Two Weapon Holding - Not fighting

[nickl_2000]

Is there anything stopping a character from holding two weapons and only attacking with one, even if they aren't eligible for TWF bonus action off-hand attack?

Here is a concrete example and the why to my question. If you carry both a Whip and a Rapier, your threat range for AoOs is both 5ft and 10ft, allowing for more AoO chances. If you don't have the TWF feat, you can't use your bonus action to attack with the second weapon, but is there anything stopping you from holding both of the at once? The main situation I am considering is an Arcane Trickster/Bladesinger who takes a whip as the Bladesinger weapon (note, I realize that this would require Warcaster, which I would want anyways for BB on AoOs). This allows for more off turn AoOs which significantly ups the damage the character can do in a round.

[Shuruke]

As far as I know their is no rules stopping a character from holding weapons in both hands

Your not eligible for twf but with sentinel you could hit enemies at up to 10 feat

[nickl_2000]

As far as I know their is no rules stopping a character from holding weapons in both hands

Your not eligible for twf but with sentinel you could hit enemies at up to 10 feat

Actually the last bullet of Sentinel doesn't apply in this situation (get AoO when they attack someone other than you). That only works if they are withing 5 feet of you.

[Shuruke]

Actually the last bullet of Sentinel doesn't apply in this situation (get AoO when they attack someone other than you). That only works if they are withing 5 feet of you.

Thanks for correction didn't have phb handy so just googled and didn't see that bullet

So other then enemies provoking aoo from farther away I don't see the benefit (aoo dont seem to come up That often unless u have a way to make them, dissonant whispers etc)

[nickl_2000]

Thanks for correction didn't have phb handy so just googled and didn't see that bullet

So other then enemies provoking aoo from farther away I don't see the benefit (aoo dont seem to come up That often unless u have a way to make them, dissonant whispers etc)

Well, you are threatening at a 5 foot range and a 10 foot range. So, someone provokes AoOs if they leaves a 5ft radius or a 10ft radius. That's a fairly significant increase in chances for an AoO. Besides, if you want to take Warcaster anyways, where is the negative in doing that?

[Contrast]

I guess there is an argument about what constitutes your reach in terms of triggering opportunity attacks - why, for example, does that person get to make an opp attack when someone moves more than 5ft away but someone only using a weapon with a range of 10ft doesn't? They can attack perfectly fine at 5ft without hindrance or they may simply be a large creature.

But no there's nothing stopping you that I can see other than the opportunity cost of not wearing a shield which is presumably what you'd otherwise be doing with the off hand.

It's also worth saying that I'm not sure I've ever made an opportunity attack outside of polearm mastery so YMMV on how worthwhile this actually is.

Edit - Right sorry bladesinger. You could BB but warcaster doesn't get you around the M components required for other spells so you wouldn't be able to cast most spells while doing this.

[Misterwhisper]

I guess there is an argument about what constitutes your reach in terms of triggering opportunity attacks - why, for example, does that person get to make an opp attack when someone moves more than 5ft away but someone only using a weapon with a range of 10ft doesn't? They can attack perfectly fine at 5ft without hindrance or they may simply be a large creature.

But no there's nothing stopping you that I can see other than the opportunity cost of not wearing a shield which is presumably what you'd otherwise be doing with the off hand.

It's also worth saying that I'm not sure I've ever made an opportunity attack outside of polearm mastery so YMMV on how worthwhile this actually is.

Edit - Right sorry bladesinger. You could BB but warcaster doesn't get you around the M components required for other spells so you wouldn't be able to cast most spells while doing this.

Also the fact that BB does not work at weapon range, it works at 5 feet.

[Unoriginal]

It is indeed possible to hold two weapons even if they don't qualify for TWF.


You can choose with which weapon you hit, and if you have Extra Attack you could attack with either.

Ex: you have a battleaxe, a rapier, and 2 attacks. You could do 2 axe attacks, 2 rapier attacks, or one of each.

