get you that Eldritch Smite would not? Frankly, in your shoes I wouldn't bother. You can already lock down enemies with Fear, and you already can tank in melee--all Oath of Conquest would do is let you freeze them in place instead of running away, but by the time you actually got that capability you'd be level 13. If you just stay pure warlock you'll have better things to do at level 13 than prevent some melee-range guys from running away: you'll have Mass Suggestion, Forcecage, Danse Macabre, and a bunch of great invocations.

Paladin/Warlock is a good multiclass, but it's something you have to plan for from the beginning, and it's more likely to be Paladin 6/Warlock 2 than the other way around. The only way I'd consider switching in your shoes is if the campaign is on a bit of a railroad and the railroad doesn't have a good short-rest-to-encounter ratio, such that you always feel like you're running out of spell slots and wish you had more long-rest resources. (If it's not a railroad but you still feel hampered I would not switch my class, I would just look for ways to use my abilities more frequently, especially out of combat, and be more proactive about looking for places to rest (Rope Trick?).)

Stay the course, stay a warlock unless warlocks don't work well in this campaign.

Edit: what kind of "chatting with your DM" was involved? Was this in fact about pacing issues with short rests after all?

[Vastly]

@Man_Over_Game - I was hoping to pick up Elven accuracy and the +1 charisma before the switch over, which would require me to reach level 8 first. Would it still be advisable to switch immediately if it puts that off until character lvl 10?

@MaxWilson - The talk was along the backstory of the character, and kind of the theme he is following, and how path of conquest would fit him really well. I'd also point out that while the fear aura at lvl 8 is a big draw, I'd also be getting a fighting style, aura of protection, aura of courage, immunity to disease, healing options, and depending on where I put the divide a few other things. But I get your point, it's part of the reason I'm undecided about multiclassing. Also divine smite and eldritch smite aren't mutually exclusive...which means if I really really need to want to make something unalive right the hell now, I can. :)

[Corran]

So, I'm playing a Hexblade, pact of the blade, warlock and had originally planned to stay pure warlock the whole time. However, after some chatting with my DM, the idea of maybe multiclassing into paladin, path of conquest, has taken hold. So I'm looking for advice on whether I should multiclass into paladin, and if I do what level split would be optimal.

For some background, I'm already a lvl 6 Warlock, I'm taking GWM, Polearm Mastery, and Elven Accuracy, and my DM is willing to let me trade out invocations and spells when I level up as a paladin as if I'd taken a level in Warlock. AKA I can drop thirsting blade when I get extra attack, or armor of agathys from my warlock spells known when I get it as conquest. I'm also the front line combatant of the group.
I wouldn't do it.
I might consider 3 levels of sorcerer though. Not sure if it's worth it, but there are certainly some benefits I would appreciate: Four 1st and two 2nd level spell slots (with which I can use spells like shield, ie useful low level spells but without having to expend a high level spell slot for them). Also, sorcery points, namely quicken. With GWM in play, quickening a self buff (btw, boost your concentration) instead of spending an action on it is a big deal, because if you take feats with the aim of improving your attack action, then you don't want to spend actions for anything but attacking often. So yeah, 3 sorcerer levels would give you some good benefits, once we take into account the character build you are aiming for (melee dpr/tank).

[MaxWilson]

@Man_Over_Game - I was hoping to pick up Elven accuracy and the +1 charisma before the switch over, which would require me to reach level 8 first. Would it still be advisable to switch immediately if it puts that off until character lvl 10?

@MaxWilson - The talk was along the backstory of the character, and kind of the theme he is following, and how path of conquest would fit him really well. I'd also point out that while the fear aura at lvl 8 is a big draw, I'd also be getting a fighting style, aura of protection, aura of courage, immunity to disease, healing options, and depending on where I put the divide a few other things.

Yep, and also some pretty nifty paladin spells including Wrathful Smite and Find Steed, and spell slots with which to use them. (But you already have Wrathful Smite access as a Hexblade.) I agree that it wouldn't be a total waste, and I understand why you're tempted, I just think the opportunity cost is too high.

Corran's suggestion of Sorcerer might tempt me though, especially Shadow Soul or Divine Soul (either one could work with the Darth Vader vibe you're apparently going for). Especially, the idea of having some nice low-level slots for Hex/Shield/Wrathful Smite/etc. would tempt me. The downside is that I'd delay access to True Polymorph, but depending on the campaign that might or might not be a realistic expectation anyway.

I'm interested to know what you eventually decide and how things work out.

[Keravath]

It's worth considering since paladin offers a lot. There are a number of factors to take into account.

1) Does your hexblade have the minimum 13 strength required to multiclass into paladin? A lot of hexblade builds dump strength since they want 14 dex, 14 to 16 con and high charisma.

2) You mention PAM, GWM and elven accuracy. At level 6 it sounds like you have either PAM or GWM and have a 17 in charisma so that Elven Accuracy at 8 makes sense. (Did you roll stats or use point buy or something else?)

