AL Knowledge Cleric 1/ Div Wizard X Build Advice

[BaconAwesome]

I'm thinking about playing some Adventurer's League with my daughter, and put together a Lev 1 character. I'm planning on Knowledge Cleric 1/Divination Wizard X.

Starting Build: Forest Gnome, Str: 8, Dex: 14, Con: 12, Wis: 14, Int: 16, Cha: 12. Cleric Cantrips: Guidance, Mending, Thaumaturgy.

1) Any suggestions?

2) In AL, do I have to choose my +1 book right away, and does anyone have any suggestions for the best one?

Thanks!

[Wildarm]

Seems solid though I'd probably dump CHA and get CON up to 14. HP is just behind spell slots for importance for a caster IMO. Sacred Flame cantrip would probably serve better than Thaumaturgy. Pick up Firebolt, Minor Illusion and Mage Hand as a wizard. Gives you similar effects with much much greater flexibility and use.

In general you want two attack cantrips of differing damage types. 1 Targeting a save(for armored enemies or those adjacent) and 1 with an attack roll(which means it has a better chance to land against many enemies). Sacred Flame and Firebolt are a solid pair.

I don't think you need to choose your +1 Source. If you're entirely from PHB you can choose to expand in the future.

[BaconAwesome]

Thanks - I get minor Illusion for free as a forest gnome, and figured I'd take fire bolt and two others on my first wizard level. (I guess it's a fair question of whether I should use my +1 book for Toll the Dead).

My thought was that I shouldn't take a cleric attack cantrip because I'm not planning on boosting Wis over 14. Until I get level 2, I'll probably be doing mostly support and fighting with a short bow and staff, which will be a pain with limited spell slots, but hopefully my party won't die. ;-)

[Cynthaer]

My thought was that I shouldn't take a cleric attack cantrip because I'm not planning on boosting Wis over 14. Until I get level 2, I'll probably be doing mostly support and fighting with a short bow and staff, which will be a pain with limited spell slots, but hopefully my party won't die. ;-)
Your Cleric save DC still grows with your proficiency bonus, so Sacred Flame technically remains a usable backup against foes with poor Dex saves. Still weaker than a Wizard cantrip that targets Dex, though.

Regardless, you can completely rebuild at any time until you hit level 5, so you could certainly take Sacred Flame at level 1 and swap it out once you hit level 2. Sacred Flame and a shortbow should get you through level 1 nicely.

As for mechanical advice, in a vacuum I agree with Wildarm regarding the stats and cantrip choices.

In practice, I'd prefer to know a little bit more about the character—what's their personality, their background, their experiences? For me, these things are usually what drive the choice to do things like lowering a secondary stat (Con) to boost a tertiary stat (Cha), taking a more niche cantrip (like Friends) over one with more generic practicality (like Mage Hand), or grabbing a weird skill proficiency (like my heavy armor Paladin with Stealth prof).

[Keravath]

Choices seem fine. I would probably take a cleric damage cantrip at level 1 and swap it out at level 2 when you get the wizard ones since you can rebuild before every session up to level 5. I also second the suggestion to get constitution to 14. I have a similar character but I went with variant human and took resilient con to start with since I figured con saves will be useful throughout the character's career.

In my case, I was trying to decide between playing evoker or diviner or abjuration. Diviner's portent feature is very cool and thematic but the evoker ability to use AoE evocation spells while protecting team mates from the damage is hard to pass up too. On the other hand, the abjuration ward, proficiency on counterspells and magic resistance that come later are all very good features too.

P.S. You don't need to choose a +1 until you use content from it and when you use that content it becomes your +1 :). In this case, your +1 is likely to be Xanathar's due to the choices offered for spells but you don't need to pick it until you get a spell from there (like Toll the Dead). Folks occasionally use SCAG as their +1 if they are looking to use the melee cantrips (booming blade, green flame blade), battle rager dwarf or bladesinger elf or half-elf. Most of the other +1 choices are related to choosing an unusual race like Yuan-ti or bugbears from Volo's.

