Who will be the star

[MikelaC1]

With phase3 firmly in the rear view mirror, who will become the focus of the MCU? Tony/Ironman and to a lesser extent Cpt. America were the stars or focus of most, if not all of the action up until now, who will take their place? Spiderman is probably the most well known of the heros left (at least to the non-comic book crowd) but does his position as a teenage kid more focused on local crime preclude him from becoming the driving force of the films? Cpt. Marvel seems way too overpowered to be popping in to help with other missions (although they did an excellent job of giving her a crowing moment without totally running the show) and Dr. Strange just doesnt strike me as a universe builder. Black Panther seemed to try as hard as he could to not be concerned with the rest of the world or the Avengers and while Falcon got the shield, he still strikes me as a support character, ditto for War Machine.

[JadedDM]

Well, if we go by which films made the most money, then the focus will shift to Captain Marvel and Black Panther.

[Magic_Hat]

I find it adorable people actually believe RDJ won't return as Tony Stark at some point. I classify that right along with believing Santa and the Easter Bunny are real.

[Rynjin]

I find it adorable people actually believe RDJ won't return as Tony Stark at some point. I classify that right along with believing Santa and the Easter Bunny are real.

You find it hard to believe that an actor who's been playing the same role for over a decade would want to move on to other things? Or even retire, at RDJ's age.

[Magic_Hat]

You find it hard to believe that an actor who's been playing the same role for over a decade would want to move on to other things? Or even retire, at RDJ's age.

Wouldn't be the first time an elderly actor who's way too old to be playing a part returned to his most iconic (or one of his most iconic) roles. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_Jones_and_the_Kingdom_of_the_Crystal_Skull )

Is RDJ permanently out as Iron Man? Maybe. I'm not psychic It's definitely possible. But I do find it adorable all you people out there are 100% convinced he's never returning.

[Kitten Champion]

Wouldn't be the first time an elderly actor who's way too old to be playing a part returned to his most iconic (or one of his most iconic) roles. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiana_Jones_and_the_Kingdom_of_the_Crystal_Skull )

Is RDJ permanently out as Iron Man? Maybe. I'm not psychic It's definitely possible. But I do find it adorable all you people out there are 100% convinced he's never returning.

They didn't go to painstaking efforts to create a conclusion to Indy's character arc, kill off his character in an extended death scene, and then provide a funeral scene for him where virtually everyone in the universe is in attendance.

That could be interpreted by reasonable people as signalling to the audience that he's probably not coming back, yes.

[Rynjin]

{Scrubbed}

[Dienekes]

Guys, he just wants people to know how smart he is for not buying into a story that everyone likes, proving he is better than all those people who do like it. Letting him feel all superior with his obviously vast intelligence.

Ignore him, he doesn't actually offer anything relevant to the thread. And the more you'll argue the more superior he will feel that us simple minded folk don't recognize the greatness of his rhetoric.

Anyway. I kind of hope that the next series revolves more along the lines of Peter Parker. Captain Marvel may very well be the leader, but I honestly wasn't particularly impressed with her movie, and since she is more firmly established in the space side of things I have a feeling she'll actually be more like Thor. Who mostly goes off and does his own thing until the big Avengers crossover.

[Zevox]

With phase3 firmly in the rear view mirror, who will become the focus of the MCU? Tony/Ironman and to a lesser extent Cpt. America were the stars or focus of most, if not all of the action up until now, who will take their place? Spiderman is probably the most well known of the heros left (at least to the non-comic book crowd) but does his position as a teenage kid more focused on local crime preclude him from becoming the driving force of the films? Cpt. Marvel seems way too overpowered to be popping in to help with other missions (although they did an excellent job of giving her a crowing moment without totally running the show) and Dr. Strange just doesnt strike me as a universe builder. Black Panther seemed to try as hard as he could to not be concerned with the rest of the world or the Avengers and while Falcon got the shield, he still strikes me as a support character, ditto for War Machine.
I can only assume by that you mean the Avengers films in particular, since the MCU as a whole doesn't have a particular focus character. Each lead is the star of their own films, with anyone else who shows up being a guest star playing second banana (aside from maybe Tony in Civil War, but that film was basically an Avengers film in everything but name).

As far as the Avengers goes though, my money is on Black Panther stepping into the leadership/focus role. He's got the background for it and has proven himself to be a popular character, and if you saw his film you know that the whole "not wanting to concern himself with the rest of the world" thing ended at the end of that, so he seems like the natural fit. Captain Marvel, Doctor Strange, and Spider-Man all seem likely to take on bigger roles in future Avengers films as well. I could also see us seeing more of Scarlet Witch now that she's not just lying low with Vision. War Machine I'm not even sure if they'll continue using at all without Iron Man around, since they've used him so little even when he was.

Sam/Falcon is a big question at this point - does he get to be the new Captain America, or does he just use the shield as Falcon? Does he get his own films, or just continue to play a supporting role in Avengers ones? Winter Soldier's fate is probably tied to this too, he might fade away without Cap around, or be kept around as a supporting character, especially if Sam gets his own films (either as Falcon or Captain America).

Plus there's also the distinct possibility of new characters that take up the focus. The whole Disney buyout of Fox means that Marvel can start bringing the X-Men and Fantastic Four into the MCU whenever they want now, and those could easily become big focuses of future crossover films.


I find it adorable people actually believe RDJ won't return as Tony Stark at some point. I classify that right along with believing Santa and the Easter Bunny are real.
If he ever does, I wouldn't expect it for quite a long time, and likely wouldn't last longer than a film or two tops. Pretty clear he wants to be done with it at this point, and they wrote him out more thoroughly than any other character. For the foreseeable future, the MCU is definitely without Tony Stark.