3) I personally think Eldritch Smite is a trap since until level 11 you only have 2 spell slots and one of those is likely being used every combat for something useful (like Shadow of Moil which you get a level 7 or darkness if you have devils sight)

4) Paladin offers the following
- additional spell slots (very useful for a warlock - casting shield/hex and other lower level spells with these saves your warlock slots for the big spells)
- access to healing spells, bless, and other party support
- lay on hands to cure wounds and disease
- Divine smite at level 2 (which can use the warlock slots if you like ... warlock smites can only use warlock slots)
- Aura at level 6 to help with saving throws - very useful as you get to higher levels.

One common level split is 6 paladin/14 warlock (or 7/13). Usually folks would do all paladin first but if you switch over at level 8 the aura will come online at level 14 and you won't be delaying your ASI. Another split would be 11 paladin/9 warlock which gets improved divine smite on the paladin side which works well with PAM and extra attack.

What are you giving up? High level warlock abilities ... 4 slots/short rest and mystic arcanums. Mystic arcanums are 1/day high level spells but if you are melee focused then they are probably not as important. You will probably want to take warlock until 12th level for the lifedrinker invocation.

Anyway, it sounds like it may be as much a role play question than a mechanics one so I would go with whichever you think you will find more fun to play.

[MaxWilson]

3) I personally think Eldritch Smite is a trap since until level 11 you only have 2 spell slots and one of those is likely being used every combat for something useful (like Shadow of Moil which you get a level 7 or darkness if you have devils sight)

I agree, but I think Divine Smite is usually a trap too. But people love what they love, and if e.g. doing 50 damage in one round from Divine Smite while taking 20 points of damage in return is more fun to you than doing 100 points of damage total over three rounds while taking only 15 damage total because of Darkness, then Eldritch/Divine Smite may be a good choice. Especially if you don't trust your fellow PCs to avoid getting killed on round 2.

[Vastly]

I wouldn't do it.
I might consider 3 levels of sorcerer though. Not sure if it's worth it, but there are certainly some benefits I would appreciate: Four 1st and two 2nd level spell slots (with which I can use spells like shield, ie useful low level spells but without having to expend a high level spell slot for them). Also, sorcery points, namely quicken. With GWM in play, quickening a self buff (btw, boost your concentration) instead of spending an action on it is a big deal, because if you take feats with the aim of improving your attack action, then you don't want to spend actions for anything but attacking often. So yeah, 3 sorcerer levels would give you some good benefits, once we take into account the character build you are aiming for (melee dpr/tank).

I hadn't even considered sorcerer, that's definitely worth a look. Thanks :)

[Vastly]

It's worth considering since paladin offers a lot. There are a number of factors to take into account.

1) Does your hexblade have the minimum 13 strength required to multiclass into paladin? A lot of hexblade builds dump strength since they want 14 dex, 14 to 16 con and high charisma.

2) You mention PAM, GWM and elven accuracy. At level 6 it sounds like you have either PAM or GWM and have a 17 in charisma so that Elven Accuracy at 8 makes sense. (Did you roll stats or use point buy or something else?)

3) I personally think Eldritch Smite is a trap since until level 11 you only have 2 spell slots and one of those is likely being used every combat for something useful (like Shadow of Moil which you get a level 7 or darkness if you have devils sight)

One common level split is 6 paladin/14 warlock (or 7/13). Usually folks would do all paladin first but if you switch over at level 8 the aura will come online at level 14 and you won't be delaying your ASI. Another split would be 11 paladin/9 warlock which gets improved divine smite on the paladin side which works well with PAM and extra attack.

Anyway, it sounds like it may be as much a role play question than a mechanics one so I would go with whichever you think you will find more fun to play.

1) I don't have 13 str, but DM has already said he's waiving the requirement if I choose to do so

2) We used standard array, my least favorite, and you are correct, I have GWM, and I'm aiming for Elven accuracy + 18 Cha with the level 8 ASI.

3) Divine Smite and Eldritch Smite are both traps, and the best thing you can do in the right situation. If you get a critical hit, and you really need to make sure this thing dies, right now, then throwing in a divine smite and/or eldritch smite is a solid choice. But otherwise yea, trap!

I was thinking either 11P/9W, 6P/14W, or 8P/12W if I did multiclass. And you are right it is a roleplay question as much as it is a mechanics, I think I can make it work RP wise regardless, so I'd like to make sure mechanically I'm not shooting myself in the foot. I appreciate the feedback

[Vastly]

Yep, and also some pretty nifty paladin spells including Wrathful Smite and Find Steed, and spell slots with which to use them. (But you already have Wrathful Smite access as a Hexblade.) I agree that it wouldn't be a total waste, and I understand why you're tempted, I just think the opportunity cost is too high.

Corran's suggestion of Sorcerer might tempt me though, especially Shadow Soul or Divine Soul (either one could work with the Darth Vader vibe you're apparently going for). Especially, the idea of having some nice low-level slots for Hex/Shield/Wrathful Smite/etc. would tempt me. The downside is that I'd delay access to True Polymorph, but depending on the campaign that might or might not be a realistic expectation anyway.

I'm interested to know what you eventually decide and how things work out.

Darth Vader vibe is pretty close, and I definitely will let you know what I decide, if I can make up my damn mind lol