[BaconAwesome]

Thanks - I forgot about the rebuilds, that changes a lot.

I'm hoping the character will develop in play, but the base concept is (a) he's fairly fey and weird, but more as flavor (like Mxyzpdlyk toned down by 75%), (b) he's a revolutionary philosopher with a strong belief in free information as a political philosophy - even the Harpers, while sympathetic, are essentially corrupted by their own reliance on secrecy, and (c) he's a hacker -he studied as a cleric specifically for the mechanical benefits and the skill expertise, and calls it a hack.* His persona is sort of a mix of Jeff Goldblum from Jurassic Park/Independence Day and Steve Jobs.

* I didn't intend this pun, but he's a munchkin in some ways, and I want to play him with a voice that has a little bit of Wizard of Oz munchkin buzz to it.

[Lyracian]

I'm thinking about playing some Adventurer's League with my daughter, and put together a Lev 1 character. I'm planning on Knowledge Cleric 1/Divination Wizard X.
Starting Build: Forest Gnome, Str: 8, Dex: 14, Con: 12, Wis: 14, Int: 16, Cha: 12. Cleric Cantrips: Guidance, Mending, Thaumaturgy.
1) Any suggestions?
2) In AL, do I have to choose my +1 book right away, and does anyone have any suggestions for the best one?

I started a very similar Character an Elven Cleric/Wizard. I went with 13 CON ready to take Resistance at level 8.

In AL I was disillusioned with starting Knowledge Domain. Your Domain Spells (command/Identify) are not going to get used. With only 3 prepared spells that is healing and bless. I changed to Life Domain to be more useful in Tier 1. Plan is I may switch back at Level 5 when the skills could be of more use than the healing bonus.

My Cleric Cantrips are Guidance, Mending and Light. Even with Dark Vision having a light source can be useful even if it just allows the Humans to see.

As other mentioned rebuild is very useful for AL. Take Sacred Flame and your crossbow at Level 1 and you have combat covered. Then forget it at level two when you have Firebolt and Toll the Dead both using your better Int score.

[BaconAwesome]

That's a great point - I really want knowledge domain for the extra skills, language and expertise, but might be better off with a different domain level 1, then switching.

Am I allowed to switch my +1 as part of the Level 1-5 rebuilds?

[djreynolds]

I'm thinking about playing some Adventurer's League with my daughter, and put together a Lev 1 character. I'm planning on Knowledge Cleric 1/Divination Wizard X.

Starting Build: Forest Gnome, Str: 8, Dex: 14, Con: 12, Wis: 14, Int: 16, Cha: 12. Cleric Cantrips: Guidance, Mending, Thaumaturgy.

1) Any suggestions?

2) In AL, do I have to choose my +1 book right away, and does anyone have any suggestions for the best one?

Thanks!

If you begin as a cleric you will get wisdom and charisma saving throw proficiency, so you could leave charisma at a 10.

Also, I actually like the resistance cantrip. Yes its concentration, but you never know what's around the corner... its 1d4 for any saving throw. Not bad for "before" combat situations as you are walking down the scary dungeon

[Zuras]

For AL play I would highly recommend taking Absorb Element when you hit Tier 2. My Knowledge Cleric spent a lot of time unconscious in Tier 2 until he picked up Resilient:Constitution at 8th level.

As a multiclass, 5th level will be rough, since you won’t have 3rd level spells with a 1/4 split. Make sure you pick up at least one spell that scales well, so you can use your 3rd level slot effectively.

Your Sacred Flame will have a lousy DC, so don’t use it against high dex enemies like Kobolds and Goblins. It will still be your MVP against zombies, though.

[McSkrag]

Thanks - I forgot about the rebuilds, that changes a lot.

