Hengeyokai Sorcerer

[cartejos]

Standards set for upcoming campaign by DM:
-Reduce final LA by 1, for free, does not count as buy-off
-Buy off is allowed
-One Flaw


I want to play a scout sorcerer.
I'm planning on playing a sparrow hengeyokai.
Also adding on Half-Ogre and Primordial Giant for the CL(0 RHD+1 Knack) 1 Invisibility at-will.

My plan is to be a scout-caster.

I enjoy both wizards and Sorcerers and the character will have +2 to both int and cha, so I am not sure which would be better in this scenario.

Suggestions?

[SirNibbles]

Standards set for upcoming campaign by DM:
-Reduce final LA by 1, for free, does not count as buy-off
-Buy off is allowed
-One Flaw


I want to play a scout sorcerer.
I'm planning on playing a sparrow hengeyokai.
Also adding on Half-Ogre and Primordial Giant for the CL(0 RHD+1 Knack) 1 Invisibility at-will.

My plan is to be a scout-caster.

I enjoy both wizards and Sorcerers and the character will have +2 to both int and cha, so I am not sure which would be better in this scenario.

Suggestions?

"Hengeyokai are... creatures of the humanoid (shapechanger) type..." - Dragon Magazine #318, page 34 (Oriental Adventures Update for 3.5)

"The base creature's type does not change." - Dragon Magazine #313, pages 95-96: Creating a Half-Ogre

"'Primordial' is an inherited template that can be added to any giant..." - Secrets of Xen'drik, page 81

[cartejos]

"Hengeyokai are... creatures of the humanoid (shapechanger) type..." - Dragon Magazine #318, page 34 (Oriental Adventures Update for 3.5)

"The base creature's type does not change." - Dragon Magazine #313, pages 95-96: Creating a Half-Ogre

"'Primordial' is an inherited template that can be added to any giant..." - Secrets of Xen'drik, page 81

Giant Blood (Ex): For all special abilities and effects, a half-ogre is considered a giant in addition to the base creature's type and subtype. Half-ogres can use magic items with racially specific powers as giants.

[SirNibbles]

Giant Blood (Ex): For all special abilities and effects, a half-ogre is considered a giant in addition to the base creature's type and subtype. Half-ogres can use magic items with racially specific powers as giants.

I don't think an inherited template qualifies as a special ability or effect. If your DM allows it, go for it.

___


Between Sorcerer and Wizard, I'd say go Wizard since you'll get more skill points from an Int build.

[Mike Miller]

One thing you can do to help pick sorc or wiz would be compiling a list of spells you will definitely want, spells you probably want, and spells you may want occasionally. If the number far exceeds what a sorcerer has known, go wizard. Otherwise you will be stuck with scrolls and/or wands. However, if you can fit them all into a sorcerer's known list, take sorcerer.

[liquidformat]

I vote beguiler, it has the skill list to backup being a scout which neither sorcerer nor wizard do. Unless you meant you are going scout/wizard or scout/sorcerer; in which case scout/wizard is better but I still might go with beguiler anyways depending on what build you are looking at...

[Maat Mons]

Being able to turn into a sparrow probably negates the need for Hide and Move Silently. No one suspects the butterfly sparrow.

You might still want Listen and Spot. Those are both pretty hard skills to get, actually. Sorcerer could get one or the other as a class skill from the Draconic Heritage feat.

Personally, I'd play as a Psion, so I could cast in sparrow form without needing to jump through a lot of hoops. And if you're a Seer, you get Listen and Spot handed right to you.

If you go with Sorcerer or Wizard, and you still want to cast in sparrow form, I think you'll need both Eschew Materials and Surrogate Spellcasting. And the latter requires Wis 13, which isn't the best combo with the -2 Wis from hengeyokai.

[cartejos]

I've always disregarded beguilers, but that does seem like a great idea. No I'm not planning on taking levels of scout, just figured a fine sized flying invisible caster would be an excellent recon unit

[Maat Mons]

There are two more things I'd like to add.

The first is to point out that I made a post just one minute before your most recent post, so you might not have seen it.

The second is to point out that Telepaths can select an ACF that gives telepathy, which could be really handy if you want to communicate with your party members while in sparrow form.

[SirNibbles]

I've always disregarded beguilers, but that does seem like a great idea. No I'm not planning on taking levels of scout, just figured a fine sized flying invisible caster would be an excellent recon unit

If you're looking for reconnaissance, the Master Linguist feat (Races of Eberron, page 109) gives you a bunch of extra languages known (one every time you level up and one when you take the feat). It's useful for listening in on conversations and has the benefit of working in an antimagic field. If you start with at least 14 Int you can take it at first level as a Hengeyokai.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Wizard (Illusionist) with the Chains of Disbelief and Shadow Shaper ACFs (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#illusionistVariants). That gets you Hide as a class skill and you can add your Int bonus to your Hide checks at Wizard 5, if you don't jump into Master Specialist after 3rd. You'll want a decent Hide check for Darkstalker, which allows you to avoid detection by scent, tremorsense, blindsense, lifesense, blindsight, and nearly any other means of detection that would overcome your invisibility.

[TalonOfAnathrax]

I've always disregarded beguilers, but that does seem like a great idea. No I'm not planning on taking levels of scout, just figured a fine sized flying invisible caster would be an excellent recon unit

Beguilers are absolutely awesome. At low level they are straight-up better that Wizards or Sorcerers (they have all the good spells + some extra situational spells), and they also come with better HP and vastly better skills. And a high levels, they remain a very solid choice. They also get easier access to excellent PrCs like Unseen Seer, and work well with Shadowcraft Mage + Heighten Spell.
If you want a stealth machine, a Tiny-sized (sparrow Hengeyokai) Beguiler with Darkstalker is absolutely fantastic!

On the other hand, a class that can use its abilities without need for verbal or somatic components goes very well with Sparrow Hengeyokai. I'd like to suggest taking Psion, or maybe even Warlock if that's the route you want to take.

[cartejos]

I’m like 95 percent sure that sparrow form Hengeyokai are fine sized, at least that’s what my chart says, and the 3.5 update didn’t change that. However, because I just looked to make sure, I did realize that the 3.5 update removed their level adjustment!

Also, I’m planning on taking surrogate casting to cover verbal and somatics. Also going to be looking into grabbing a level of mind bender for mindsense

[DrMotives]

I’m like 95 percent sure that sparrow form Hengeyokai are fine sized, at least that’s what my chart says, and the 3.5 update didn’t change that. However, because I just looked to make sure, I did realize that the 3.5 update removed their level adjustment!

Also, I’m planning on taking surrogate casting to cover verbal and somatics. Also going to be looking into grabbing a level of mind bender for mindsense

Yeah, the level adjustment was removed because "shapechanger" is no longer a creature type in 3.5, so now they're humanoids with the shapechanger subtype. That means they're like lesser planetouched, not immune to things like charm person that affect humanoids.