"When there's something strange in the nearby woods..." - Campaign idea

[Yora]

I approached planning a new campaign somewhat backwards by first working out what a world I would love to let the players explore and only then thinking about what kinds of adventures that campaign could consist of. I recommend avoiding this approach when possible.

Having a certain style in mind with a large wilderness setting full of spirits and strange phenomenons and PCs more engaged in exploring supernatural places than fighting dark lords and conquerors, I've come up with a couple of ideas that both fit and shouldn't be too unusual for D&D. Great riches have always felt rather weak to me as motivations, but a good reason why people would go far into the wilderness and creep through dangerous caves and ruins would be to have them searching for something that would help the people who send them deal with an otherwise unsolvable problem. Or alternatively they could go into the wilderness to investigate the source of a problem that has started to trouble the people living on the forest's edge.
Looking for examples of how such adventures could look like, I found that such things actually show up prominently in several of my favorite fantasy works: Indiana Jones, Planescape, The Witcher, Avatar, Princess Mononoke, and Mushishi.
In all those stories we get supernatural disruptions, or the looming threat of supernatural disruptions in the case of Indiana Jones, and the heroes are trying everything in their power to contain it, prevent further damage, and allow things to get somewhat back to normal. Generally why going to great length to avoid escalating the situation through use of force, and frequently the people in need of help not seeing the value in doing so.

Here are some things that I think should come up frequently in such adventures or would make good goals for the players to pursue:

Exploring supernatural places and demiplanes.
Having encounters with various spirits.
Interacting with magical things in the environment.
Escaping from supernatural dangers.
Restoring peace with the spirits.
Finding magical cures.
Breaking curses.
Banishing demons and evil spirits.

I think this really does have great potential for adventures. But when you make the entire campaign like that, making some adjustments and using some optional rules might be sensible.

One major thing is that I think it should be possible to go through an adventure without fighting. Though I would make that very difficult and something the players have to work very hard for to accomplish. It doesn't even have to be the most beneficial path.

As a consequence of that, there needs to be another source for the majority of XP that players will get.

When fights get really rare and might not happen at all, I think it would be really good to use the longer rests variant.

And I am also thinking about maybe not using some classes at all. Rogues, wizards, warlocks, and bards would all be fully in their element. Druids and rangers would also feel very much at home, even though they might not shine as much. Nature and knowledge clerics would also fit great.
I am not familiar with paladins and monks. Do you think they would have much to contribute?
Most out of place would be fighters and barbarians. I can see more intelectually minded fighters still being fun to play even if their fighting powers don't get much use, but barbarians feel rather superflous. Even the totem warrior does not really have anything to contribute.

Another interesting thing to think about is monsters that have great potential as either NPCs or threats. Do any spring to mind that have abilities that would make them great encounters in such adventures?

[DrKerosene]

While I want to agree that anyone who wants to play a nature-themed Paladin, Monk, or Barbarian can probably pick-another class for their idea, I wouldn’t ban the classes.

I typically award full XP for a monster, if I can justify a “successful” interaction for the Party. Managed to escape a powerful enemy? Managed to hide from something you wanted to sneak past? Managed to trade magic items you have, or a favor, for what you want? Full XP. Maybe half or less if the Party goes back more than once.

I’ve been sitting on a Hag Coven that my PCs want to meet. I’ve been working on ideas for side-quests that the Hags may want done.
-Collecting the Hags Eye Ring that a former minion left in the woods (when they died).
-Putting a Shadow-Crossing location-spirit to rest (I’m going with a Banshee that wants a Construct “man” companion, or maybe just un-desecrating the grave of another incorpereal undead).
-Finding a haunted magic weapon and putting the spirit to rest.
-Promising a kiss. Later to be brought up with a Succubus/Incubus.
-Collect the eyeball of a creature (more about finding it and chasing it down, and the decision of sparing the life of the creature after taking an eye).
-Learning what the swarm of cranium squirrels want (one of my PCs is supposed to hate squirrels).
-Finding Wolfsbane before the next full moon, so the goblin is not permenantly a were-rooster.
-Tracking down a remote hunting cabin for a woman who thinks her husband may have died there (the lyrics from When He Died by Lemon Demon).
-A bound demon or genie with a cult. Just wants to play a few rounds of cards, or dice, or story-telling/performing. They are a bored bound creature.
-Stealing from other (more powerful) Hags who run an “asylum” in the Feywild.
-Custom Moonblade quests to unlock the powers they want. Walk on the Moon, defeat a Genie at a competition, save a life by moon light without spilling blood, something about air-surfing on a tempest elemental through a storm in the elemental plane of air, etc...