I'm hoping the character will develop in play, but the base concept is (a) he's fairly fey and weird, but more as flavor (like Mxyzpdlyk toned down by 75%), (b) he's a revolutionary philosopher with a strong belief in free information as a political philosophy - even the Harpers, while sympathetic, are essentially corrupted by their own reliance on secrecy, and (c) he's a hacker -he studied as a cleric specifically for the mechanical benefits and the skill expertise, and calls it a hack.* His persona is sort of a mix of Jeff Goldblum from Jurassic Park/Independence Day and Steve Jobs.

* I didn't intend this pun, but he's a munchkin in some ways, and I want to play him with a voice that has a little bit of Wizard of Oz munchkin buzz to it.

I am currently playing a Divination Wizard 6 / Knowledge Cleric 1 in AL as an arcane investigator. It's been a lot of fun in and out of combat.

As others have said your character does need to be PHB+1 legal to play AL. But you don't have to lock it in until level 5.

Suggestions:

You should plan to have at least a 14 CON with Resilient CON by level 12 so start with a 13 CON.

Here's what I took for spells. I tried to have a balance of utility, control, and a couple damage spells. As a Divination Wizard you should collect few save/suck spells you can use with portent to be sure bad guys miss their save.

Remember you can trade spells with other wizards at your table and find or buy scrolls to copy to your spellbook.

Cleric Spells
C: Guidance, Thaumaturgy, Resistance
1: Healing Word, Bless, Cure Wounds, Pro. Good/Evil, Command (domain), Identify (domain)

Wizard Spells
C: Minor Illusion, Mage Hand, Toll the Dead, Fire Bolt or Chill Touch
1: Shield, Absorb Elements, Detect Magic (R), Comprehend Languages (R), Find Familiar (R), Fog Cloud, Grease, Tashas Hideous Laughter, Magic Missile
2: Misty Step, Suggestion, Blindness/Deafness, Web, Dragon Breath, Invisibility
3: Hypnotic Pattern, Counterspell, Fireball, Haste

Portent

Spells: Tashas, Suggestion, Hold Person, Blindness/Deafness, Bestow Curse, Slow are all good spells to combo with portent (assuming you got a low roll to make the bad guys fail a save). The right Suggestion can turn the entire adventure. Once you get 4th level spells save a Banishment to take out the boss.
Grease and Blindness/Deafness are great because they do not require concentration. Cast Grease under the bad guys feet once they are locked up with your front line. Cast Blindness on enemy mages so they can't target spells.
Save your high portent rolls to make saves or ensure that killing blow lands when it needs to.

[Lyracian]

Cleric Spells
C: Guidance, Thaumaturgy, Resistance
1: Healing Word, Bless, Cure Wounds, Pro. Good/Evil, Command (domain), Identify (domain)

Wizard Spells
C: Minor Illusion, Mage Hand, Toll the Dead, Fire Bolt or Chill Touch
1: Shield, Absorb Elements, Detect Magic (R), Comprehend Languages (R), Find Familiar (R), Fog Cloud, Grease, Tashas Hideous Laughter, Magic Missile
2: Misty Step, Suggestion, Blindness/Deafness, Web, Dragon Breath, Invisibility
3: Hypnotic Pattern, Counterspell, Fireball, Haste

16 Wisdom for having 4 Prepared Cleric spells? What stats did you take?

I prefer Firebolt over Chill Touch because Chill and Toll are both Necrotic damage and I like to have different damage types available.
Have you been fortunate in having other Wizards in the party to trade spells will or have you used other ways to get the extra spells in AL?

You can only prepare ten spells so which of your fifteen none-rituals are you regularly using? Are the others for particular scenarios or just stuff you used at lower levels?

[Ogeeogelthorpe]

I am currently playing a Divination Wizard 6 / Knowledge Cleric 1 in AL as an arcane investigator. It's been a lot of fun in and out of combat.

As others have said your character does need to be PHB+1 legal to play AL. But you don't have to lock it in until level 5.

Suggestions:

You should plan to have at least a 14 CON with Resilient CON by level 12 so start with a 13 CON.

