Concerns Playing the Character I Want [Advice Wanted]

[papertoadette]

TL;DR: I have two characters because of plot. Now I’m contemplating how my characters interact with the party, and I’m scared of not being able to play the character I want to.

So I've been playing a homebrew campaign (5e) and I've ran into trouble. My first character and the one I'm invested in was forced to run away from a very bad situation and is currently off on her own doing things because the party was forced to abandon the town by the DM (legit thrown into a circle)

Before that game I was allowed to make a character in case the party couldn't find my Cleric (and so that I wouldn't be sitting at the table bored. Well this new character is actually getting along with the party and what started out as a joke character, became a powerhouse accidentally.

Now I've grown attached to both characters (cause I put 100% effort into my characters, backstories, and even portraits) and the DM and Myself have agreed that my Cleric will get one shots and if those are successful that it will help the party against the big bad climatic battle, and my Cleric can rejoins the group during the fight. (It's also to avoid me having to play two characters at once, except for the climatic battle)

But now I'm worried about what happens when the party reunites with my Cleric, two of the party members did something pretty bad to her (one was giddy (from my character’s point of view) as my Cleric was being drained from a vampire (who is also the giddy vampire's mother) and the another member of the party had told the vampire to do it right after they were about to leave the roleplay situation unharmed) All and all, it sucked for me both in and out of game, and tears were shed. It was a situation where the DM had told me I couldn't do anything (even though the effects of a Charm spell should of worn off after I was attacked the first time, which I brought up, but was told that this was different purely as this was a boss character)

In addition, when I play as the joke character, I end up being able to do a lot more then my Cleric, mostly because 2 of the party are undead and therefore my Cleric can’t really heal them.

My Cleric is only really good in roleplay situations, which she doesn’t get to do because half of the party is nocturnal, shops are not normally open at night (which also means my character can’t buy anything). But during the one shots, by putting the focus on my character, it gives her the chance to develop as a character, rather then be outshined by the other party members. (Note: She is a 6 year old Kenku child, who for some reason is an ordained minister)

I know I want to keep playing as my Cleric, I’ve put so much time into developing her (she's like my child) and she’s grown a lot during the one shots. But as a party member, she’s often not able to take any sort of spotlight combat or roleplaying wise, I feel like she's an accessory. She had one instance where she could use her Spiritual Weapon in a wall of force to beat up the people trapped. But I’ve also watched another party member destroy a 10 person encounter (with characters built to handle that one character) single handedly (and we are the same level).

I’ve brought up all my concerns to the DM, and we’ve agreed that the oneshot format would be best for now for my Cleric, but I’m worried about what will happen when the party reunited. I don't want to play my literal joke character (she reloads her crossbow using a Bra of Holding) forever, even if she is better combat wise due to shear tom-foolery.

Can I get any advice on this?

[Unoriginal]

Have you talked with the other players about it? If yes, what did they say?

[Man_Over_Game]

Consider talking to your DM about how your Cleric goes through a change, one that meshes well with the group. Perhaps the Cleric sacrifices part of their soul to gain a favor from a patron to save a city, and becomes a Warlock. Or perhaps they die and are brought back as an undead Paladin as a Divine Intervention effect to continue bringing light to the darkness.

As a DM who'd see this exact problem, I would pull some strings to make it happen. Rather than doing a series of one-shot scenarios to lead up to that point, I'd just do a sort of cutscene description (with you jumping in to describe how your character solves problems) for a number-less way of proceeding through major events that lead up to the change. That way, the changes happen quickly and you can get back to having fun with your Cleric with everyone else.

[papertoadette]

Have you talked with the other players about it? If yes, what did they say?

One of the players doesn't believe that their character is over powered, which is one of the issues with the table, and has sold their soul to 3 different entities to gain power.


As for Man_Over_Game's question, death is different in this game. Once you go beyond the divine gate, you cannot be resurrected. (which is how one player is undead now, because he did some tom-foolery and only came back part of ones self)
The one-shots also give my cleric the chance to catch up, she just recently turned level 8, and half of the party is now about to hit level 9. And my other character also really trailing behind because the XP different was a result of me and another player joining recently.

However, the DM doesn't know how many sessions it's going to take to get to the climatic battle, and we do have an in game calendar and we know how the events of the party, and the events of my cleric are aligning.

[Man_Over_Game]

One of the players doesn't believe that their character is over powered, which is one of the issues with the table, and has sold their soul to 3 different entities to gain power.