If you’ve seen the CR 10 Eladrin, I’d suggest they are the (mini-)gods worshipped by mortal cultists. A autumn eladrin can raise one dead creature per day at no cost. A spring eladrin could be a lord of dances, intent on dueling an undead in the (g)”Raveyard”. I’ve made the winter eladrin in to more of a Tina Belcher with the awkward noise. I’ve got a bunch of RenFare ideas, like bobbing for apples, chasing greased-up pigs, dance or karaoke competition, a handful of mounted combat contests (one is just being on a moving mount and using spears to hit objects for points), a bake-off, dog show (we have a Druid), a shell game with exploding stuff.

I’ve got more stuff about the Fey Asylum having a Granny Annis Hag, Aunty Green Hag, and “Doctor” Night Hag, under a psychic vampire Eladrin Archmage. They are responsible for creating those Sorrowsworn creatures, including a False Hydra. There’s uses of Edit Memory, and schedule of shifts that are worked. I’m mostly working on other patients and their “damage”.

[Pex]

Who are you gonna call? Ghast busters!

[Marcloure]

I too love this sort of fantasy, real world Germanic and Aztec folklore, filled with fear, witchcraft, occult, and esoteric rituals. But sincerely, I don't think it is meant for D&D. There are systems better designed for this kind of game, as D&D treats magic and the supernatural as something common, and usually falls to combat. "Everything that happens in D&D is premisse for combat or to avoid combat", a saying that I heard somewhere.

[Yora]

But someone who doesn't know anything about D&D.

What's your recommendation? Not trying this campaign if I want to run D&D?

[DrKerosene]

Pretending I was a Player and my DM was pitching a campaign with the information you’ve provided, I would be happy to play in such a game. It seems like a typical Points Of Light world, but without combat being the primary method of interaction.

I assume certain story elements would be ignored or under-utilized, like urban adventures featuring thieves guilds smuggling stuff, fields and mass army combats, or kingmaker political intrigue stuff, etc.

I would expect Clerics and Druids of all stripes to be perfectly viable, and the Fighters or Rogues Archtypes that would be useless shouldn’t need to be banned. Why? Beacause your Players should have payed enough attention, and asked you enough questions, to be able to build a character who is willing to interact with spirits and magical creatures.

I would expect adventures like 3.5e The Burning Plague, or the older Expeditions To The Barrier Peaks, but (again) without combat being mandatory to get through successfully.

Edit: If your world creation method works for you, then it works, keep on doing whatever works.

[Wizard_Lizard]

what if the warlock pacts with the demon they vowed to destroy. Without knowing.

[opaopajr]

I disagree wholly with your lament -- particularly the difficulty of starting with setting then thinking of adventures -- and think you can do everything you want within D&D, even 5e with enough tweaking. :smallyuk:

What you are asking for is a mythical liminal place. :smallwink: This is essentially another word for "The Underworld, the Dreamscape, the Dungeon!" And containing the liminal is the eternal responsibility of socialization, lest the powers within such primal forces spill out with great violence and disruption into the everyday.

This is literally the hero myth writ large.

All you gotta do is decide the dressings, trappings, restrictions, and enticements! :smallsmile:

So let'd try together! :smallcool:

What setting world do you want?
What major enticements sell your world to explore?
What major limitations do you want on the world?
How would you make 5e conform to your world (NEVER the other way around!)?
Which classes, archetypes, races, and backgrounds would likely populate it (your demographics)?

It isn't very hard if you try this way. You get a cool setting with its own logic. Then adding adventures is easy as pie.

[Yora]

The more I think of it, the more I feel that this would fit really well into a Planescape campaign focused on the Outlands, with occasional short visits to the chaotic planes.

Problem is that I never really understood how you're supposed to run Plannescape campaigns outside of Sigil.

[opaopajr]

... gates. Weekends in hell. :smallwink: Remember, think of it as a liminal space. A place where within 'the rules' are allowed to dissolve, but whose boundaries are ideally held in check by ritual.

So yeah, do the spooky woods thing! :smallsmile:

[Yora]

"... they are really more like guidelines.":smallamused:

[Dalebert]

Who are you gonna call? Ghast busters!

I'm so relieved to know that I wasn't the only one who heard the subject of the thread to the tune of the Ghostbusters theme. I'm assuming that was intentional on OP's part.

[Great Dragon]

The more I think of it, the more I feel that this would fit really well into a Planescape campaign focused on the Outlands, with occasional short visits to the chaotic planes.