[oudeis]

{Scrubbed}

[farothel]

I don't know the comics, but maybe they will focus on Black Panther and/or Spiderman while bringing in other characters from the comics in their movies to see if the audience love them. They can then get new movies of their own and feature more in the cross-overs.

Also if I'm not mistaken Disney also got the X-men now, so they can start drawing from those as well if they want to.

[Mightymosy]

Scarlet Witch is my favourite character to watch. It's a shame she doesn't have a movie yet.
And I suspect she won't get one. She certainly won't be the next focus character either, simply because she is a girl and that's how Hollywood works. Similarily, I very much doubt black Panther will be boss, because he is black. Did he in fact even appear in Avengers: Endgame??

As much good as the MCU people are, in some aspects they are very "traditional" if you are honestly looking at stuff without shaded glasses.

Especially not after the whole Star Wars debacle. TLJ sucked because a whole lot of reasons, but people will decide to think it was because Girls! and won't "risk" ruining the MCU franchise.

I'd bet money the find some new white male protagonist(s) to steer the avenger team or what have you.

If they really can use Wolverine and Professor X now, I bet that they will try to milk those. Classic male brain and male brute for the world. Worked before, will work again.

Maybe some second stringer director will get a shot to make a female lead movie (for the quota), maybe Squirrel Girl or what have you. It will suck for some reasons other than being about girls, and people will use it as a proof that this just won't work.
I don't like it - fact I HATE it (because I love watching cool female heroes. Jes, I am a hedonistic egotistocal guy like that).
But I realise this is just how these movie business people work.
I would be VERY surprised if they made the MCU female centered.
They had all the chances before, and didn't do it. They won't do it now.
Who fought Thanos? A might triumvirate of Thor, Iron MAN and Captain America.
Who made the master plan? Dr Strange.

How many enemies did "the greatest assasin in the galaxy" - Gamorra - kill?
Hell, they even managed to take away Nebula's character arc - as I was informed, in the comics SHE gets to use the infinity gauntlet. Wouldn't that have been a logical concusion to give her the opportunity to get revenge on her abusive "dad"?
Oh no, can't have THAT, that one's for the boys, see.

[MikelaC1]

Did he in fact even appear in Avengers: Endgame??.

He, and all of his countrymen showed up in the final battle against Thanos, he even organized them into their ranks. He got about as much movie time as most of the other returned heros, except for Scarlet Witch, who set the bar for being pissed at Thanos

[Mightymosy]

Which means about none, in comparison to Thor, Iron Man, Captain America.

Heck, even Dr Strange and Spidey I remember - and they were "returned" as well, weren't they?

Come to think of it, there even was a scene when a couple of female heroes went shoulder to shoulder in some "let's show we can kick ass as well" fashion. Do you remember ANYTHING of that action scene? I honestly don't.

I remember the brief scene with Scarlet Witch - which showed her as awesome as ever - Why don't they just make a movie with her??
She and Dr Strange would make up for some sweet magic-user team up special effect show.

One can dream, I guess.

I mean, even Captain Marvel: what does she do?
Shows up to showcase how she could solo the adventure - but doesn't - then destroys Thanos' ship and attends Tony's funeral.
Neat.

I don't blame them for taking a character with Superman powers to the sideline, but it certainly wasn't showcasing female hero action, no sir.

I still wonder why they don't milk that space. Chauvinism aside, they *should* be interested in money, no?
There are lots of people who like the fem action heroes, no? Heck, even the chick from How I met you mother was highly welcomed here when she showed up as assistant for that one eyed black guy - and then she never did anything in he finals.

I LIKE the Marvel movies. They are the replacement for Star Wars in the "big popcorn movie saga" department. But they also ARE classical sausage festivals with the females being eye candy for a more modern taste, but eye candy nevertheless.

[MikelaC1]

I believe Scarlet Witch is getting her own TV series. As for Cpt. Marvel, they gave her just as much action as they could. After all, what are they going to do, build up the whole battle for 10 years, 22 movies and then have a character that they just introduced a month ago waltz in and one-shot the whole battle? That would have been a let down conclusion.

[Aotrs Commander]

I rather hope it will be Carol, actually, since she became my favourite Avenger about two words of dialogue into Captain Marvel.

(Which was, incidently, about the same length of time as it took me to take to Adora from the new She-Ra. Both of which is quite an achievement. I don't think even Jubilee or Catherine Foundling got me quite that fast. Or even Thrawn, to name some of the other Best Characters.)

[GloatingSwine]

You find it hard to believe that an actor who's been playing the same role for over a decade would want to move on to other things? Or even retire, at RDJ's age.

More to the point, the cost for getting him on set now means it's much much cheaper to keep him to brief cameos at most.


It's worth noting as well though that the idea that Tony and Steve were the "stars" is mostly constrained to the Avengers movies and Civil War (which was mostly "we're sorry Age of Ultron was boring here's a free Avengers 2.5").

The rest of it is off-camera frontmanning from RDJ and Evans.

They don't actually consistently show up in other characters' movies.



If they do continue to build the universe with a particular viewpoint character for the big ticket features, it will probably be Spidey, especially because they need to dance around most of his original rogues and thus stories being separated over at Sony, so there's a big open space for the character

[Inchhighguy]

They will make the huge push to make Captain Marvel the Greatest Superhero Ever....for you know, reasons.

Black Panther....well...is a bit stuck where he is and is not ''generic" enough for the whole MCU.

And almost no one else is left.

Maybe Dr. Stange will do the ''DM" thing? Pop up and be like ''oh no danger over there, go take care of that!" He has done that in the comics for decades.

There is a good chance they will clone/copy the big three..Cap, Thor and Iron Man......but as females/anything but a white male.

Maybe they will try to make a new popular hero?

