Is it worth to multiclass Vuman Crossbow Expert Battlemaster?

[Mitsu]

In infamous Crossbow BM Fighter - the king of DPR.

Is it worth to multiclass him at all? Do you find some multiclass combo that are worth delaying Fighter features for him?

Some people recommend warlock for Darkness + Devil's Sight. But it's a turn setup in which BM could already Action Surge for 7 attacks.

Some recommend Gloom Stalker for perma advantage from Darkness, but at some point the pure BM would have already second Action Surge, rocking 2 turns with 14 attacks.

The other that comes around are Ranger, Bard, Assassin.

What do you think? Worth it or not?

[Man_Over_Game]

The only thing I'd consider is 3 levels into Ranger, as this also gets you Hunter's Mark and the extra attack from Gloomstalker.

Hunter's Mark will add +1d6 damage per attack, or +3.5 per attack, and Gloomstalker will mean you're not losing any damage in the first round.

Say the 3 level dip is keeping you from getting the extra attack from Fighter, and you have a Modifier of +4, the difference is:

Fighter + Ranger = 3x (1d6 + 1d6 + 4) = 33 damage per round
Fighter + Extra Attack= 4x (1d6+4) = 30 damage per round.

This isn't including the other features that being a Gloomstalker Ranger provides you, and only considering the scenario where the Ranger levels are preventing you from getting Extra Attack (which is a pretty severe scenario).

Now, Hunter's Mark IS a limited resource, and one you're not likely to be able to use every fight, but I think the other features you gain from the 3 levels into Ranger more than make up for it.

[Mitsu]

The only thing I'd consider is 3 levels into Ranger, as this also gets you Hunter's Mark and the extra attack from Gloomstalker.

Hunter's Mark will add +1d6 damage per attack, or +3.5 per attack, and Gloomstalker will mean you're not losing any damage in the first round.

Say the 3 level dip is keeping you from getting the extra attack from Fighter, and you have a Modifier of +4, the difference is:

Fighter + Ranger = 3x (1d6 + 1d6 + 4) = 33 damage per round
Fighter + Extra Attack= 4x (1d6+4) = 30 damage per round.

This isn't including the other features that being a Gloomstalker Ranger provides you, and only considering the scenario where the Ranger levels are preventing you from getting Extra Attack (which is a pretty severe scenario).

I would also consider official Gloom Stalker as one of the top choices for 3 levels dip. You lose extra attack at 20 and push your second action Surge to 20, but you get a lot, especially as Vuman (Darkvision and Umbral Sight takes you from "I am the only one without darkvision" to "I am the best in the darkness among all of you!"). It rocks especially in dungeons.

I would also consider 1 level dip of Revised Ranger. Revised Gloom Stalker is nerfed (no invisibility in darkness anymore) but 1st level of Revised Ranger gives +2 damage to humanoids (that is solid +14 dmg with Action surge to humanoid target), ignoring difficulty terrain, advantage in initiative rolls, advantage on attacks in first turn etc. Revised Gloom Stalker is still nice, but not as nice imo like official one.

[Alucard89]

Gloom Stalker 3/5 Assassin is strong to help nova. But you lose both second AS and Extra Attack.

If you can in your game get specific magic items- I would go pure BM and focus on range combat till level 12 where I would grab RES (WIS). Then if you are able- get Hill Giant Belt and on level 14 and 16 invest in both PAM and GWM, just so you can sometimes change playstyle. You will be a true fighter, master of range and melee combat. Or take Shield Master + Magic Initiate Warlock (Hex) or Wizard (Find Famillar) or Cleric (Bless) and sometimes use Rapier + Shield and your manouvers + Shield bash and Hex or Bless for your party and become a front line CC fighter. Just for change of space.

In reality you are min-maxed at level 8 as Vuman Xbow Expert BM. After that you can just go melee route just for fun.

Or take 9 levels of Shep Druid and just cast Conjure Animals and hunt your enemies with your pack of CR 1/4 wolfs while you shot them from distance.

Hell, if you get Giant Belt, you can dip 9 levels of Barbarian for some fun in melee.

Basicelly at level 11/12 that build is already super strong so you can just play around it.

[Crgaston]

Gloomstalker 3 is probably the best option if you have the Wis for it.

Slightly less of an investment is two levels of Rogue for Expertise in Athletics and Stealth, plus Cunning Action. This would be worth it for me on almost any Dex Martial. I

t's actually a little less valuable on this build because you'll be wanting to use your Bonus Action for your crossbow attack, but being able to Hide to give yourself Advantage and a +1d6, and run crazy distances for escape/pursuit/positioning, and Disengage out of a sticky situation, and grapple like a Barbarian when you only have 12 Str is a worthwhile trade, especially in terms of having fun at the table.

[Willie the Duck]

Depends entirely on how your DM runs things and whether you are actually playing through the lower levels. Alternately to the Gloomstalker, if you are simply looking to prevent yourself from being in a situation where you can't see (and dealing with making yourself specific-weapon-type-dependent), a single level dip into forge cleric to get you the light cantrip and a +1 magic weapon before the DM gives you one can make this build much more playable if you're actually going up the levels 1-20.

[Benny89]

Despite 1 turn delay- I think Hexblade is worth 3 levels dip. For couple of reasons:

1. You get Curse, that is another +2 to +6 dmg depends on your level per attack. It's big bonus.
2. You can passive 120ft darkvision. 120ft is exactly the max range of hand crossbow. And you can still attack with advantage enemies with normal darkvision (60ft) as they can't see you in the darkness because you are beyond their darkvision reach, but they are visible to you.
3. You get Darkness. It's not super important for BM, BUT it's there if you can allow yourself a setup in first turn. Darkness + bonus action Curse and next turn you attack with advantage + bonus damage and crit on 19-20 (which is not bad once you have d12 dice as extra 2d12 dmg is nice bonus)
4. You get Shield spell and you recharge your 2x slots on short rest, which combos great with your whole short rest kit.
5. You can Improved Pact Weapon- great if your campaign is short on magic weapons or your DM is a d** and delay you magic hand crossbow.
6. If you don't need Improved Pact Weapon you can get great Tome or Chain Pacts which offers tons of utility for you.

Imo Hexblade even if you are DEX is worth 3 levels. Gloom Stalker is too.

If your campaign is has the structure of: couple of some mid encounters and one big boss fight from time to time- I would probably opt for Gloom Stalker 3/Assassin 5 for big first turn Nova damage.

If your campaign is more diversed and sometimes more than one fight is challanged and smartly build by DM- I would go Hexblade 3 and finish rest with fighter or Gloom Stalker. Hexblade will give you a lot of good options and utility and access to magic, cantrips etc.

So anyway I think you should just play to level 11 or 12 and then decide between Hexblade, Gloom Stalker or Assassin or combination of those. But never take only assassin - it sucks.