As for Man_Over_Game's question, death is different in this game. Once you go beyond the divine gate, you cannot be resurrected. (which is how one player is undead now, because he did some tom-foolery and only came back part of ones self)
The one-shots also give my cleric the chance to catch up, she just recently turned level 8, and half of the party is now about to hit level 9. And my other character also really trailing behind because the XP different was a result of me and another player joining recently.

However, the DM doesn't know how many sessions it's going to take to get to the climatic battle, and we do have an in game calendar and we know how the events of the party, and the events of my cleric are aligning.

What's the matter with Divine Intervention doing the same thing? Perhaps the power is beyond that of normal magic, which is why you're resurrected as an undead in a class with less magic (as part of your magic was consumed/changed in the process) and your divine link was severed. They're Gods, and the DM is THE God in a world of Gods.

But in the end, it doesn't matter what the narrative is. There's no excuse for someone not having fun in a Role Playing GAME.

[papertoadette]

What's the matter with Divine Intervention doing the same thing? Perhaps the power is beyond that of normal magic, which is why you're resurrected as a class with less magic (as part of your magic was consumed/changed in the process) and your divine link was severed. They're Gods, and the DM is THE God in a world of Gods.

It doesn't matter what the narrative is. There's no excuse for someone not having fun in a Role Playing GAME.

I am having fun. I just get so emotionally invested in my characters that it's difficult. This campaign has been one that has been going on for years, and the DM has set rules in place regarding death and resurrection. It's how one player couldn't be resurrected. And to change that now just because of my character would seem unfair to the other player. (Also my Cleric isn't leveled enough to have Divine Intervention, though her god does visit her alot in her sleep and the waking world [and apparently isn't the only thing that can do that])

And it wouldn't make sense for my character to suddenly disavow her faith. I wanted to play a cleric.

[Man_Over_Game]

I am having fun. I just get so emotionally invested in my characters that it's difficult. This campaign has been one that has been going on for years, and the DM has set rules in place regarding death and resurrection. It's how one player couldn't be resurrected. And to change that now just because of my character would seem unfair to the other player. (Also my Cleric isn't leveled enough to have Divine Intervention, though her god does visit her alot in her sleep and the waking world [and apparently isn't the only thing that can do that])

And it wouldn't make sense for my character to suddenly disavow her faith. I wanted to play a cleric.

It doesn't matter what your faith is. Faith doesn't always make a Cleric.

For example, Ao is effectively the Boss of Gods. He is very real, very powerful, has clerics, and...gives no divine power. His "Clerics" are mundane folk. Philosophers, rogues, historians. People who know about the Gods' treacheries and wish to learn from the past's mistakes, and despite not gaining any power, they are as devoted to him as any magical Cleric.

It doesn't have to be a true "death". One of your players has already proven that loopholes exist, and Gods are fairly all-powerful and all-knowing. I doubt that similar loopholes are unknown to them.

You, in your HEART, may still want to be a Cleric, but that might not mean you always have Divine Magic, or what you had before. I'm not saying this has to be the route you go, but this is a solution to your problems while keeping your character's personality intact.

[papertoadette]

It doesn't matter what your faith is. Faith doesn't always make a Cleric.

For example, Ao is effectively the Boss of Gods. He is very real, very powerful, has clerics, and...gives no divine power. His "Clerics" are mundane folk. Philosophers, rogues, historians. People who know about the Gods' treacheries and wish to learn from the past's mistakes.

It doesn't have to be a true "death". One of your players has already proven that loopholes exist, and Gods are fairly all-powerful and all-knowing. I doubt that similar loopholes are unknown to them.

You, in your HEART, may still want to be a Cleric, but that might not mean you always have Divine Magic, or what you had before. I'm not saying this has to be the route you go, but this is a solution to your problems while keeping your character's personality intact.

I understand it. (also the player's loophole has seriously ticked off the goddess of death, which ended up in a whole plot on its own) The Gods don't want people to know how to escape death. (It's a plot point as well, and one of the driving forces behind my character is that she wants to travel to the divine plane and back to say goodbye to her mother that she never knew)

I did just come up with the idea that her god could give her the ability to heal undead due to the "power of friendship" or some related hilarity to give her the ability to heal. But the OP party member heals 20 damage per turn on their own. So once again I feel a bit defeated. (Also becoming a warlock or something along those lines would make the party 3 spellcasters and 1 druid rather then 2 spell 1 druid and 1 cleric)

[Man_Over_Game]

I understand it. (also the player's loophole has seriously ticked off the goddess of death, which ended up in a whole plot on its own) The Gods don't want people to know how to escape death. (It's a plot point as well, and one of the driving forces behind my character is that she wants to travel to the divine plane and back to say goodbye to her mother that she never knew)

I did just come up with the idea that her god could give her the ability to heal undead due to the "power of friendship" or some related hilarity to give her the ability to heal. But the OP party member heals 20 damage per turn on their own. So once again I feel a bit defeated. (Also becoming a warlock or something along those lines would make the party 3 spellcasters and 1 druid rather then 2 spell 1 druid and 1 cleric)

Could always make it "pseudo healing". You now heal undead as Temporary Hitpoints, up to their total missing health. Subtract from these THP equal to any healing they gain.

