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andarkelben
2019-03-09, 12:34 PM
I've been playing around with a homebrew archetype for the rogue class. The idea is to have a rogue, that functions more as a combat support class, capable of cc and control. It's loosely based on the Swashbuckler, Thief and Scout archetypes, with some of the feats reworded. Please have a look and see what you think. Is this going to be too OP, or not?!? Any input is welcome:
- Keep in mind this is ment to be a controller/support type of rogue!
- This is my 3rd revision of the controller rogue. I've added and "Analyze function, to make it more interesting.
Changed the formula for dex saves.

5E Homebrew Rogue “Controller” Archetype

You focus your training on speed in combat. You understand that the ability to control the course of combat is a valuable tool, both for you and your allies. As a Controller, you focus on rendering your enemies unable to fight, so your allies may help you take them down.

Analyze (Homebrew)
Starting at lvl 3, you gain the ability to analyze your enemies actions in combat. You may spend a bonus action, following an attack (does not need to hit), analyzing the target you just attacked, giving the target the “Analyzed” status. Once analyzed, the target remains analyzed for the remainder of the fight, or until you lose sight of the target.


Sand in their eyes (Homebrew)
At level 3 you gain the ability to throw sand in the eyes of your foe. Once per turn, during a movement, you may pick up some sand or dust, at the cost of 10 speed. You may then use your action, to throw the sand in the eyes of any foe, within 10 feet. The foe must make a dex save vs. (DC 8 + proficiency bonus + your dex bonus), to try and duck. Failing this, the foe becomes blinded and must either fight blinded or expend a normal action at the beginning of their turn, to rub the sand out of their eyes.
-If the target has been “Analyzed” they have disadvantage on their saving throw.
-If the creature has several heads/faces, this will only apply to one head/face. In the case of beholder-like creatures, you may only target one eye-stalk.
-Can only be used if there’s sand or dust around (GM ruling), otherwise the rogue can carry a small pouch with blinding dust, that he may use on the same conditions.



Strategic Engagement ( Swashbuckler Rakish Audacity edited)
Starting at 3rd level, your ability to quickly plan your approach, allows you to add your int modifier to your initiative rolls. In addition you don’t need advantage on your attack roll to use your sneak attack if no creature, other than your target, is within 5 feet of you. All the other rules for the Sneak Attack class feature still applies to you.
If a target is “Analyzed”, you always have advantage on attack rolls, against said target.



Hamstring (Homebrew)
At level 9 you have perfected the knowledge of general anatomy, to be able to hamstring almost any creature in battle. During your turn, If you hit a creature, that creature must make a str or con save against your (DC 8 + proficiency bonus + your dex bonus) (to either ignore the pain or force themselves to carry on), or lose 10 speed. If the creature is “Analyzed”, you know exactly where to make the cut, and they will lose 20 speed instead. The effect is stackable and will last until the creature performs a long rest or a healing effect is applied to the creature. You cannot slow a creature below 5 speed this way.
At level 13 you learn Improved Hamstring. You may now choose to target an arm. The same saving throw rules apply, but on a successful hit, the target drops whatever it is holding in that arms hand, instead of slowing the creature down.
- Does not apply to undead, ethereal or rock-based creatures.
- If the target is your size +1, they have advantage on their save. “Analyzed” negates this advantage.
- If the target is your size +2, they have advantage and may add 5 to their save. “Analyzed” negates this advantage, but they may still add 5 to their save.
- If the target is larger than this, you cannot use Hamstring.



Engagement Master (Rogue Scout - Unearthed Arcana edited)
Starting at level 13 you excel at leading engagements. Once per short or long rest, at the beginning of combat, during the initiative roll, you may either;
A. Inspire your allies with your ability to plan the attack, allowing them to add their own proficiency once more, to their initiative roll.
B. Use your speed and keen senses, to baffle a single foe, allowing you to deduct an amount equal to your dex bonus, from their initiative.


Blurred Confusion(Homebrew)
At level 17, once per long rest, you can use a massive burst of speed to blur your movement, thus confusing your enemies.
As an action, you can try to confuse enemies close to you. Any creature within 10 feet of you, that isn’t immune to charm effects, must make a wisdom save, against your (DC 8 + proficiency bonus + your dex bonus). If it fails, the creature is confused for 1 minute, as per the confusion spell (see below). At the end of its turns, it must make a wisdom save against the same DC to end the effect.
If you focus this skill against a single target, that is “Analyzed” you may only confuse that single target, but you also add a standard attack, during the action. You may also add sneak attack bonus, if you still have it this round.

Confusion (Standard spell)
An affected target can't take reactions and must roll a d10 at the start of each of its turns to determine its behavior for that turn.

1: The creature uses all its Movement to move in a random direction. To determine the direction, roll a d8 and assign a direction to each die face. The creature doesn't take an action this turn.