Here's what I took for spells. I tried to have a balance of utility, control, and a couple damage spells. As a Divination Wizard you should collect few save/suck spells you can use with portent to be sure bad guys miss their save.

Remember you can trade spells with other wizards at your table and find or buy scrolls to copy to your spellbook.

Cleric Spells
C: Guidance, Thaumaturgy, Resistance
1: Healing Word, Bless, Cure Wounds, Pro. Good/Evil, Command (domain), Identify (domain)

Wizard Spells
C: Minor Illusion, Mage Hand, Toll the Dead, Fire Bolt or Chill Touch
1: Shield, Absorb Elements, Detect Magic (R), Comprehend Languages (R), Find Familiar (R), Fog Cloud, Grease, Tashas Hideous Laughter, Magic Missile
2: Misty Step, Suggestion, Blindness/Deafness, Web, Dragon Breath, Invisibility
3: Hypnotic Pattern, Counterspell, Fireball, Haste

Portent

Spells: Tashas, Suggestion, Hold Person, Blindness/Deafness, Bestow Curse, Slow are all good spells to combo with portent (assuming you got a low roll to make the bad guys fail a save). The right Suggestion can turn the entire adventure. Once you get 4th level spells save a Banishment to take out the boss.
Grease and Blindness/Deafness are great because they do not require concentration. Cast Grease under the bad guys feet once they are locked up with your front line. Cast Blindness on enemy mages so they can't target spells.
Save your high portent rolls to make saves or ensure that killing blow lands when it needs to.



Twins! I'm also playing an arcane investigator in AL. (5 divination wizard, 2 knowledge cleric)
He's a ranking member of the cloaks of mulmaster and travels the sword coast solving crimes. Recently he read a book in Qualith which gave him an indefinite form of madness that makes him want to eat brains, which he thinks is perfectly normal and is the reason why he's so smart.

Race: High elf
Wizard cantrips: Chill touch, prestidigitation, minor illusion, shocking grasp, toll the dead (high elf)
Cleric cantrips: Guidance, resistance, thaumaturgy

Wizard spells:
Level 1: Absorb elements, shield
Level 2: Detect thoughts, dragonsbreath, hold person, misty step
Level 3: Counterspell, fireball

Cleric spells: Cure wounds, guiding bolt, bless, identify(Domain), command(Domain) protection from good and evil, inflict wounds

[McSkrag]

16 Wisdom for having 4 Prepared Cleric spells? What stats did you take?

Should have been more clear, those are the 4 spells I most commonly prepare but with a 14 WIS I can only choose 3 of them. I always have Healing Word and Bless ready and then choose Cure Wounds or Pro. Good/Evil based on the party.



I prefer Firebolt over Chill Touch because Chill and Toll are both Necrotic damage and I like to have different damage types available.

I hear you. I was torn between the two. Firebolt does more damage and is a different type than Toll the Dead. But Chill Touch has a rider that in the right situation is excellent. I went with Firebolt myself.



Have you been fortunate in having other Wizards in the party to trade spells will or have you used other ways to get the extra spells in AL??

Yes, I was able to pick up a few spells from other wizards which is nice because then it's just the cost of downtime and 50gp spell level.



You can only prepare ten spells so which of your fifteen none-rituals are you regularly using? Are the others for particular scenarios or just stuff you used at lower levels?

Some of the spells were from lower levels, some I copied from other wizards because I like to have choices.

These are the spells I've gotten the most use out of:
1: Shield, Absorb Elements, Grease, Tashas Hideous Laughter
2: Misty Step, Suggestion, Blindness/Deafness, Web
3: Hypnotic Pattern, Counterspell

Defense: Shield, Absorb Elements, Misty Step, Counterspell
Control: Grease, Tashas (C), Blindness/Deafness, Suggestion (C), Web (C), Hypnotic Pattern (C)
Damage: Firebolt, Toll the Dead

My usual tactics are to use an AOE control spell like Web or Hypnotic Pattern to break up the enemy. Then I use non-concentration debuffs and attacks like Grease, Blindness, Toll the Dead, or Firebolt.