It becomes healing that you are not allowed to frequently use. You can no longer do something like Healing Word on two consecutive turns on the same character without them losing their original healing, and they also cannot benefit from both your healing and Temporary Hitpoints from some other effect (since THP never stacks).

If that's a problem, I'd just remind your DM that Inspiring Leader would probably be a lot more effective.

[papertoadette]

Could always make it "pseudo healing". You now heal undead as Temporary Hitpoints, up to their total missing health. Subtract from these THP equal to any healing they gain.

It becomes healing that you are not allowed to frequently use. You can no longer do something like Healing Word on two consecutive turns on the same character without them losing their original healing, and they also cannot benefit from both your healing and Temporary Hitpoints from some other effect (since THP never stacks).

If that's a problem, I'd just remind your DM that Inspiring Leader would probably be a lot more effective.

That sounds like a great idea, but it doesn't really mitigate the issue of a player being able to heal 20 hp per turn naturally (it's not temp hit points) it would help the other undead in the party however. (The OP character also did something pretty bad in my Cleric's eyes so she might not heal OP character (she could cast sunlight to seriously mess with her too), but that would be an at the table not-so-friendly move and I don't want to be that person)

It just feels like my cleric is useless the more I think about it. She's a Trickery Cleric.

[Man_Over_Game]

That sounds like a great idea, but it doesn't really mitigate the issue of a player being able to heal 20 hp per turn naturally (it's not temp hit points) it would help the other undead in the party however. (The OP character also did something pretty bad in my Cleric's eyes so she might not heal OP character (she could cast sunlight to seriously mess with her too), but that would be an at the table **** move and I don't want to be that person)

It just feels like my cleric is useless the more I think about it. She's a Trickery Cleric.

It feels odd that a DM who is willing to create strict rules on resurrection, undead races, divine powers, and other things, but is unable to find a solution that implements you back in the main campaign.

The DM is allowing his changes to give a player 20 natural HP per turn. That's on him, not you.

Considering your current character is a "joke" character, I'd actually have it be some kind of stand-in put in place by your God. It's a God of Trickery, obviously, so it'd seem to fit perfectly. Rather than playing two separate characters, you're playing two sides of the same coin. Maybe these are things your God put in place to allow both halves to continue down the paths of his design. When the time comes, his false creation (the fool character) reveals itself and exchanges places with your Cleric.

As for the worry about the health gain, healing stacked on healing isn't overpowered. It's redundant. A wasted feature or prepared spell. Similarly, if I give you a magic item that grants you Mage Armor, but only works with Clerics, you'd probably just look at me funny.

[papertoadette]

It feels odd that a DM who is willing to create strict rules on resurrection, undead races, divine powers, and other things, but is unable to find a solution that implements you back in the main campaign.

The DM is allowing his changes to give a player 20 natural HP per turn. That's on him, not you.

Considering your current character is a "joke" character, I'd actually have it be some kind of stand-in put in place by your God. It's a God of Trickery, obviously, so it'd seem to fit perfectly. Rather than playing two separate characters, you're playing two sides of the same coin. Maybe these are things your God put in place to allow both halves to continue down the paths of his design. When the time comes, his false creation (the fool character) reveals itself and exchanges places with your Cleric.

As for the worry about the health gain, healing stacked on healing isn't overpowered. It's redundant. A wasted feature or prepared spell. Similarly, if I give you a magic item that grants you Mage Armor, but only works with Clerics, you'd probably just look at me funny.

