how to obtain a demon's heart

[lunatron]

I'm playing a Vengeance Paladin who has been tasked with obtaining a demon's heart as a spell component by his guild. He doesn't really have any moral objections to killing a creature that is always chaotic evil and will always be inclined to cause suffering to others. He has proficiency in Survival, which the DM treats as being able to field-dress wild game we kill, so I think he would be able to cut out a heart.

The party wizard insists that we have to go to the Abyss to do this, because if we kill a demon on the material plane, it will poof back to the Abyss, and we won't be able to harvest the heart.

We have two semi-regular level 14 clerics, so in theory, one cleric could Plane Shift us to the Abyss and another could Plane Shift us back once we have the demon heart. The issue that the wizard raises is that, if we do that, we could end up somewhere terrible in the Abyss and get gang-beat and die.

The other thought was that we could just take a demon alive, vivisect out its heart, and try to use a living semi-vivisected demon as a spell component, but that seems cruel and unusual, and I am fairly sure that would violate my Chaotic Good alignment. Torture is torture, even if I'm torturing a demon.

Also, the party is perpetually broke-ish, because the DM will give us like 25 gold for fighting 9 archmages. (We're all having fun, don't worry. I'm just trying to say, "Buy it," is not a great option.)

So,
1) Suggestions on how to obtain a demon's heart in a reasonable and fiscally sound fashion?
2) If we have to go to the Abyss, suggestions on how to make this safer?

Side questions:
We also need to find 5 lbs of adamantium and a 10,000 gp diamond. Should be just... go mining for this? IDK. I wish we had a dwarf.

Thank you.

[Unoriginal]

Your character got tricked. You can't get a demon's heart, a demon's body dissolves into its primordial evil upon death, even if said death happens in the Abyss.


Now, if the demon is alive, the heart is present. So you could just get a summoned Quasit and both you and the demon will be fine.

Important clerics should have this much diamond, and the adamantine is rare but 5lbs isn't that expensive.

[Sigreid]

So, maybe this is not meant to be taken literally. I'm not really joking when I say try flowers and chocolate and sweet words of devotion.

[Unoriginal]

So, maybe this is not meant to be taken literally. I'm not really joking when I say try flowers and chocolate and sweet words of devotion.

Well metaphorically, the demon's heart is... the demon itself. Each demon think the whole universe revolve around it.

[Sigreid]

Well metaphorically, the demon's heart is... the demon itself. Each demon think the whole universe revolve around it.

Shhh! I want to see a paladin try to win a demon's true love! :smallbiggrin:

Still, it would semantically meet the criteria.

[Damon_Tor]

The party wizard insists that we have to go to the Abyss to do this, because if we kill a demon on the material plane, it will poof back to the Abyss, and we won't be able to harvest the heart.

Summon the demon, incapacitate it (don't kill it) then put Dimensional Shackles on it. Once the shackles are on, you are free to kill it: there's nothing in the entry for the shackles that implies they would stop working when the shackled creature dies. You should be able to harvest the heart, but the demon's body will have to remain shackled until the heart is used for the ritual. Hope you have a nice big chest freezer.

[Unoriginal]

Summon the demon, incapacitate it (don't kill it) then put Dimensional Shackles on it. Once the shackles are on, you are free to kill it: there's nothing in the entry for the shackles that implies they would stop working when the shackled creature dies. You should be able to harvest the heart, but the demon's body will have to remain shackled until the heart is used for the ritual. Hope you have a nice big chest freezer.

The whole body of the demon dissolves upon death, always. Even if trapped in a specific dimension.

[Son of A Lich!]

Honestly, I think this is a good case for the Ritual spell Ceremony.

Of course, getting a demon to manifest in the material realm would be tricky, but not impossible. I'd involve some gimmicks like needing it's true name to keep it from dissolving into the abyss, and the bulk of the Ceremony itself is about the removing of the heart from the demon as an entity, as well as physically taking the heart out of it's cavity.

From there it would be a very unorthodox combat encounter. Think less "Surgery" and more "Exorcist". Keep him down, demons flooding in to corrupt the practitioners, needing a reliable source of damage from the Melee brawlers to cut it out, caustic acidic blood spraying out all over the place, and healers needing to keep the demon alive while the heart is removed.

That's how I would run it, at least.

[Max_Killjoy]

So, maybe this is not meant to be taken literally. I'm not really joking when I say try flowers and chocolate and sweet words of devotion.

You beat me to it, that's the first thing I thought of when I read the thread title.

:smallamused:

[No brains]

If it doesn't have a listed price, you can find it in a spell component pouch.

Isn't there a demon that is a disembodied heart?

Though they are not part of the 'demon' entry in the monster manual, how could a succubus, cambion, or tiefling count? In fact, you would do well to clarify if it must be a specific demon, any demon, any fiend, or any figurative demon. The devil's in the demon details.