[Devonix]

I'd say it's between Captain Marvel, Black Panther, and Spiderman. Because these three have the most successful films currently. Hoping it's Black Panther, but the dark horse could be Doctor Strange.

I don't see it as being Captain Marvel because that doesn't seem to be where her story is heading.

[MikelaC1]

The problem I see with Captain Marvel is that she is the nuclear bomb of the MCU. Anything that would be a problem for her would be way over the head of any other hero.

[Devonix]

The problem I see with Captain Marvel is that she is the nuclear bomb of the MCU. Anything that would be a problem for her would be way over the head of any other hero.

Well that goes for Doctor Strange, hell Dormamu has been the most powerful villain shown in the MCU

[The Glyphstone]

Well that goes for Doctor Strange, hell Dormamu has been the most powerful villain shown in the MCU

Dormammu might have been the most powerful villain, but Strange's victory over him wasn't by overpowering him. Arguably Strange is still the most technically powerful character because time travel of any kind is hax to the max, but very little of that has been seen on-screen in the 'wins fights with cool special effects' form.

CM, I think, will have a relationship to the Gen2 Avengers the way Thor was for Gen1, as someone mentioned. Super powerful, possibly the most powerful of the team roster, but mostly occupied doing their own thing until the crossover movie.

[Magic_Hat]

They didn't go to painstaking efforts to create a conclusion to Indy's character arc, kill off his character in an extended death scene, and then provide a funeral scene for him where virtually everyone in the universe is in attendance.

Yeah. I suppose you make a good point...
I mean it's not like there was a film in the MCU that was super dark where the villain killed half the universe and the whole point of the sequel to that was to bring back all those dead people.


That could be interpreted by reasonable people as signalling to the audience that he's probably not coming back, yes.

Again you're right. It's not like Marvel puts out misleading information or even lies to try and sell movie tickets. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fINkaJoRnl0)



So your grand objection to a thread about who the lead character of a franchise is going to be now that the previous one's character is dead/actor has stepped away is "well one time this guy returned to a role he left 20 years later".

No. My grand objection is Marvel/Disney love money and have no problem manipulating their fans to get it (case and point: look at all the times they lie in their trailers) so "saying" this one character is gone forever is super manipulative and is sure to sell a bunch of movie tickets.


Even if you had a point, it's not a point relative to the thread discussion, which still has a valid question for the intervening 20 year timespan. You're just obsessed with ****ting on anything Marvel related.

I actually am contributing to the thread and am saying the next star is irrelevant because they're probably going to bring back RDJ/Stark.


{Scrubbed}
{Scrubbed}


Guys, he just wants people to know how smart he is for not buying into a story that everyone likes, proving he is better than all those people who do like it. Letting him feel all superior with his obviously vast intelligence.

A film everyone likes? That must make it good right? I mean evolution is scientific fact now and as we all know evolution never went through a controversial period where most people denied it right? "Let's all jump on the band wagon! Why think for ourselves? All praise our corporate overlords! I can't wait to watch the next 20 MCU films where an evil bad guy person wants to kill a bunch of people for underdeveloped and cliche reasons and hero-good-guy-protagonist-man has to punch the evil bad guy person in the face a bunch of times quipping all the way, and for some reason our hero doesn't want to get the help of other Avengers because Disney/Marvel will have to spend money on more actors and why would they want to invest money to make something good? I mean it's not like films are art."


Ignore him, he doesn't actually offer anything relevant to the thread. And the more you'll argue the more superior he will feel that us simple minded folk don't recognize the greatness of his rhetoric.

Again I actually am because I'm putting forth the notion RDJ might come back and return as the star.

[Kitten Champion]

I don't think they'll have a centre to the MCU anymore, personally. At least not in the way RDJ fulfilled. Endgame was clearly signalling that they aren't going to do another massive team-up movie for a while and they don't have to with all the characters they can make solo movies for, along with two pretty huge (X-Men being about as big as the rest of the Marvel Universe put together and the FF have decades of their own lore that has gone nowhere in Fox's films thus far) sub-franchises with superhero teams at their core that they'll want to blend in to the universe sooner than later.

Where the characters will be in a few years is pretty nebulous, they didn't end Endgame with a shifty-eyed dog (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T55ArHjeR1c&ab_channel=ArielMacedo) moment where "oh, the future plots will orbit around this new thing in the end credits" like with the first Avengers movie, just a whole universe in confusion that could go anywhere narratively-speaking. Without a centralized threat the heroes have no need to collaborate, and the generalized chaos necessitates them spreading out to deal with whatever's important to them at the moment.

Basically, they have a lot they need to do and they set up lot of cinematic real estate to do it in. Including building a new meta-arc for the MCU now that they've capped the last one, and adding Mutants and their whole mythos into the universe which is a big task to say the least. Still, I would argue trying to create a Downey/Evans dynamic with these characters is not where they want to go with it. Make a multi-polar universe where people like the hero(es) they like - after spending time and effort to try and make you like them in these coming movies - and whenever Marvel/Disney gets back on the Avengers wagon they can create a new dynamic specific to them.


Yeah. I suppose you make a good point...
I mean it's not like there was a film in the MCU that was super dark where the villain killed half the universe and the whole point of the sequel to that was to bring back all those dead people.

A film you haven't seen, apparently.



Again you're right. It's not like Marvel puts out misleading information or even lies to try and sell movie tickets. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fINkaJoRnl0)

Yes, trailers can be deceptive. Advertisements can be, shockingly enough. I don't really apply the same level of skepticism to the actual movie itself. I feel comfortable in my assertion that after sitting through it my senses correctly inputted the stimuli given to them, especially when everyone else who went through the same movie had a similar account of events.

So I can either believe in myself and all available evidence, or you, the bastion of objective, unvarnished truth.

It's a toughie.