Problem is that I never really understood how you're supposed to run Plannescape campaigns outside of Sigil.

The best way (that I found) was to make more "natural" and "random" portals outside of Sigil.
Getting to them can be a Quest.

Known portals almost always have a Guardian Creature.

The Players decide whether to avoid it or attack to kill, or just render unconscious.

[Marcloure]

But someone who doesn't know anything about D&D.

What's your recommendation? Not trying this campaign if I want to run D&D?

You can run it in D&D, please do you. I was just saying that it is not made for this sort of thing. You can always try to tweak the system to fit the world, but please, don't think this is true:


you can do everything you want within D&D, even 5e with enough tweaking.

You can make a witch hunter, occultism game in D&D, but don't be surprised if it doesn't have the usual tone of that fantasy.

Now, what system is made for this? I know only a few indie systems, but they aren't that great too. Maybe Torchbearer?

[Brookshw]

The more I think of it, the more I feel that this would fit really well into a Planescape campaign focused on the Outlands, with occasional short visits to the chaotic planes.

Problem is that I never really understood how you're supposed to run Plannescape campaigns outside of Sigil.

What resources does 5e have available for Planescape? Or outsiders?

[Yora]

The basics of the planes are in the DMG, spells for planar travel are in the PHB, and most planar creatures are in the Monster Manual or Volo and Mordenkainen, except for most celestials. For the setting itself I would always go back to the original Planescape material. The pieces to set a game in Planescape are all there.

The real question is how you set up adventures that get the right feel of the non.hellish planes and structure a full campaign. The Planescape boxes never went into detail about that either.

[OracularPoet]

I'm so relieved to know that I wasn't the only one who heard the subject of the thread to the tune of the Ghostbusters theme. I'm assuming that was intentional on OP's part.

I was thinking this was going to be a thread about a comedic campaign, was going to recommend chasing down the old Castle Greyhawk adventure compendium for inspiration.

Reading it’s Wikipedia entry just now, seems it even had a Pillsbury Doughboy villain. “Poppinfarsh the Dough Golem.” It’s been so long that honestly I don’t remember any of the dungeon levels but did find it hilarious at the time. Was completely unaware of the controversy around it (may have been a personal dig at Gygax).

[opaopajr]

The basics of the planes are in the DMG, spells for planar travel are in the PHB, and most planar creatures are in the Monster Manual or Volo and Mordenkainen, except for most celestials. For the setting itself I would always go back to the original Planescape material. The pieces to set a game in Planescape are all there.

The real question is how you set up adventures that get the right feel of the non.hellish planes and structure a full campaign. The Planescape boxes never went into detail about that either.

Think of the Alignments Writ Large. (Don't worry about other interpretations, only yours as GM will matter during play.) Take these notions you have about X alignment and have them "bleed" into the Prime Material World. Sorta like a Magic the Gathering plane bleeding into another, it becomes a dangerous leak of mystery.

Next determine which Game Pillars you want to focus on, how much for each. Then imagine a Crisis Premise, and a Noded Mystery requiring a visit to wonderland and back again. Finally wrap it all with enough Actors, Props, and Locations that it gives reason to conclude the adventure.

Here, we practice:

Lawful Neutral Plane Leaks into the Blissful Forest.

Crisis Premise - the trees and plants in a shady grove are becoming angular, almost cubism-like! The squirrels and ants there only travel in straight lines or 90 degree turns. All the life there seems to be dying of malnourishment and are getting aggressive with their now-scared neighbors! :smalleek:

Now your turn! How much Combat, Social, or Explore do you want in this adventure! :smallsmile: And what two major answers a) explain the mystery and b) solve the problem?

[Yora]

I am imagining an adventure in which the players have been send to an island or remote mountain valley to search for a powerful spirit god that is said to be able to break a curse. Maybe a djinn, a treant, or a dragon.
The players only know that this spirit lives in this general area and don't know anything about it, or what it would take to get the spirit to break the curse.

I think the journey from their quest giver to the area doesn't need to be very eventful, but once they get there, their first goal is to find the spirit and then get it to help them. While searching for its lair, the players can explore various magical locations in the area and encounter its other strange inhabitants who can help them or cause them trouble. You could make this a simple trail of clues and tasks the players have to follow, but I find this rather uninspiring. Instead I find it much more interesting to make the NPCs and creatures of the area react to them depending on how the players approach them. And set up conflicts between the different inhabitants, so the players can get favor with some groups by helping them against their enemies and in turn get advice on how to find the spirit god and what to do to make it agreeing to help.

