Necromancer Command Undead: Best undead choices

[Dalebert]

I just hit 14 and got this feature. The best suggestion I've heard so far is Zombie Beholder. The utility seems great and it can make its saving throw. Still have to find one, of course.

Anyone have other suggestions for good undead to use this on? Once I'm 17th with True Polymorph, what a good candidate for creating?

[MaxWilson]

I just hit 14 and got this feature. The best suggestion I've heard so far is Zombie Beholder. The utility seems great and it can make its saving throw. Still have to find one, of course.

Anyone have other suggestions for good undead to use this on? Once I'm 17th with True Polymorph, what a good candidate for creating?

This sounds like a variant of the so-called Secretary Problem: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secretary_problem

The classic answer is "Mummy Lord is likely the best," but unless/until you have True Polymorph the real answer is "whatever tough undead creature you happen to find with Int under 12 (ideally under 8)." Vampire spawns are good and have regeneration; Nightwalkers are beefy and hit hard; Banshees are good scouts and offer fear as crowd control; an ancient white dracolich would be fantastic; but none of that matters if the only undead you can find are Boneclaws and Death Tyrants. If that happens, then just enjoy attempting to control the Boneclaws and Death Tyrants, and if it works then use them for most of an hour and then kill them before they break free.

[Dalebert]

The best suggestion I've heard so far is Zombie Beholder. The utility seems great and it can make its saving throw.

Meant it CAN'T make it's save which is nice



The classic answer is "Mummy Lord is likely the best," but unless/until you have True Polymorph the real answer is "whatever tough undead creature you happen to find with Int under 12 (ideally under 8)."

This much is pretty clear. I have to find it which is why I said...


Once I'm 17th with True Polymorph, what's a good candidate for creating?

Meanwhile it's still a valid question in the meantime because I may be in a position to decide between what I'm controlling and some new encounter. Under 12 int seems a given so let's just establish that as not in doubt. I'm talking about for the long term and that excludes anything too smart.

[MaxWilson]

Meanwhile it's still a valid question in the meantime because I may be in a position to decide between what I'm controlling and some new encounter. Under 12 int seems a given so let's just establish that as not in doubt. I'm talking about for the long term and that excludes anything too smart.

Again, Mummy Lord would be my go-to. Mobility, immunity to normal weapons, hits like a truck in melee, spellcasting, and immortality. Because it's over CR 9 you will have to create it from a high-CR creature instead of from an object. (And it's best to Feeblemind it + Bestow Curse (curse: disadvantage on Cha saves) before you Command Undead.) Also, watch out for Dispel Magic and antimagic zones, but that applies to anything created via True Polymorph.

[Witty Username]

Hunt down a Nightwalker, they are the best in the game for this as I understand it.

[MaxWilson]

Hunt down a Nightwalker, they are the best in the game for this as I understand it.

A Nightwalker is just a big stupid necrotic giant, and they're a pain as pets because they destroy all life around them. You'd be better off with a Mummy Lord (does way more damage and has immortality and spellcasting), a Dracolich, or even a zombie Beholder (for tunnelling via disintegration rays) or a Ghost or Banshee.

[Rentirith]

In terms of true polymorph, remember that the spell has some innate limits on the power of a creature it can make. If you are making a creature out of an object, there is a limit of cr 9, and the mummy lord is cr 15, so you are correct in saying you will have to find one. You could theoretically turn a creature into one, and that would be a pretty cool idea of a powerful necromancer cursing a previous enemy into an undead servant, but the creature has to have a cr equal to or greater than the one you are turning it into (>= 15 in this case) which doesn't bode well for your ability to follow through with that plan. Still worth considering though.

For undead to create that are cr 9 and below that you can maintain concentration on...the Bodak from VGtM is interesting with a damage aoe that it can turn off, and it has a low dc insta-death ability to take care of thugs while you take care of the main threats in a fight. However, they take constant damage while in sunlight, so it might be wise to invest in a portable hole if you go this route.

Another is a plain old wight. It may not have the greatest stats, but it can maintain its own squad of zombies for you. Those zombies dont benefit from your level 6 ability, but it is still about a dozen extra minions on a semi-permanent basis. Perfect for maintaining light security, or dress them up as servers for your eeevil banquet.

Food for thought.

[Dalebert]

I did a little browse of Mordenkainen's and I agree that a Nightwalker is just completely impractical to keep as a minion. it would be a great gaurdian of a location but that's not that useful to me as an adventurer.

Came across a boneclaw. You might think "But Dalebert, a boneclaw is intelligent. It will get advantage on the save and get to save again every hour." To that I would say that I will soon have a save DC of 20 and the boneclaw is -1 to charisma saves. At that point, it can never make its save!

But that will take a few more levels. Just 19 DC for now. Meanwhile I do like the idea of a bodak or a vampire spawn. The latter shouldn't be too hard to find. They're pretty common monsters. Bodaks a little less so but maybe I'll get lucky. I already have a portable hole. I can even buy a 2nd one if I want and I might (it's AL). I kinda want one just for undead and another for other things.

He's in the Dungeon of the Mad Mage and looks like we'll keep going possibly through tier 4.

[No brains]

Is this counting the feeblemind cheese of command undead? Any undead can have a low Int if you just believe hard enough. :smalltongue:

I would recommend aiming low and using command undead on something you can make. Next level, creating and commanding a wight will give you even more zombies to control.

[MaxWilson]

Is this counting the feeblemind cheese of command undead? Any undead can have a low Int if you just believe hard enough. :smalltongue:

Well, the problem that gives you is that then they don't understand language (and can't cast spells) or communicate intelligibly. It's a serious inconvenience.

[Dalebert]

My first game as a level 14 necromancer, we ran into vampire spawn. We had priests of Kelemvor with us, so I couldn't really get away with overtly controlling undead but I had a plan. It saved on my first attempt and then got killed by my party. They were womping pretty hard on the 2nd one and my heart was sinking, expecting it to die before my next attempt. Then a zombie beholder showed up. Oh yeah! With telepathic bond, I conveyed to everyone that the zombie beholder would be very susceptible to suggestion so just let me handle it. I controlled it automatically (can't make the save) and then "suggested" that it would certainly be destroyed by the powerful clerics of Kelemvor so it should cease all hostilities toward my party and flee and find a hiding place. I verbally told my homunculus to fly about and see if other undead were coming but telepathically told it to follow the beholder so I could find it again after our mission was complete.

It's nice but will be a little less amazing in the Mad Mage Dungeon where it can't disintegrate walls. I think I'd still grab a boneclaw if given the chance.