That switch-idea would of worked, if a player character didn't role a NAT 20 on their knowledge history check on my joke character and found out all about her actual business. (She was a Noble)

I do plan on having my joke character ride off into the sunset after the climatic battle (cause she has been given a bounty for the big bads at several thousand plat. and she wants to rebuild her family home before going to find the next big thrill) in the style of Jack Burton from Big Trouble in Little China (one of the characters I used as a base for my joke character)

I know that my Cleric WILL return, I'm more afraid of feeling useless or that the table wants me to play the joke character. (I've brought these concerns up to the DM, especially about the power balance and he has admitted his mess ups, and has tried to fix them, with no success) My cleric is kept in the loop of what is going on by the Wizard who gained the spell Sending (and my cleric keeps having strange dreams relating to the plot, and her god is showing her the points in the kingdom that need to be destroyed to help in the final fight)

I've suggested that the magic item that has been making the OP character OP can be cursed by OPs partron (cause the OP has even said outloud in-game that they plan on betraying them to get their soul back)

[Man_Over_Game]

That switch-idea would of worked, if a player character didn't role a NAT 20 on their knowledge history check on my joke character and found out all about her actual business. (She was a Noble)

I do plan on having my joke character ride off into the sunset after the climatic battle (cause she has been given a bounty for the big bads at several thousand plat. and she wants to rebuild her family home before going to find the next big thrill) in the style of Jack Burton from Big Trouble in Little China (one of the characters I used as a base for my joke character)

I'm not sure if you're thinking broad enough when it comes to "Divine Intervention" when dealing with a Trickery God on this part. Modify Memory, as a level 9 spell, can change the memory of someone's mind from any point in time. As in, that's doable by a level 17 Wizard, which is relatively mundane compared to a God with years of planning.

Additionally, not sure if your DM is houseruling on mechanics, but a Nat 20 on a skill roll does nothing other than provide the 20 as any other d20 roll. Criticals are only ever relevant when attacking. Even if he was, the DM could just as easily say that the person in your party is a long-term agent, like a Deva, who uses the business as a front in order to blend in to normal society. I'd very much expect a Trickery God to have a few immortal agents in common clothing, pretending to be village idiots so that nobody pays attention to them while they live for thousands of years. That "line of nobility" is actually the same friggin' person that's existed while occasionally just changing their first name.

Half of DMing is smoke and mirrors. What appears to be a long-con strategy is actually just something we make up on the fly to make the narrative a lot more interesting. How the hell is a player going to know that a trap didn't exist until he rolled a 25 to find one?

[papertoadette]

I'm not sure if you're thinking broad enough when it comes to "Divine Intervention" when dealing with a Trickery God on this part. Modify Memory, as a level 9 spell, can change the memory of someone's mind from any point in time. As in, that's doable by a level 17 Wizard, which is relatively mundane compared to a God with years of planning.

Additionally, not sure if your DM is houseruling on mechanics, but a Nat 20 on a skill roll does nothing other than provide the 20 as any other d20 roll. Criticals are only ever relevant when attacking. Even if he was, the DM could just as easily say that the person in your party is a long-term agent, like a Deva, who uses the business as a front in order to blend in to normal society. I'd very much expect a Trickery God to have a few immortal agents in common clothing, pretending to be idiots so that nobody catches on.

Half of DMing is smoke and mirrors. What appears to be a long-con strategy is actually just something we make up on the fly to make the narrative a lot more interesting. How the hell is a player going to know that a trap didn't exist until he rolled a 25 to find one?

The character that rolled a Nat 20, also has a +14 for the knowledge check. So it was a lot of info. (We do have the houserule where Nat 20s will give you a lot of information where a Nat 19 I don't think wouldn't give you as much. Though I'll have to ask the DM) Modify Memory is a Trickery Cleric domain spell, so I could see how that goes into play.

I'll totally bring up the suggestions to the DM. But for now, I'm just trying to sort through the feelings of feeling useless in a party if I play the character I want to. I don't want to have to attempt to build an OP character to feel useful [In fact the feat I took at 8th level for my Cleric wasn't to make her OP, but to fit the flavor of her character] I accidentally made my joke character super powerful with the starting concept of "I want to reload my crossbow using my bra of holding" and just getting dumber from there.

[Contrast]

But now I'm worried about what happens when the party reunites with my Cleric, two of the party members did something pretty bad to her (one was giddy (from my character’s point of view) as my Cleric was being drained from a vampire (who is also the giddy vampire's mother) and the another member of the party had told the vampire to do it right after they were about to leave the roleplay situation unharmed) All and all, it sucked for me both in and out of game, and tears were shed. It was a situation where the DM had told me I couldn't do anything (even though the effects of a Charm spell should of worn off after I was attacked the first time, which I brought up, but was told that this was different purely as this was a boss character)

Just to say a couple of things here. Firstly, if you're feeling aggrieved here, the vampire stat block legitimately does have a charm effect that makes you a willing target to its bite attack so that may well have been run by the book (or not, I wasn't at the table, who knows :smallbiggrin:).

More importantly though regarding tears being shed in real life, if you're getting this emotionally invested I think its probably a good idea to take a step back and think about player/character separation and if you really want to play at this table. You and your character are different and while its good to be invested its always worth remembering that something bad happening to your character is not something bad happening to you. Some of my favourite moments have been in games when truly terrible things happened to my characters.