[Rynjin]

I sincerely hope they don't try to make Captain Marvel the new central character. Mostly because I'll never forgive her for the absolute stupidity of Civil War 2: Minority Report Boogaloo.

[Devonix]

I sincerely hope they don't try to make Captain Marvel the new central character. Mostly because I'll never forgive her for the absolute stupidity of Civil War 2: Minority Report Boogaloo.

Blaming Film Captain Marvel for the actions of a comic book version is like blaming comic book Deadpool for the stuff he did in X-men origins.

[Kitten Champion]

Blaming Film Captain Marvel for the actions of a comic book version is like blaming comic book Deadpool for the stuff he did in X-men origins.

Or Tom Holland for One More Day.

Or Chris Evans for being secretly Hydra.

[Devonix]

Or Tom Holland for One More Day.

Or Chris Evans for being secretly Hydra.

I know what you mean, but neither of those characters actually did those things.

Comic book Captain Marvel did that stuff in Civil War 2
Comic Book Captain America didn't do that stuff in Secret empire, ( That was Red Skull altering things )
Comic book Spider-man didn't sell his marriage. ( That was Mary Jane )

But we're still in agreement.

[Saph]

Captain Marvel just seemed like a badly thought out character from the get-go, to be honest. The Avengers party balance was already creaking and groaning from the strain of trying to have Thor and Hulk on the same team as Hawkeye and Widow, so I'd no idea how they figured that it'd be a good idea to have an even more powerful character facing the same sorts of challenges. Plus the character's got the charisma of a brick, so . . . hard to see her working.

That leaves Spiderman, Black Panther, and Dr Strange. Out of the survivors, Spidey is the most popular Marvel character by a mile, but he's a kid. Dr Strange has the actor with the most star power, but his character seems to mostly take an advisor role rather than a leader-role. So that leaves Black Panther as probably the best candidate. Though they'd have to rework the character a bit if he's supposed to be representing the whole world instead of just Wakanda.

[Zevox]

Scarlet Witch is my favourite character to watch. It's a shame she doesn't have a movie yet.
And I suspect she won't get one. She certainly won't be the next focus character either, simply because she is a girl and that's how Hollywood works. Similarily, I very much doubt black Panther will be boss, because he is black. Did he in fact even appear in Avengers: Endgame??

As much good as the MCU people are, in some aspects they are very "traditional" if you are honestly looking at stuff without shaded glasses.

Especially not after the whole Star Wars debacle. TLJ sucked because a whole lot of reasons, but people will decide to think it was because Girls! and won't "risk" ruining the MCU franchise.

I'd bet money the find some new white male protagonist(s) to steer the avenger team or what have you.

If they really can use Wolverine and Professor X now, I bet that they will try to milk those. Classic male brain and male brute for the world. Worked before, will work again.

Maybe some second stringer director will get a shot to make a female lead movie (for the quota), maybe Squirrel Girl or what have you. It will suck for some reasons other than being about girls, and people will use it as a proof that this just won't work.
I don't like it - fact I HATE it (because I love watching cool female heroes. Jes, I am a hedonistic egotistocal guy like that).
But I realise this is just how these movie business people work.
I would be VERY surprised if they made the MCU female centered.
They had all the chances before, and didn't do it. They won't do it now.
Who fought Thanos? A might triumvirate of Thor, Iron MAN and Captain America.
Who made the master plan? Dr Strange.

How many enemies did "the greatest assasin in the galaxy" - Gamorra - kill?
Hell, they even managed to take away Nebula's character arc - as I was informed, in the comics SHE gets to use the infinity gauntlet. Wouldn't that have been a logical concusion to give her the opportunity to get revenge on her abusive "dad"?
Oh no, can't have THAT, that one's for the boys, see.
There's zero reason to believe that criticisms of The Last Jedi, either the justified or unjustified ones, are even going to affect Star Wars itself, much less the MCU.

And the reason that Endgame focused so heavily on the triumvrate of Iron Man, Cap, and Thor is that they've been the biggest three names since the MCU began building up to the first Avengers, and it was the last outing for two of them, so those two especially had to have their last hurrah/big damn hero moments and endings.

Meanwhile, Marvel saw quite a bit of financial success and happy viewers with Black Panther and Captain Marvel, so there's little reason not to think that those two in particular are poised to become some of the new big names of the Avengers. Whether they start to give bigger roles to minority characters that have so far only been in supporting roles, like Scarlet Witch or Falcon, is a bigger question mark, but I see little reason to doubt that we'll be seeing plenty of T'challa and Carol in the future.

[Traab]

I think that for now they arent going to go heavily mcu. By which i mean there wont be a lot of crossovers in the films. I think the next stage is building up new brand name recognition, seeing whats a hit, whats a miss, and figuring out where to go from there. Lets face it, every marvel huge team from xmen, to avengers, has a constantly changing roster, which means you can justify a dozen or more different combinations as the "new" avengers or whatever. So lots of stand alone films, see whats a hit, and maybe then bring them together into a new team up. They may just avoid it entirely. Lets face it, the fact that it turned out as well as it did was a miracle. At any point the whole thing could have collapsed because they screwed up badly enough. Trying to get audiences invested in ANOTHER 2 dozen film long series is probably pushing it. How long can the super hero bubble grow before it bursts? History books will probably talk about this as the super hero era like they talk about the days when westerns were king and john wayne was god. Or when everything was a musical with song and dance numbers like singing in the rain.

[Kyberwulf]

I think it's not going to be anyone really leading the Avengers. I think that it's mostly going to be a solo affair for everyone for a bit. I mean Tony was the glue that held it all together for a long time. Not only as a leader, but as someone who financed the whole shindig.

I don't think that Captain Marvel can lead, for the same reason that she wasn't in the movie much anyway. She has WAY to many other planets to take protect.