If you don't have Extra Attack you cna just use either one whenever you get an attack.

[JackPhoenix]

I guess there is an argument about what constitutes your reach in terms of triggering opportunity attacks - why, for example, does that person get to make an opp attack when someone moves more than 5ft away but someone only using a weapon with a range of 10ft doesn't? They can attack perfectly fine at 5ft without hindrance or they may simply be a large creature.

If you have reach weapon, you can still make OAs if someone leaves 5' of you, though it would have to be made with unarmed strike.

[nickl_2000]

I guess there is an argument about what constitutes your reach in terms of triggering opportunity attacks - why, for example, does that person get to make an opp attack when someone moves more than 5ft away but someone only using a weapon with a range of 10ft doesn't? They can attack perfectly fine at 5ft without hindrance or they may simply be a large creature.

But no there's nothing stopping you that I can see other than the opportunity cost of not wearing a shield which is presumably what you'd otherwise be doing with the off hand.

It's also worth saying that I'm not sure I've ever made an opportunity attack outside of polearm mastery so YMMV on how worthwhile this actually is.

Edit - Right sorry bladesinger. You could BB but warcaster doesn't get you around the M components required for other spells so you wouldn't be able to cast most spells while doing this.

Yup, but the character I have in mind is mostly an AT and only a dip into bladesinger for goodies. The spells needed on a regular basis would be Booming Blade (V,M component of a weapon), GFB (V,M component a weapon), Shield (V,S), Feather Fall (this one becomes an issue), and Absorb Elements (S)


Also the fact that BB does not work at weapon range, it works at 5 feet.

A lot of tables, mind included, allow Spell Sniper to be allowed with BB. So, it would work with Warcaster. Also, it would work fine with a the rapier without spell sniper.

[Shuruke]

Tbh if I was doing a hold two weapon build

Spear and whip
Polearm master
Sentinel
Just says when an enemy enters reach
On Pam
Totem barbarian, I believe its eagle that has the not provoke aoo

Go in hit with spear (which was added to Pam in an errata)
Hit with spear Pam

Could also do this with ancestral guardian by staying at range of whip

[nickl_2000]

I think, in the end, the key question on this ends up being. How much of this kind of stuff can I get away without annoying my DM and other players?

[Unoriginal]

I think, in the end, the key question on this ends up being. How much of this kind of stuff can I get away without annoying my DM and other players?

Well, you know your DM and your fellow players, while we don't. Why not ask them?

[Misterwhisper]

I think, in the end, the key question on this ends up being. How much of this kind of stuff can I get away without annoying my DM and other players?

Considering how much your are having to put into all of this just to make it work and even then it is still going to be VERY rare to come up, I can not see it annoying anyone.

It is really not worth it considering how much it takes to get it to work.

[nickl_2000]

Considering how much your are having to put into all of this just to make it work and even then it is still going to be VERY rare to come up, I can not see it annoying anyone.

It is really not worth it considering how much it takes to get it to work.

*put on best Jeff Goldblum voice*
You were so preoccupied with whether you could that you didn't stop to think if you should :smallcool:

A valid criticism.

[Rukelnikov]

If you have reach weapon, you can still make OAs if someone leaves 5' of you, though it would have to be made with unarmed strike.

Not the first time I read this, but I don't know where this is, is it SAC?

PHB rules don't constrain which melee attack you can do with an OA:
"To make the opportunity attack, you use your reaction to make one melee attack against the provoking creature[...]"

Also I think the multiple threatened areas thing would mean every monster with attacks with different reachs would become better lockdowners.

[Dalebert]

You can even attack with both weapons if you have extra attack. You just wouldn't get a bonus action attack from TWF without the feat. Not that there's much benefit from doing so. Just saying it's legal.

[DarkKnightJin]

Question: Doesn't Bladesong go poof if you don't have at least 1 hand free? I think that was a condition for that.

It might 'answer' your question on a way you hadn't considered.

[nickl_2000]

Question: Doesn't Bladesong go poof if you don't have at least 1 hand free? I think that was a condition for that.

