Gloomstalker vs Monster Slayer:help choose

[furby076]

Hey all

In the campaign i play at, we have a lvl 7 group. During this play, we came in command of a squad of lvl 1 characters. Once in a while, we will hop and play their perspectives changing them from npc to pc. They were handed out to us randomly, and i got a half elf ranger. She is the highest rank of the squad (think corporal vs private in the army) so is the squad leader. She just hit lvl 4 and the DM said we can change them however we like except: must keep race and class and alignment (NG)

We can reareange stats, basic equipment (she just found ring of xray vision).
Stats: 16, 16, 14, 10, 12, 10 for now.

I was thinking gloomstalker or monster slayer.

Not sure if i should go with archery or twf fight style.

We do combo of forest, hills/mountains(fav terrain) and underground/dungeon delving.
We fight combo of humanoids and monsters (fav enemy humans and goblins)

So, what do you guys think i should do?

Gloom stalker or monster slayer?
Stat order?
Archery or twf (or bladesong?)
Feat or asi? (If archery i presume elven archery)


Edit: other party members equal: 2 fighters, 1 cleric, and another ranger (bow user).

Thanks all

[Man_Over_Game]

Gloomstalker is a stealth specialist. Due to the fact that it gains an additional attack at the start of combat, it's best used with ranged attacks that will guarantee a chance to make your attack (but it can do fine with TWF).

Monster Slayer is a support/utility specialist. Due to the fact that all of their benefits can work at long range (including attacking as a reaction!) they're best used with ranged attacks to make the most of their abilities and Concentration.

The Gloomstalker is the choice if your Wisdom is low, as you'll just be spamming Hunter's Mark and not much else. Monster Slayer rewards high-wisdom characters very well, so if you're willing to have slightly less combat effectiveness by yourself, they're a great choice.

For TWF, I'd recommend going Hunter or Gloomstalker. Sword-and-shield is my recommendation for Horizon Walker. Archery for everything else.


As to stats, you need to decide which route you're going: Assassin or Support.

If you're going the Gloomstalker (Assassin) route, then you'll want a higher Constitution, as you'll probably want the option of being a melee combatant as needed.

If you're going Monster Slayer (Support) route, then pump your second 16 stat into Wisdom, especially if going Archery.

[Keravath]

If you have a party that can rely on darkvision then the Gloomstalker has the added advantage of being invisible when fighting in the darkness against creatures that use darkvision. This gives them advantage on all their attacks. In addition since an elf already has 60' darkvision, gloomstalker will give the elf an additional 30' for a total of 90' darkvision.

You also add your wisdom modifier to initiative.

If you combine this with some levels of rogue for bonus action hide and expertise in stealth then this becomes an extremely able scout in dark places.

Go ranged with the archery fighting style. Take sharpshooter as a feat. Put 16 into dex and wisdom. 14 in constitution, the rest to taste. At level 7, the gloomstalker gains proficiency in wisdom saving throws which can be very important if you will play to high levels.

Off-topic: One of my favorite gloomstalker builds is variant human taking the resilient constitution feat to start. By 7th level they are proficient in all three major saving throws.

I find the Gloomstalker to be a bit more interesting than the monster slayer. Gloomstalker only gets one additional attack at the beginning of combat which can do an additional d8 of damage ... which would be 2d8+mod ... if you reach 20 dex this would be 2d8+5 ... average on a d8 is 4.5 ... so about 3d8 which is about the same as Collossus slayer would do over 3 rounds of combat ... but all upfront in the first round. If you combine this with the Assassin Rogue feature giving them advantage in the first round against creatures that haven't yet taken a turn then the attack stands a much better chance of hitting.

[stoutstien]

I look at gloomstalker kind of like the champion fighter of the rangers. Powerful, efficient, and straightforward.
Monster Slayer is slower to get going but i actually believe it's a much stronger concave.
Slayer prey seems like a weaker hunters mark but not being a spell means you can have it up constantly while concentrating on another spell.

Sure gloomstalker is get wisdom proficiency but Slayer gets 1d6 on every save and grapple checks. Static bonuses like this are extremely rare.

I do think gloomstalker expanded spell list is much better until Slayer gets magic circle and banishment.

*Forgot to mention hunters sense could be a huge game changer if your DM uses lots of custom npcs

[djreynolds]

Gloom stalker is great, but let's look at monster slayer.

Being able to size up a foe, might make your tactics more effective, obviously IRL, we as players know the monster manual.

Also that protection from evil spell can be casted on anyone, while you hang back with your bow and direct troops.

I really like the concept, what about a spellless ranger? Maybe snag the inspiring leader feat or healer feat

[CTurbo]

Personally the Monster Slayer and Horizon Walker have absolutely nothing of interest for me. The Gloom Stalker on the other hand, while a lot of it's features are straightforward and even boring, they are very effective. I think it's an extremely strong subclass. Easy decision for me.

[furby076]

You guys make good arguments for both, and both Monster Slayer and Gloomstalker sound awesome as you all describe it. Which leaves me in the middle again haha :)

So, in the past I played an ancients paladin, so used to being the tank who does great damage. I retired him for my current character which is a mystic.


Ack, confused.

[furby076]

OK...I'll go in Gloomstalker

Str 10, Dex 16, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12

Fight Style: TWF
Weapons: Scimitar x2, Longbow
Armor: Studded Leather
Magic Item: Ring of X-Ray vision

Now, for ASI...should I do +dex or get a feat? What feat?

I'll stick with ranger until 5th, then take a level of rogue at 6th for sneak attack

[djreynolds]

AFB, but I'm unsure if gloomstalkers initiative bonus stacks eith swashbuckler.

But if they do, and you tweaked your charisma. You basically add dex, wiz, and chr to initiative.

Also fancy footwork would be nice on a melee ranger

Good luck

I like the campaign idea

[CTurbo]

I'd take at least 5 if not 7 levels of Rogue. Gloom Stalker pairs excellently with Assassin, Scout, or Swashbuckler.