I also don't see how Black Panther can really lead anyone either, I mean his main focus seems to be Wakanda.

Same with Dr. Strange. He seems to have to protect us all from the Magical realms.

Most of the other characters don't seem to have the leadership ability, nor the personal charisma to be on top.

I am in the Camp of, they are bringing Tony Stark back. There has been a lot of Coming back from the dead shenanigans already. It's not going to be a stretch to say he will come back as A.I or something in some compacity. I mean, if the Black Widow thing happens and it proves popular, I bet they will somehow bring her back too. When the movies start to stall and stop selling as well as they do now, they will have to Soap Opera something up from the closet.

I think that it will happen that the Avengers will be in a sort of Limbo as they were End Game. Just basically be a "Council" type situation until the next "Avengers" movie where they will bring back Tony as something and he will draw all the people back together.

[MikelaC1]

No one sees AntMan as a leader? (j/k)

[Tvtyrant]

I imagine they will split into a bunch of little teams, like GotG, the Avengers and Roger's Crew basically were before Infinity War.

Team Thor: GotG, Nebula, Thor.
Team Official: War Machine, New Captain America, Scarlet Witch (if they don't just retire her from the movies), some new people.
Captain Marvel: Independent, probably gets her own team.
Doctor Strange: Independent, has sorcerer friends.
Furies Undergrounds: Spiderman, some other people who work for Fury directly and are less visible than Team Official.

[JadedDM]

No one sees AntMan as a leader? (j/k)

Oooh, what about the Wasp instead? She's smart and level-headed. And wasn't she the one who originally named the Avengers in the comics, too?

[Kitten Champion]

If it's just a question of a leadership role and not who will be as marketable as Downey Jr.'s Tony Stark or Chris Evans on a meta-level, I think you could easily make that a contention within the narrative itself.

I mean, Iron Man and Captain America were obviously at loggerheads, but their priorities were pretty much the same -- it was just their methods and ideals which put them in opposition. If you bring in characters like Charles Xavier and Mutantkind, Namor and the Atlanteans (who probably won't get a movie but could easily be slotted into another sub-franchise as an antagonist), Reed Richards and the Fantastic Four (who wields a lot of power, with questionable priorities), on top of the already existing Black Panther/Wakanda and a fledgling Captain America in Sam Wilson, there's a lot more room for alternative agendas among the Earth's superheroes rather than just ideological differences of how they should go about superheroing.

Say - in another couple of years - you do a Secret Invasion-type story within a climate of super-powered factions being pushed against one another, and that's your next big cross-over. Ultimately settling things between them and who's in charge, if anyone actually is.

[Delicious Taffy]

So long as Spider-Man and Doctor Strange team up, I don't care who winds up "leading" the next bundle of movies.

If they adapt Civil War II, though, I'll eat the director on live television.

[Inchhighguy]

The problem I see with Captain Marvel is that she is the nuclear bomb of the MCU. Anything that would be a problem for her would be way over the head of any other hero.

Captain Marvel is no worse then Superman. They can simply make movies where the bad guy is just as powerful....and Miss Marvel ''forgets" how to use her powers until the end of the movie.

And she could just ''guest star" in others movies. Like "Oh hey, I just saved eleven galaxies and now I'm stopping her on Earth to give you a peep talk".



Really, I think they will try and go with ''everyone is a star" sort of thing.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff: Let's keep it civil in here. While disagreements about content are fine, avoid criticizing others personally.

[Forum Explorer]

So long as Spider-Man and Doctor Strange team up, I don't care who winds up "leading" the next bundle of movies.

If they adapt Civil War II, though, I'll eat the director on live television.

Well I know what I'm funding if I win the lottery. Just gotta decide which director I hate the most. :smallbiggrin:


Anyways, I'm hoping that they'll bring in the X-Men in. Though how they would handle it would be interesting. I'm also voting Doom as the next big villain.

[Delicious Taffy]

Well I know what I'm funding if I win the lottery. Just gotta decide which director I hate the most. :smallbiggrin:


Anyways, I'm hoping that they'll bring in the X-Men in. Though how they would handle it would be interesting. I'm also voting Doom as the next big villain.

We've had Doom and the Fantastic Four twice already. Hollywood had two chances and they blew both of them. I'd personally rather see a real villain, like Frank Castle or Taskmaster or even Blackheart.

[Kitten Champion]

They have to do Doom eventually, ya'know. To do otherwise would be like DC deciding never using the Joker again after Suicide Squad. He's probably Marvel's best and most noteworthy villain, and Marvel's aware of this at least based on the way they write him.

[Forum Explorer]

We've had Doom and the Fantastic Four twice already. Hollywood had two chances and they blew both of them. I'd personally rather see a real villain, like Frank Castle or Taskmaster or even Blackheart.

Fox or Sony (can't remember which) had two tries with them and failed horribly because they evidently don't know how to write a superhero movie. I'm much more confident that Disney could pull it off.

Mind you though, I don't want them to use Doom with the Fantastic Four, at least not as their first villain. I'd rather he be used as the main villain in an Avengers film, or even as the overarching villain like Thanos was. Particularly right away, since Doom's motivation to take over the world is to protect it (and out of sheer ego), and the world just went had half of it's population wiped out and then restored.

[Mechalich]

We've had Doom and the Fantastic Four twice already. Hollywood had two chances and they blew both of them. I'd personally rather see a real villain, like Frank Castle or Taskmaster or even Blackheart.

For the purpose of the greater shared universe, rather than individual hero films, Marvel requires a villain capable of facing off with the whole team, either through extreme levels of personal power, immense weight of numbers, or both, with both being the ideal. Several powerhouse heroes remain, including Thor, Captain Marvel, Scarlet Witch, and Dr. Strange. As a result the number of 'Avengers Assemble' level threats is actually fairly limited without getting desperate.