It might 'answer' your question on a way you hadn't considered.

Nope, bladesong only poofs "if you don medium or heavy armour or a shield, or if you use two hands to make an attack with a weapon. "

That was a change from previous editions. You can now have a weapon in each hand.

[Greywander]

Is there anything stopping a character from holding two weapons and only attacking with one, even if they aren't eligible for TWF bonus action off-hand attack?
Short answer: No, nothing is stopping you from doing this.

Slightly longer answer: There is no concept of "main hand" and "off hand" in 5e; all characters are mechanically ambidextrous. You're holding a weapon, you can attack with that weapon. Holding another weapon? You can choose which of the two to attack with, and switch it up on subsequent attacks if you have the Extra Attack feature. TWF only comes into play when you want to use your bonus action to make an attack with a second weapon.

An example of this is that you could hold a weapon in each hand where one does one kind of damage and the other does another kind of damage. Like a rapier and a warhammer. BPS type damage doesn't see much resistance or vulnerability, unless it's against all BPS damage, but you could imagine a scenario where you had one enemy that was strong against bludgeoning and weak against piercing, with another enemy that was the other way around. So you carry both weapons so that you can use the best weapon depending on which enemy you're attacking at that moment. A more likely example might be having two magic weapons, a flaming sword in one hand, and a frozen mallet in the other. Which one you use will depend on whether that particular enemy is weak to fire or cold damage.

All of this said, there's not usually much benefit to holding two weapons if you're not TWF. Often, you're better off using a shield, if you have proficiency, wielding a two-handed weapon, if that's an option, or just leaving a hand free for using items, casting spells, and grappling. In your case, you can't use a shield or two-handed weapon, so it's just a question of if you'd rather have a hand free for spells and whatnot.

Keep in mind that BB requires material components, so you need a hand free to use a component pouch or wand (Warcaster only applies to somatic components, not material). You'll need to find a way to use one of your weapons as a spell focus to get it to work, RAW. A warlock dip can accomplish this, I believe. Your DM might also be more lenient. You could also homebrew a magic weapon that can be used as a spell focus.

[NatureKing]

Not the first time I read this, but I don't know where this is, is it SAC?

PHB rules don't constrain which melee attack you can do with an OA:
"To make the opportunity attack, you use your reaction to make one melee attack against the provoking creature[...]"

Also I think the multiple threatened areas thing would mean every monster with attacks with different reachs would become better lockdowners.

It is a made up statement. The rules do not dictate what weapon you attack with, nor do they dictate that it much be the the weapon that causes the attack to take place. However, it is a melee attack, which therefore must be within reach.

Give that there are no prevention outside of some specific edge cases I've forgotten about to making attacks with reach weapons at enemies 5ft, yes, a creature moving 5ft away but remaining within 10ft leaves the reach of that creatures 5ft unarmed strike reach, thus triggering OA which can be made with the creatures pike or glaive or whatever.

[nickl_2000]

Keep in mind that BB requires material components, so you need a hand free to use a component pouch or wand (Warcaster only applies to somatic components, not material). You'll need to find a way to use one of your weapons as a spell focus to get it to work, RAW. A warlock dip can accomplish this, I believe. Your DM might also be more lenient. You could also homebrew a magic weapon that can be used as a spell focus.

Thanks for the long thoughts. One correction though, booming blade does have a material component. That component is a weapon. So, you don't need to have a component pouch or wand.... You are holding a weapon in each hand.

[Greywander]

Thanks for the long thoughts. One correction though, booming blade does have a material component. That component is a weapon. So, you don't need to have a component pouch or wand.... You are holding a weapon in each hand.
Herp derp, you're right. Even as I was typing it, I kept second-guessing myself. Like, I knew something was off about what I was saying, but didn't bother to crack open the books and check.

Technically, everything I said is correct. You do need a free hand to use the material components. It's just that you already are holding the component, ergo the requirement is satisfied.