Following on from that, from what you've described the atmosphere and themes at the table appear quite...'edgy' is I think the term I'm going to go with (undead, forced vampirism, interparty conflict, etc) which it seems like you're not enjoying both in terms of the gameplay and your interactions with the characters of the other players. There's nothing wrong with just deciding that sort of game isn't for you if you don't enjoy it and finding a game you do enjoy instead (it could even be with the same DM if you're otherwise enjoying the one-shots).

I'm not saying don't play, just make sure you actually do want to play in this game as it kinda sounds like you don't to me.


In addition, when I play as the joke character, I end up being able to do a lot more then my Cleric, mostly because 2 of the party are undead and therefore my Cleric can’t really heal them.

Just to say, if you're playing your cleric primarily as a healer you're selling them a little short. There's plenty that a cleric can do to rock encounters. Many clerics won't casting much/any healing at all outside of Healing Word.

[papertoadette]

Just to say a couple of things here. Firstly, if you're feeling aggrieved here, the vampire stat block legitimately does have a charm effect that makes you a willing target to its bite attack so that may well have been run by the book (or not, I wasn't at the table, who knows :smallbiggrin:).

More importantly though regarding tears being shed in real life, if you're getting this emotionally invested I think its probably a good idea to take a step back and think about player/character separation and if you really want to play at this table. You and your character are different and while its good to be invested its always worth remembering that something bad happening to your character is not something bad happening to you. Some of my favourite moments have been in games when truly terrible things happened to my characters.

Following on from that, from what you've described the atmosphere and themes at the table appear quite...'edgy' is I think the term I'm going to go with (undead, forced vampirism, interparty conflict, etc) which it seems like you're not enjoying both in terms of the gameplay and your interactions with the characters of the other players. There's nothing wrong with just deciding that sort of game isn't for you if you don't enjoy it and finding a game you do enjoy instead (it could even be with the same DM if you're otherwise enjoying the one-shots).

I'm not saying don't play, just make sure you actually do want to play in this game as it kinda sounds like you don't to me.



Just to say, if you're playing your cleric primarily as a healer you're selling them a little short. There's plenty that a cleric can do to rock encounters. Many clerics won't casting much/any healing at all outside of Healing Word.


The thing I've mentioned is that I don't get a chance to do anything in regards to combat or roleplay because of characters being nocturnal (no shops are open at night) and while I have done damage in terms of cleric spells, I legit sat at the table for quite some time while one OP character took on 10 similarly leveled characters single handed.

As for the vampire charm, I was stuck first and wasn't even bit, I had taken damage previously during the charm by a Necrotic Touch. Which I believe breaks a charm, or at least makes it so that I can re-roll the save if the Vampire Monster thing is to be considered. I was then told that I could do nothing as the vampire fed from me, and I even said "that shouldn't be happening if I took damage" but he disregarded it [As a DM can but, it caused this whole mess in the first place]

I have done a few things with the trickery domain that are cool, but a lot of them are outside of combat. (Such as giving each undead player a chance to show them a path to redemption through her god)

As for the mood of this campaign, I was told that the DM was trying to avoid it becoming an evil campaign and that it wasn't going to be PvP.

The vampirism was by choice, and the player doesn't seem to realize that their choices may perm their character (they are even trying to betray their Patron as a Warlock, and have to fight a Djinn for another part of their soul) because all power comes at a cost, and this player decided to try taking an easy way out. (I am not sure how the player is going to react when they actually realize this, they believe that they can kill a partron whose name rhymes with harmonica and starts with a V. Even worse my Cleric knows about this cause she had a vision of them, told the party, and the Warlock said "oh, my man!" which caused a small freak-out in a tiny bird)

Lastly, I am an emotional person, it's a personality trait bound into me. My 6 year old Kenku Cleric was betrayed, and realized what a monster at least one of her party members are. I cried because my character was crying (it made for some interesting table roleplay) And I'm a bit nervous that one of the players won't be able to handle that the Cleric is seriously mad at them, and won't just become their friend anymore. (I always take some time after game to sort of cool off and relax, breath, eat ice cream and try to separate my feelings from my characters in a sort of D&D Aftercare)

I do really want to play this game. The world, lore, NPCs and everything are amazing. Maybe this particular chronicle of the story isn't the best for me as a jumping in point (because I did just jump in recently). But I think sticking it out might work out better then just dropping it. Worse comes to worse, everyone will have to deal with the woman who reloads crossbows with her bra who drinks too much. (And refers to herself in the 3rd person)