The Marvel films are generally at their best when they have a compelling villain, and this has been a major point of difficulty for the MCU so far. The list of high quality villains is basically limited to Loki, Killmonger, and Thanos. While certain portions of the franchise, like GotG don't really need a compelling villain because they're all about the hijinks and the quipping, the next stage of the big plan will need a major villain, ideally one like Thanos who can sit in the shadows for a while and send big time minions at Earth to power a half-dozen movies before the final showdown.

Dr. Doom is at least powerful enough and he does have minions, but he has the problem that he's presumably been on Earth this whole time, which makes pulling him out of nowhere at this stage a bit tricky. This is a trait shared by pretty much all Earth-based villains going forward. If they didn't acquire their powers after Infinity War, what were they doing all this time? It seems more likely that Marvel Studios would sidestep that problem by going cosmic or extradimensional in some way. Galactus, for example, checks all the right boxes. I wouldn't personally favor going down that road, but it's there.

[GloatingSwine]

Dr. Doom is at least powerful enough and he does have minions, but he has the problem that he's presumably been on Earth this whole time, which makes pulling him out of nowhere at this stage a bit tricky. This is a trait shared by pretty much all Earth-based villains going forward. If they didn't acquire their powers after Infinity War, what were they doing all this time? It seems more likely that Marvel Studios would sidestep that problem by going cosmic or extradimensional in some way. Galactus, for example, checks all the right boxes. I wouldn't personally favor going down that road, but it's there.

It's not too hard to introduce Doom.

Paranoid isolationist micronations are already an established thing, so there's plenty of reasons why nobody has noticed him before.

(Do it by having a Fantastic Four movie set in the '60s which ends with the Four taking a trip forward in time because Reed predicts some horrible future calamity, Galactus, Annihilus, something like that, and Doom bides his time waiting and building his power, magically and technologically extending his life and making his plans to humiliate Richards when he returns, Doom is not petty but he is very detail oriented and Curse You Reed Richards is the one detail he just can't get right...)

[Mechalich]

It's not too hard to introduce Doom.

Paranoid isolationist micronations are already an established thing, so there's plenty of reasons why nobody has noticed him before.

(Do it by having a Fantastic Four movie set in the '60s which ends with the Four taking a trip forward in time because Reed predicts some horrible future calamity, Galactus, Annihilus, something like that, and Doom bides his time waiting and building his power, magically and technologically extending his life and making his plans to humiliate Richards when he returns, Doom is not petty but he is very detail oriented and Curse You Reed Richards is the one detail he just can't get right...)

Well, the trick to introducing Doom is making a good Fantastic Four movie, something that has so far eluded Hollywood. If you can do that you can certainly bring in Doom with whatever shenanigans necessary, but I'm not sure that particular risk is one that Marvel is willing to hang Phases 4 and 5 on. Thanos was a very safe villain in that he didn't have it out for any specific hero personally, so they all had roughly equal motive to fight him, and I suspect that would be the choice they'd make again. Doom would work very well for a third interconnected big bad, especially because he can very easily go extra-dimensional.

[GloatingSwine]

Well, the trick to introducing Doom is making a good Fantastic Four movie, something that has so far eluded Hollywood.

Nonsense, they've made two of them. The Incredibles and The Incredibles 2.

Okay the second one wasn't as good, but still...

[Aotrs Commander]

Anyways, I'm hoping that they'll bring in the X-Men in. Though how they would handle it would be interesting. I'm also voting Doom as the next big villain.

Juibllee was an Avenger in MC2, that's all I'm sayin'.

[The Glyphstone]

Just speculating, but as far as Doom - how crucial is his vendetta with Richards to the actual character? Could he be MCU-ized as an aspiring world dictator using magic/tech/Doombots to restore order post-Snap and protect it without directly intertwining his origins and motivations to the FF? Helmut Zemo was more or less completely rewritten for Civil War, and worked out well.

[MikelaC1]

Could he be MCU-ized as an aspiring world dictator using magic/tech/Doombots to restore order post-Snap and protect it without directly intertwining his origins and motivations to the FF?

This brings up an interesting point, how much are the post-Snap issues going to be dealt with in the movies? We all know the issues, trying to re-integrate 4 billion people into a world where the other half of the population has moved on financially, less so emotionally in some cases. What few views we had of Earth post Snap were rather apocalyptic, and would people just head back into high school, as was sort of implied with Peter? Or is this just going to be hand waved away, as in, we're interested in the telling of a story of a villain, not some world building exercise.

[Traab]

Just speculating, but as far as Doom - how crucial is his vendetta with Richards to the actual character? Could he be MCU-ized as an aspiring world dictator using magic/tech/Doombots to restore order post-Snap and protect it without directly intertwining his origins and motivations to the FF? Helmut Zemo was more or less completely rewritten for Civil War, and worked out well.

Iirc, while Doom does have his personal vendetta against richards, he is hardly monofocused on it. There is absolutely no reason why he wouldnt make moves against, say, the avengers. As ruler of latveria, it is important for him to accurately judge the capabilities, the limitations, the things that drive, the most powerful super team in the world today. Just in case he either has need of them, or he needs to destroy them. I could see him testing the various super groups that move outside of america for these reasons and more (To test himself of course, if there are weaknesses in his technology or magic or strategies, better to discover them in new york than while his enemies stride up towards his castle) Doom is the kind of guy who would send random combat bots to avengers tower to pick a fight just to analyze their skills, he is the type to setup a planet cleansing bomb for them to stop only to reveal it never existed as the entire thing collapses into scrap once he has the information he was actually after. Then we find out months later the collapse of the fake bomb hid the special tracking devices he planted on them as they left to setup his next plan. He is fully capable of performing the balancing act of how far he can go without justifying an attempted invasion of latveria while gleefully doing whatever else he wants while he stays safely out of reach. "Are you sure those robots were mine? What makes you think so? "Oh, the bomb never existed, so how can you justify doing anything to me afterwards? Its not MY fault you believed that nonsense."