[opaopajr]

... :smallredface: OK. Those are nice generalities.

A) Mystery Explained -- It's a Curse!
B) Solve the Problem -- Ask a Powerful Spirit from a Distant Place to Break the Curse.

But let's put them into practice! :smallsmile: That's the point of the example. To turn theoretical process into applicable muscle memory.

So... How Much?:
Combat -
Explore -
Social -

Who is Powerful Spirit?
Where is its Distant Place?
What Challenges are on the Way?
What will Powerful Spirit need to be Convinced to Help?
What will Powerful Spirit need to Break the Curse?

Keep going! We almost got your first Planescape adventure outline done! :smallcool:

[Yora]

Some more ideas:

Oracles are great for this type of adventure. It could be as the people who send the party on their quest, the first objective to be reached, or as the final destination where they get the answer to the question they have been send to find.

Relics should also work really well. Unique objects that will be required at some step to accomplish the final goal. It could be anything and it could have powers and uses beyond the adventure. It doesn't need to be powerful, but I think it should feel like a unique and specific object.

If the adventure takes the form of a little sandbox in the way of a pointcrawl, I think there should be one location that serves as base camp. It's the place where the party arrives at the main location of the adventure, either at the start or after a longer journey. At this place they can recover, restore supplies, and get any additional equipment they realize they would need during their explorations.

Out in the magical wilderness there should be various inhabitants. Some who can serve as guides who give the players information about the area and its other inhabitants, and some as troublemakers, who are currently making the inhabitants on edge and causing fights and suspicions. Some NPCs could even take both roles.

Such NPCs should also have homes or lairs, where the players can find them if they want to talk to them later or have been send to them by other guides. Some of these lairs can also possibly serve as havens, where the players can rest safely and restock some of their resources without having to go all the way back to the base camp every time.
This would be especially important when the campaign uses a longer rest variant and you can't do a long rest in the wilderness orna dungeon.

In addition to a safe resting place, supernatural creatures who the players have befriended can also give them charms and blessings. This kind of adventure is exactly the situation these are made for. They can also be used as effects gained from magic springs or fruits found in the magical wilderness.

Another thing is that I think finding the spirit god of the land shouldn't be a straightforward thing. There should always be some kinds of complications.
The spirit might agree to help, but to make a cure for a poison or a charm that can break a curse, it needs to have some special things that can be found in the area. The players have to get them to get their cure.
Or the spirit wants to help but there is something preventing it from using all its power, and the players will have to go out and deal with the thing that is blocking the spirit's power.
The spirit might also have been angered by someone breaking its rules, and it will only stop causing problems once a special offering or service is being made.
Another complication would be that the path to the spirit's lair is blocked by someone or some force, and the players have to find a way to overcome it.
(I just would avoid having the spirit give them multiple tasks, or ask that the players go and find Object B before it will hand over Object A. Such adventures always feel artifical and forced to me.)

Finally, I think it always gets much more interesting if there are multiple approaches for the players to reach their goal. If the spirit asks for a high price for its help, the players could be approached by another inhabitant of the area that offers them a different way to get what they need, or to help them cheat the spirit to accept something that is much easier to get. Usually for selfish reasons.

[Vogie]

In my opinion, there's no reason to ever outright ban subclasses or classes.

Even if all the PC is doing is driving the party around in their '67 Impala.

Edit: Also, take a look at the Pathfinder Occult Adventures, which will give you some inspiration on how to reinterperet the classes.

Something like the Samurai Fighter or Ancestral Guardian Barbarian acting like a Spiritualist, where the warrior is paired with a spirit who gives them their subclass features

[Brookshw]

The real question is how you set up adventures that get the right feel of the non.hellish planes and structure a full campaign. The Planescape boxes never went into detail about that either.

It helps to look through the Planes of X supplements that give a lot useful locations and motivations/factions for those found there, as well as potential or actual conflicts faced by those in the area. Or the Faces of Sigil supplement. I guess, really, it was a matter of looking through the supplements for more details.

There are tons of little plot hooks everywhere that give some great ideas, for example there's a little quote in the Guide to the Outlands about the Slaad stealing....iirc, blocks(?) from the Limbo gate town. Why? What do the Slaad possibly want with them??

Also, if you never read them, the modules usually gave a good idea how to go about it. Faction War continues to be one of my top 5 favorite modules. If you haven't read it I highly recommend doing so if you want to run something in the planes. Modron March also gives a lot of examples of how to do an adventure on various non-lower planes.