PvP Combat

[Goldlizard]

My players are in the endgame and the final challenge (After they beat the campaign) is a PvP tournament, Double elimination, Gladiator ring, randomized terrain. I have already spoken to them about this and they are all willing to participate fully (PC are revived after)

What would be a good PvP system? Trying to make it as fair as possible

Classes: Tiefling swashbuckler, Half-orc oath of conquest, Sea elf Moon druid, V. Human champion, Human Light cleric, Gnome necromancer, Goliath Barbarian (One is the wildcard)

[Man_Over_Game]

My players are in the endgame and the final challenge (After they beat the campaign) is a PvP tournament, Double elimination, Gladiator ring, randomized terrain. I have already spoken to them about this and they are all willing to participate fully (PC are revived after)

What would be a good PvP system? Trying to make it as fair as possible

Classes: Tiefling swashbuckler, Half-orc cleric, Sea elf Moon druid, V. Human champion, Human Light cleric, Gnome necromancer, Goliath Barbarian (One is the wildcard)

To make it the most fair, you wouldn't pit them against one another. Otherwise, the Gnome wouldn't stand much of a chance. Rather, a "fair" fight would involve some kind of universal scoring system. Like: Kill the most number of Zombies/Complete the most number of objectives/clear out your sections of this town/etc.

Although, I'm not sure exactly what the question is. You've already said the terrain was randomized in a Gladiator Ring. You already have a system (DnD 5e). You already have a way of determining the victor (PvP, Double Elimination).

What else do you need? Rather, are you looking for additions to your ideas, or do you want us to tell you what about your ideas needs improvement?

[Goldlizard]

To make it the most fair, you wouldn't pit them against one another. Otherwise, the Gnome wouldn't stand much of a chance. Rather, a "fair" fight would involve some kind of universal scoring system. Like: Kill the most number of Zombies/Complete the most number of objectives/clear out your sections of this town/etc.

Although, I'm not sure exactly what the question is. You've already said the terrain was randomized in a Gladiator Ring. You already have a system (DnD 5e). You already have a way of determining the victor (PvP, Double Elimination).

What else do you need? Rather, are you looking for additions to your ideas, or do you want us to tell you what about your ideas needs improvement?

What I am looking for is a way to ensure that the players can engage each other fairly, and not instantly destroy each other. a custom system of combat, like rerolin ginitiative every turn, rules for wounds and reactions, and spelcasting limits.

EDIT: I guess I'm looking for a more in depth/realistic, gritty set of rules to introduce better strategy

[Rukelnikov]

To make it the most fair, you wouldn't pit them against one another. Otherwise, the Gnome wouldn't stand much of a chance. Rather, a "fair" fight would involve some kind of universal scoring system. Like: Kill the most number of Zombies/Complete the most number of objectives/clear out your sections of this town/etc.

Although, I'm not sure exactly what the question is. You've already said the terrain was randomized in a Gladiator Ring. You already have a system (DnD 5e). You already have a way of determining the victor (PvP, Double Elimination).

What else do you need? Rather, are you looking for additions to your ideas, or do you want us to tell you what about your ideas needs improvement?

There a couple things that haven't been decided yet:

Are combatants allowed to buff before combat?

Are minions allowed? (Looking at you Necro...)

What will starting distance be?

Do they have to start combat in vision of each other?

Take into account though, that there are some buffs that are effectively undetectable and can't be removed by any means (short of Wish), and a couple of those are very thematic to such a fight. Those being Bardic Inspiration, and Inspiring Leader buff. You can get around Inspiring Leader (by checking the creature doesn't have any magical auras, dispel magic if necessary, or maybe just to be sure, then cast a spell that grants temp hp, check that it now DOES have a magical aura, meaning the temp hp were overwritten, and then dispel said spell), however doing so would be metagame, since in world, Inspiring Leader is just a morale boost.

Starting distance is one of the biggest deciding factors, there are basically 4 distances that I see as breaking points: melee, a move away, a full round away, more than a full round away.

What a move away means depends on the general populace organizing the event, dwarves would make it 25 ft away, while wood elves would make that 35 ft away. As always humans set the standard 30 ft. This has some ties into visibility, if the have to start visible to each other, there are some distances where this won't be possible, but since its a duel, and not a battle royale, I assume they aren't gonna start miles away from each other.

[Man_Over_Game]

What I am looking for is a way to ensure that the players can engage each other fairly, and not instantly destroy each other. a custom system of combat, like rerolin ginitiative every turn, rules for wounds and reactions, and spelcasting limits.

EDIT: I guess I'm looking for a more in depth/realistic, gritty set of rules to introduce better strategy

Gotcha!

So the main thing is that we need to ensure everyone has a chance to implement their own tactics. This means we need:

Bodies for the Necromancer and Clerics
Manipulation for the Swashbuckler and Clerics
Combat for the Barbarian


My suggestion to implement all of these is to have the battle arena have denizens that can be swayed to aid the individual players in a large arena. Some of these denizens have special properties that can be stolen from their body to enhance their assailant, or they can be convinced to aid the party member. Many of the denizens are already fighting one another in a sort of Civil War, so you might be able to convince some of them to join you if you help them.

The Swashbuckler can convince many to join him, or kill them for their buffs.
The Clerics can recruit a small army to take advantage of their many buffs.
The Necromancer can take advantage of the dead to create their own army.
The Moon Druid and Barbarian can kill the buff denizens and rush the other players.

Make it a labyrinth, filled to the brim with Arcane Eyes for observation for the crowd, and it'd be a really good way to fill up a session. I'd also make all the denizens some sort of pseudo-specter humanoid, created explicitly for the purposes of filling out the labyrinth.


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If you want something a little more simpler and designed for straight PvP combat, do this:


Everyone's HP increased by 50%
Weapon Attack damage is reduced by 3 per attack.
Spell Slots are reduced to 50% (rounded up).


This will effectively double the length of time a fight between players would normally take, giving them time to adapt to a particular problem and draw it out a little longer.

I'd also reduce the amount of time needed for a Short Rest to 1 minute, and a Long Rest to 5 minutes.

[Goldlizard]

Responding to questions:

They will start a different distance away depending on the arena (Visibility)

M_O_G, thanks for the suggestions! The stat mods and using NPC's as arena effects in brilliant!

Minions are allowed (3) and at no spell slot cost

no wish allowed

5 min pre combat to buff (Thanks Rukelnikov)

The arena is setup by a race of super-people in the heavens as a means of entertainment for them, as long as the players agree. Some arenas are terrain only (Like islands, a forest, a swamp) Others are challenges (Race, Capture The flag, Escort) and still others are designed to force the players to use skills ( Fighting on ships, skydiving)

using a March madness bracket, the PC's spectate their own matches and fight's with some NPC's who they will run into. also Mistake, The half-orks an Oath of Conquest Pally

[Sigreid]

The best I've seen this done was in a video game where they had an arena where you fought by proxy using balanced battle pets.