As for his background, we dont really have to go that deeply into it to mention reed richards as more than a throwaway line "Oh, and for some reason he despises a young up and coming scientist by the name of reed richards. No clue why." And then later on if they DO decide to make a fantastic four movie, we can get that bit of background explained as it will be a part of the reason they are fighting doom in the first place. Otherwise the rest of his backstory is more than enough to justify him being the big bad of the setting.

[tomandtish]

This brings up an interesting point, how much are the post-Snap issues going to be dealt with in the movies? We all know the issues, trying to re-integrate 4 billion people into a world where the other half of the population has moved on financially, less so emotionally in some cases. What few views we had of Earth post Snap were rather apocalyptic, and would people just head back into high school, as was sort of implied with Peter? Or is this just going to be hand waved away, as in, we're interested in the telling of a story of a villain, not some world building exercise.

Have to assume that will probably be handwaved, as the real life issues would be way to complex to deal with.

(USA assessment only)....

It usually takes between 3-7 years to be declared legally dead. However, most states have procedures for shortening that when a person was likely the victim of a large-scale massive catastrophe (Hurricane Katrina, etc.). In those cases it can be as little as 6 months.

Most states also have a statute of limitations on how long you can annul the previous ruling. three years is the average.

So for a LOT of these people, they were declared dead, and the ruling can't be overturned. They can take steps to be declared alive (legally speaking) again, but nothing that occurred while they were dead is overturned.

So your house was sold? Too bad, it remains sold.

Wife remarried someone else? That's the new legal marriage.

All your remaining assets were divided among your heirs? Court isn't going to make them give it back.

On the positive side any paid-out life insurance policies?*** That money stays paid.

*** Although given what happened I suspect most companies selling life insurance went bankrupt and very little was actually paid.

[Tvtyrant]

If I was doing a Doctor Doom movie set I would go with Wikilinks as the basis. Latveria is hosting a series of servers which have posted GotG, Wakanda, Antman and Iron Man technology to the Internet where anyone can get them. Doom publicly argues that the Snap would not have occurred if mankind had been free to develop without government and superhero interference.

[Dienekes]

I rather hope it will be Carol, actually, since she became my favourite Avenger about two words of dialogue into Captain Marvel.

(Which was, incidently, about the same length of time as it took me to take to Adora from the new She-Ra. Both of which is quite an achievement. I don't think even Jubilee or Catherine Foundling got me quite that fast. Or even Thrawn, to name some of the other Best Characters.)

Out of curiosity what about her first words made you like her so much? Because after watching her movie I did not have anything approaching the connection to the character you had.

(Honestly I found Skrull Guy and Best Friend Lady way more interesting than Carol herself)

[Aotrs Commander]

Out of curiosity what about her first words made you like her so much? Because after watching her movie I did not have anything approaching the connection to the character you had.

(Honestly I found Skrull Guy and Best Friend Lady way more interesting than Carol herself)

I just found her, well, wit and demeanour, I guess you could say, to be immediately engaging, is all.

[farothel]

Well, the daughter of Maria Rambeau will in the comics also become a superhero (if I recall correctly from what I read on wikipedia). Maybe it's time for a timejump and a whole new set of characters. An older Spiderman can then be the mentor to the newbies.

[Chen]

Well, the daughter of Maria Rambeau will in the comics also become a superhero (if I recall correctly from what I read on wikipedia). Maybe it's time for a timejump and a whole new set of characters. An older Spiderman can then be the mentor to the newbies.

A big timejump wont happen. Too difficult actor wise particularly the younger ones. 5 yesrs only worked for Spiderman since, apparently, all his friends and people close to him got snapped so they could re-use the same actors in Far From Home.

[GloatingSwine]

Well, the daughter of Maria Rambeau will in the comics also become a superhero (if I recall correctly from what I read on wikipedia). Maybe it's time for a timejump and a whole new set of characters. An older Spiderman can then be the mentor to the newbies.

She was the second Captain Marvel. I think she goes by Spectrum now.

Bear in mind that that was set in the ‘90s and post-Unsnap is 2025.

Even if Monica was out during the Snap and lost those five years she’ll still be 30 or so, prime superheroing territory. Likely to be introduced in CM2.

[Devonix]

She was the second Captain Marvel. I think she goes by Spectrum now.

Bear in mind that that was set in the ‘90s and post-Unsnap is 2025.

Even if Monica was out during the Snap and lost those five years she’ll still be 30 or so, prime superheroing territory. Likely to be introduced in CM2.

Yep there's already been two multi year timeskips. They knew what they were thinking with introducing her as a young kid.

[Brother Oni]

I rather hope it will be Carol, actually, since she became my favourite Avenger about two words of dialogue into Captain Marvel.

With Disney bringing the X-men into the fold, hopefully Carol's first meeting with Rogue will go better than their first meeting in the comics.


As ruler of latveria, it is important for him to accurately judge the capabilities, the limitations, the things that drive, the most powerful super team in the world today.

They could set up Latveria as the dark mirror version of Wakanda - instead of being isolationist and opening up like Wakanda, they started open with events during the 20th Century pushing them more closed. Ultron's devastation of Sokovia was the straw that broke the camel's back and they fully shut their borders.

While the world is still in turmoil from post reverse Snap, Doom spots the ideal opportunity to advance Latveria's standing and power in the world, especially with several key Avengers now out of the way, and starts annexing regions of countries using the appropriate political justifications (this got a lot more political than I expected, so not adding in specific details).

[Devonix]

With Disney bringing the X-men into the fold, hopefully Carol's first meeting with Rogue will go better than their first meeting in the comics.


Ehh it didn't really go that poorly. Carol got some of her powers stolen but she got her binary powers almost immediatly after when she joined the x-men.

[GloatingSwine]

Just goes to show, even when the space alien bugs are the scientists instead of the experiment, trying to use evil science to create the ultimate weapon never ends well for you.

[Traab]

With Disney bringing the X-men into the fold, hopefully Carol's first meeting with Rogue will go better than their first meeting in the comics.



They could set up Latveria as the dark mirror version of Wakanda - instead of being isolationist and opening up like Wakanda, they started open with events during the 20th Century pushing them more closed. Ultron's devastation of Sokovia was the straw that broke the camel's back and they fully shut their borders.

While the world is still in turmoil from post reverse Snap, Doom spots the ideal opportunity to advance Latveria's standing and power in the world, especially with several key Avengers now out of the way, and starts annexing regions of countries using the appropriate political justifications (this got a lot more political than I expected, so not adding in specific details).

As an interesting aside, im reading a fanfic where doom is doing something very similar. The basic gist is, red skull has popped back up, or at the least someone claiming to be red skull, and has been making attacks on latveria, among other nations. Doom has made a deal with the fantastic four, among others, that precludes them from interfering, and he has been expanding his empire by moving into the nations where red skull is based and taking over with the justification of "Well, these nations arent able to keep this terrorist from operating there, so its my right as ruler to take over and provide that security myself." or something along those lines. He actually controls most of the former ussr satellite nations and is fairly popular as he is a benevolent despot in ruling style. Yeah he owns you, and he rules with no limit to his authority, but he genuinely improves the lives of his subjects so they are healthier, happier, more prosperous under his regime.

Oh, and all this is basically background noise to the actual story going on. But its an interesting one that got coverage while it was going on. He eventually got the red skull (Turned his skull into a drinking goblet for style points, THAT was an amusing united nations meeting) and has more or less settled down with his new territory as he isnt interested in spreading further at this time, or at least doesnt have the justification to do so. Though that might have changed after the last couple chapters.

[Brother Oni]

Ehh it didn't really go that poorly. Carol got some of her powers stolen but she got her binary powers almost immediatly after when she joined the x-men.

I thought Rogue held on long enough at Mystique's command to put Carol into an indefinite coma (she gets better later) and Rogue had CPT Marvel's flight, strength and invulnerability on a permanent basis?

Or did it get retconned somewhere along the line?


Yeah he owns you, and he rules with no limit to his authority, but he genuinely improves the lives of his subjects so they are healthier, happier, more prosperous under his regime.

This is the critical part in comparing Latveria to Wakanda - both rulers want the best quality of life for their subjects, but have significantly different ways of doing it. Bonus marks if there are significant sections of Wakandan society that want to go back to being isolationist and King T'Challa has to start imposing restrictions to maintain the peace, while Doom, secure in his rule, starts allowing increasing personal freedom (but still permits nothing that directly affects his governance).

[Traab]

I thought Rogue held on long enough at Mystique's command to put Carol into an indefinite coma (she gets better later) and Rogue had CPT Marvel's flight, strength and invulnerability on a permanent basis?

Or did it get retconned somewhere along the line?

That was one of the xmen cartoons at least, not sure if it was also comics.

[Devonix]

That was one of the xmen cartoons at least, not sure if it was also comics.

Yeah in the comics she just lost some of her powers. She still kept her heightened physiology, and ended up joining the x-men.

She did lose her memories, but only for about a month before Xavier restored them.

[GloatingSwine]

Then the Brood got hold of her and turned her powers back on and turned all the knobs up to 11.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

There is a compelling fan theory going around about the next main villain of the MCU. It states that Thanos was looking to reduce the universe's population not out of a general concern for the broader galactic environment, but because there is a cosmic entiry that makes a habit of eating every planet that gets close to being mined dry: Galactus.

I don't really now how they would make that a compelling villain to fight, a giant the size of a large planet, but at the very least it moves up in scope rather than down.

I could see Doom as an important asset in filling in the gap, providing plenty of opposition while the team rebuilds and signs start building up that something bigger is going on. Doom would be somewhere between Loki and Thanos in terms of seriousness of the treath, and he could certainly be the main villain of Avengers 5 and/or 6. And then it would probably turn out he was working either with or against Galactus.

Doom would also provide a bit of an out if the movies stop growing in profitability. If you run up against your limit of growth you can go down in a blaze of glory, one big final panicked push that gets everything wrong, or you can scale down and be happy with what you've got. A villain like Doom could provide material for plenty of slightly lower powered adventures to come. Someone like the rumored new Black Widow (side note: It would be kind of a bummer to finally start exploring this character in solo outings only to switch her right out from under our noses) could star in dozens of James Bond esque films against someone like Doom. You know, theoretical dozens.

So yeah, he could definitely be in the plan, but my money is on Galactus for being the villain wise focus of the next huge arc.

[GloatingSwine]

Though the issue with Galactus as a "more not less" villain is that he only wants to eat one planet at a time. Interesting in that you never really beat him, only persuade him to go away,* but I'm not sure he's really a step up.

Annihilus would be a good big bad villain, because he's a bigger scale threat.


Having opened the door to time travel shenanigans means it's probably time for Kang the Conqueror to show up as the next Avengers villain though.


* After all, he only comes to Earth because he knows that the heroes will pull out all the stops to find him something better to eat. We're basically his version of Just Eat when he's feeling lazy.

[Brother Oni]

I don't really now how they would make that a compelling villain to fight, a giant the size of a large planet, but at the very least it moves up in scope rather than down.

Depends on how over the top they go. :smalltongue: (https://youtu.be/HcKoAgLd6NQ?t=841)