[Ganymede]

Your character got tricked. You can't get a demon's heart, a demon's body dissolves into its primordial evil upon death, even if said death happens in the Abyss.

Monster Manual descriptions are meant to inspire adventure hooks, not eliminate them.

"Naturally, you can do with these monsters what you will. Nothing we say here is intended to curtail your creativity. If the minotaurs in your world are shipbuilders and pirates, who are we to argue with you? It's your world, after all." - Monster Manual, Pg. 4

[GreyBlack]

Here's how you do it.

1) Deal subdual damage to the demon until it falls unconscious. DO NOT DEAL LETHAL DAMAGE TO IT.

2) Make sure you have a character with a healer/surgical kit available, and make sure someone has Regeneration prepared.

3) surgically open the demon and remove the heart. Simultaneously, have your person cast Regeneration on the demon.

4) Continue casting cure/stabilize spells on the demon until the heart fully regenerates.

Ta da! The demon didn't die and you got its heart. Now just make sure the demon doesn't die until you use the spell component.

[JackPhoenix]

Monster Manual descriptions are meant to inspire adventure hooks, not eliminate them.

"Naturally, you can do with these monsters what you will. Nothing we say here is intended to curtail your creativity. If the minotaurs in your world are shipbuilders and pirates, who are we to argue with you? It's your world, after all." - Monster Manual, Pg. 4

And it does that. You'll have to be really creative to obtain demon's heart, you can't just find any random demon and start stabbing.

[krugaan]

or, you know, just restrain the demon.

"What's this?"

"It's a demon heart. And demon bones, demon horns, demon skin, demon flesh, demon brains, demon blood..."

[Unoriginal]

Monster Manual descriptions are meant to inspire adventure hooks, not eliminate them.

"Naturally, you can do with these monsters what you will. Nothing we say here is intended to curtail your creativity. If the minotaurs in your world are shipbuilders and pirates, who are we to argue with you? It's your world, after all." - Monster Manual, Pg. 4

Limitations help inspiration. Otherwise you can do whatever and it works.

I've already written a way to get the needed component while following the lore.

[lunatron]

Your character got tricked. You can't get a demon's heart, a demon's body dissolves into its primordial evil upon death, even if said death happens in the Abyss.

Now, if the demon is alive, the heart is present. So you could just get a summoned Quasit and both you and the demon will be fine.

Important clerics should have this much diamond, and the adamantine is rare but 5lbs isn't that expensive.

Good point, but I suspect the DM just didn’t think about that, so I kind of don’t want to point it out to him. ;)

Now, with regards to the summoned Quasit, I would still need to vivisect out the heart and try to then attach the still-living heart, with the still-living Quasit to a helmet, and that seems like a bad plan… (Also requires someone who can summon a quasit, and we don’t actually know anyone who can.)



So, maybe this is not meant to be taken literally. I'm not really joking when I say try flowers and chocolate and sweet words of devotion.

Knowing the DM, I’m pretty sure he wants us to Go Kill A Thing. He’s that kind of DM.

That, and plenty have people have already done the paladin/demon romance. Tales of Wyre comes to mind: http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?58227-Tales-of-Wyre



If it doesn't have a listed price, you can find it in a spell component pouch.

Isn't there a demon that is a disembodied heart?

Though they are not part of the 'demon' entry in the monster manual, how could a succubus, cambion, or tiefling count? In fact, you would do well to clarify if it must be a specific demon, any demon, any fiend, or any figurative demon. The devil's in the demon details.

1) Tieflings are generally part-devil, not part-demon, Abyssal Tieflings aside. 2) My character is a tiefling. I don’t think he cares enough about this spell to commit suicide over it.

We did clarify, though, if we could just go gank something small like a cackler, and the DM said no.



Here's how you do it.

1) Deal subdual damage to the demon until it falls unconscious. DO NOT DEAL LETHAL DAMAGE TO IT.

2) Make sure you have a character with a healer/surgical kit available, and make sure someone has Regeneration prepared.

3) surgically open the demon and remove the heart. Simultaneously, have your person cast Regeneration on the demon.

4) Continue casting cure/stabilize spells on the demon until the heart fully regenerates.

Ta da! The demon didn't die and you got its heart. Now just make sure the demon doesn't die until you use the spell component.

See, that’s something I’ve been wondering about. If you do a heart transplant on a demon, the demon isn’t dead…


Main points seem to be thus far:

1) Can’t be done, due to dissolving into Abyss goo. -> Clarify with DM his exact lore for his setting.
2) Seduce demon. -> Uh, maybe? Between a 20 Cha and proficiency in Persuasion, I could probably do it…
3) Just drag whole live demon there. -> Seems kind of mean.
4) Get creative with Shackles/Ceremony/Regeneration. -> I need to go back to 1) Clarify with DM his exact lore for his setting.