Hope that helps! :)

[McSkrag]

Twins! I'm also playing an arcane investigator in AL. (5 divination wizard, 2 knowledge cleric)
He's a ranking member of the cloaks of mulmaster and travels the sword coast solving crimes. Recently he read a book in Qualith which gave him an indefinite form of madness that makes him want to eat brains, which he thinks is perfectly normal and is the reason why he's so smart.

Race: High elf
Wizard cantrips: Chill touch, prestidigitation, minor illusion, shocking grasp, toll the dead (high elf)
Cleric cantrips: Guidance, resistance, thaumaturgy

Wizard spells:
Level 1: Absorb elements, shield
Level 2: Detect thoughts, dragonsbreath, hold person, misty step
Level 3: Counterspell, fireball

Cleric spells: Cure wounds, guiding bolt, bless, identify(Domain), command(Domain) protection from good and evil, inflict wounds

That's hilarious. We are probably in the same karass (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bokononism).

[Yakmala]

I played almost this exact build in AL a while back. Forest Gnome, Knowledge 1 / Divination X. It was a blast.

There's nothing quite like rolling a 1-2 on Portent, saving it for the final boss, telling everyone in the party to hold back the first round until you get your turn, then casting Hold Person/Monster on the final boss, giving if an auto-fail for his save and having everyone unload with their free crits!

Two words of warning on Portent:

1: Every session is different, and for every time you roll a 1 or a 20 on the Portent dice, there's going to be a time where you roll a pair of 10's.

2: Portent's ability to negatively impact bosses drops considerably at higher levels when said bosses start getting access to Legendary Saves.

That being said, it's still one of the most enjoyable sub-class abilities in the game.

[GreyBlack]

I always like to bring up that there is a very cheesy reading of the Wizard spellcasting that might allow them to cast level 3 spells despite technically being only a Wizard 3/ Cleric 2. It's a _very_ narrow interpretation, but if your DM accepts it, I usually advocate for Cleric 2 in this multiclass. YMMV though. It's incredibly cheesy.

[djreynolds]

Just remember how good resistance can be, I see as poor man's counter charm.

Just tell them DM I will always be concentrating on this.... the unfortunate side is you will lose out on perception checks by maintaining concentration but someone else can do those.

Also, you may not make it to level 20, so a few more levels of cleric might not hurt, especially knowledge cleric's channel divinity.

[DrKerosene]

I would recommend your +1 Book be XGtE, as I’m suggesting getting the spell Mind Spike when you are level 7. It could easily allow you to forgo most other damage spells in favor of focusing on utility and buffs. I’m including a link, just think of replacing all the level 1 Magic Missile spells with casting non-concentration buffs like Longstrider, Jump, Mage Armor, or other spells on your allies, and then refreshing your slots in-combat by spamming Mind Spike.

http://reddit.com/r/3d6/comments/7pmth7/5e_revolutionizing_divination_wizard_the_math/

Edit:
... the unfortunate side is you will lose out on perception checks by maintaining concentration but someone else can do those..

Is there a page that can be referenced for this? I thought Concentration was not a debuff in that kind of way.

[McSkrag]

I would recommend your +1 Book be XGtE, as I’m suggesting getting the spell Mind Spike when you are level 7. It could easily allow you to forgo most other damage spells in favor of focusing on utility and buffs. I’m including a link, just think of replacing all the level 1 Magic Missile spells with casting non-concentration buffs like Longstrider, Jump, Mage Armor, or other spells on your allies, and then refreshing your slots in-combat by spamming Mind Spike.

+1 for XGtE as your PHB+1.

Yes, Mind Spike should definitely be on the list once you get Expert Divination. The ability to do psychic damage vs a WIS save and get spell slots back is great. The only downside is that it requires concentration so you need to plan around that in combat.