2-6: The creature doesn't move or take Actions this turn.

7-8: The creature uses its action to make a melee Attack against a randomly determined creature within its reach. If there is no creature within its reach, the creature does nothing this turn.

9-10: The creature can act and move normally.

At the end of its turns, an affected target can make a Wisdom saving throw. If it succeeds, this effect ends for that target.

Yddisac
2019-03-09, 08:41 PM
Quick rundown time.

Fancy Footwork: Hrm, no, this is just the Mobile feat. Classes generally shouldn't be in the habit of giving out specific feats (or else there's no reason to take the feat). It's not very good for a rogue, anyway, since rogues can just disengage with their cunning actions anyway.

Lightning Audacity: Adding 50% of the Dex modifier is more math than 5e wants to worry about (besides, would you round up or down?). I'd consider either adding a secondary ability score (probably Int, since this is a very strategic archetype) to initiative as well as Dex. There's also the option of a flat +5 like Alert gives, but then I'd worry about someone with Alert and this class.
The other feature is fine, of course, since it's right off the Swashbuckler. Does a controller rogue need it, though? I feel like the usual conditions of "work with your allies or get advantage" are fine for a control-based rogue to work with.

Lockdown: Now this is cool and interesting. No save on this could be problematic, but with some restrictions (Sneak Attacks only? Int mod per rest? Str/Dex save to resist?) it could be real nice. I'd consider giving out a variation of it earlier in the class, though, maybe replacing Fancy Footwork. As it is, this controller rogue doesn't get to do any controlling until 9th level; that seems wrong.

Ambush Master: Interesting, but potentially overcomplicated. Maybe just 1/day give allies a bonus on initiative equal to your Int? and don't worry about them going before you, 'cuz then if you roll poorly they get nothing. Also, this isn't really a control ability so much as a "support your allies" type of ability.

Thief's Reflexes: Has nothing to do with control, and in fact seems better for burst damage-dealing.

Overall: This is a promising concept, but right now, the 'control' elements are limited to Lockdown. I'd focus on what exactly you want this rogue to do to control where their enemies can and can't go, so this becomes a true controller instead of a variant swashbuckler. There are a number of cool options at your disposal (sand to the eyes, net/bolas work, hamstringing/blinding/poisoned sneak attacks...) and the idea of a control-based rogue is a really good one, so I look forward to seeing where this goes.

andarkelben
2019-03-10, 05:04 AM
Quick rundown time.

Fancy Footwork: Hrm, no, this is just the Mobile feat. Classes generally shouldn't be in the habit of giving out specific feats (or else there's no reason to take the feat). It's not very good for a rogue, anyway, since rogues can just disengage with their cunning actions anyway.

Lightning Audacity: Adding 50% of the Dex modifier is more math than 5e wants to worry about (besides, would you round up or down?). I'd consider either adding a secondary ability score (probably Int, since this is a very strategic archetype) to initiative as well as Dex. There's also the option of a flat +5 like Alert gives, but then I'd worry about someone with Alert and this class.
The other feature is fine, of course, since it's right off the Swashbuckler. Does a controller rogue need it, though? I feel like the usual conditions of "work with your allies or get advantage" are fine for a control-based rogue to work with.

Lockdown: Now this is cool and interesting. No save on this could be problematic, but with some restrictions (Sneak Attacks only? Int mod per rest? Str/Dex save to resist?) it could be real nice. I'd consider giving out a variation of it earlier in the class, though, maybe replacing Fancy Footwork. As it is, this controller rogue doesn't get to do any controlling until 9th level; that seems wrong.

Ambush Master: Interesting, but potentially overcomplicated. Maybe just 1/day give allies a bonus on initiative equal to your Int? and don't worry about them going before you, 'cuz then if you roll poorly they get nothing. Also, this isn't really a control ability so much as a "support your allies" type of ability.

Thief's Reflexes: Has nothing to do with control, and in fact seems better for burst damage-dealing.

Overall: This is a promising concept, but right now, the 'control' elements are limited to Lockdown. I'd focus on what exactly you want this rogue to do to control where their enemies can and can't go, so this becomes a true controller instead of a variant swashbuckler. There are a number of cool options at your disposal (sand to the eyes, net/bolas work, hamstringing/blinding/poisoned sneak attacks...) and the idea of a control-based rogue is a really good one, so I look forward to seeing where this goes.

First of all, thanks for your brilliant input. I've taken a lot of it into consideration, and created a second version of my Controller rogue. I especially like your idea of Sand in The Eyes, and have added it early, as per your suggestion, that it took too long for this rogue to become a controller. I also swapped Thief's Reflexes for a much more control-oriented skill.

I've replaced the archetype in my original post, so please take a look, and see what you think now. :smallsmile: