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Icecaster
2019-06-24, 08:28 PM
Hey guys, I've recently gotten wrapped up in a new project of mine, and - long story short - I've created a new human as an option for the world so that humans can make up a wider variety of characters and people without making the world seem too vanilla. To do this, I've made a base human and four subraces based on the place of origin, kind of like how there are a few different kinds of humans in Skyrim. Anyways, I have three main concerns, you wouldn't mind glancing at the things :smallbiggrin:

1) Is the race about on par with other official options? I tried to make it average.

2) Are the Polissian's features too niche? Are there other features I could give it for a general city feel?

3) I feel that the Samaran is too bland, and that isn't good at all because that's the main area in the setting! For a desert dwelling people bathed in legends about spirits, what else could I give them? Do you know of any good resources I could use? Specifically, I feel that resistance to fire damage is unifitting and generally lame. Samara is based on a very general middle east, Arabian sort of aesthetic, if that helps.

There's a google doc link here
(https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zcNKDQJ_fxbe-DC0NwLOU9ScmKu90VIu2bqKPxi88Yg/edit?usp=sharing)
And a pdf link here (https://drive.google.com/open?id=1DPpagsSnSj2HK85V0Ag-YPkjaxyLVu6L)

Anyways, thanks for looking over this, I appreciate any and all feedback given, and have a great day! :smalltongue:

Mark Hall
2019-06-25, 10:14 AM
The Samarans don't look too bland; they're comparable to the Helgrem, with a bonus skill taking the place of a bonus HP.

Not familiar with the mechanics of cold climates, but should the Helgrem also have advantage on saving throws against cold climates, as Samarans do for hot?

On the Polissians working for people from other areas... are you meaning that, say, a human from Njordosk, a city I just made up in Helgrem territory, might equally be, mechanically, Helgremite or Polissian?

I think the "Make another attack against someone who is surprised" feature could get a little strong, but I may be misremembering the surprise rules. Would it allow a mid-level fighter essentially four attacks against someone with surprise? Attack, Bonus Attack, 2nd attack, Bonus Attack? Maybe switch that from "You can make another attack" to "You can use your bonus action to make another attack", to at least incur a cost?

Potato_Priest
2019-06-25, 10:33 AM
I think the "Make another attack against someone who is surprised" feature could get a little strong, but I may be misremembering the surprise rules. Would it allow a mid-level fighter essentially four attacks against someone with surprise? Attack, Bonus Attack, 2nd attack, Bonus Attack? Maybe switch that from "You can make another attack" to "You can use your bonus action to make another attack", to at least incur a cost?

I don’t necessarily agree that it needs a cost, but it ought not to work multiple times. To do that, simply word it as “when you take the attack action and attack a surprised creature...”

Further, I do kind of agree that the Samaran are the least interesting. I might give them the option to cast find steed 1/day, limited to desert animals such as camels and ibex.

Icecaster
2019-06-25, 12:50 PM
*snip :)*

Thanks for the feedback! The quests for the project only really take place in and around Samara, so I didn't add it because no character using this should see cold enough climates for saves, but you're right, I don't want players to be confused either. As for the Helgrem/Polissian, yes that was my implication. If you wanted to play somebody who was more of a runt of a Helgrem and turned out to be a wizard in a city, then that's cool! I figured I'd explicitly open Polissian for that, if that makes sense. And oh dear, I hadn't considered the implications of my wording with that feature! I'll be sure to fix that right away!


*snippity snip*

And thank you for your feedback too! I guess that's fair, I wouldn't want to discourage a two-weapon fighter from playing a Mezhuan just because they feel the feature is useless. I've been trying to stay away from giving any of the subraces magic, especially the Samarans, because I'm trying to go for a moderate magic feel, and giving the entire main race of the game a spell may give a different theme than I'm trying to achieve :( I really do appreciate the ideas though!

Potato_Priest
2019-06-30, 01:52 PM
And thank you for your feedback too! I guess that's fair, I wouldn't want to discourage a two-weapon fighter from playing a Mezhuan just because they feel the feature is useless. I've been trying to stay away from giving any of the subraces magic, especially the Samarans, because I'm trying to go for a moderate magic feel, and giving the entire main race of the game a spell may give a different theme than I'm trying to achieve :( I really do appreciate the ideas though!

You could always give them a nonmagical equivalent version of find steed (in which you actually find a steed) that takes longer and doesn’t make the mount intelligent.

Mark Hall
2019-06-30, 02:06 PM
What about, instead of Find Steed, you give the desert dwellers the ability to gather a certain amount of water as part of a long rest?

Say, at the end of every long rest, they can gather 1 gallon of water? That means even the ones without Survival can survive in the desert a lot longer than others, simply because they can keep themselves hydrated?

Potato_Priest
2019-06-30, 02:28 PM
Yeah, mark’s idea is pretty good. What I think we’re both getting at is that they need to have an active ability so they can actively demonstrate their samaran-ness.

Bjarkmundur
2019-06-30, 04:28 PM
I can see by the earlier replies that these subraces have gone through quite a bit of changes. They look to be at a very good place right now. I'm never a fan of bonus HP, but I'm pretty sure that's just a personal opinion getting in the way of honest criticism.

Maxidion
2019-07-02, 11:30 AM
I like these very much. The only problem I see is with the damage resistances.

1. I don't think that the resistances are quite powerful enough to balance with the bonuses the Mezhua and Pollisians.

2. I feel they don't fit. Races only get resistances to damage types if they are seriously resistant to it. Unless my thinking that the Helgrem and Samaran are humans especially adapted to their climate is wrong; a Samaran should probably takes just as much damage sticking his hand into a fireplace as a normal person would.

Ideas: Maybe you could give the Helgram something like the advantage or double proficiency on checks for studying ice or snow (similar to Dwarven Stonecunning), to see things like how structurally sound is the ice on the lake, how fresh is the snow or its tracks. Maybe the Samaran could have something like the ability to go twice as long without sustenance (especially water) as a normal person.


What about, instead of Find Steed, you give the desert dwellers the ability to gather a certain amount of water as part of a long rest?

Say, at the end of every long rest, they can gather 1 gallon of water? That means even the ones without Survival can survive in the desert a lot longer than others, simply because they can keep themselves hydrated?

Good idea, I also agree that an active ability or more are desirable; but the idea of anyone being guaranteed to find water each day in a desert isn't realistic. Travelling desert dwellers who know where all the water is often have to travel for days on end before they reach the next water source. They just carry enough water with them that they don't run out before then.

New Idea: Samaran could know how to find oasis and other water sources in the desert much better than others.

P.S. I don't think I came up with the best ideas to replace the resistances, but I hope they helped. Again, I like these races quite a bit, I just feel resistances are a bit off.

P.S.S. Wow! I did not mean to post such a long message, sorry about that.

Mark Hall
2019-07-02, 12:42 PM
Good idea, I also agree that an active ability or more are desirable; but the idea of anyone being guaranteed to find water each day in a desert isn't realistic. Travelling desert dwellers who know where all the water is often have to travel for days on end before they reach the next water source. They just carry enough water with them that they don't run out before then.


I viewed it less as "I can find water" and more as "If you give me eight hours, I can create a dew trap and create a small amount of water overnight." Basic-level desert survival training being built into the culture.

Icecaster
2019-07-03, 11:53 AM
Thanks for all the responses guys! :smallbiggrin:

I've been mulling it over and I've updated things. I haven't touched the Polissian, it sounds like it's probably fine. I fixed the Mezhua's making attacks against surprised creatures to only be once on a turn, and I traded out the Samaran's fire resistance for Fasting, allowing them to briefly reduce their food and water needs in times of need in the desert, giving the race an overall greater survivability, and Native, making their knowledge about the legends and history of Samara competent, which will be useful considering many of the possible questlines include Samaran legends and history.


Yeah, mark’s idea is pretty good. What I think we’re both getting at is that they need to have an active ability so they can actively demonstrate their samaran-ness.

I thought it would be worth mentioning that this helped me overcome some creative block with the features, so thank you for that :smallwink:


I like these very much. The only problem I see is with the damage resistances.

1. I don't think that the resistances are quite powerful enough to balance with the bonuses the Mezhua and Pollisians.

2. I feel they don't fit. Races only get resistances to damage types if they are seriously resistant to it. Unless my thinking that the Helgrem and Samaran are humans especially adapted to their climate is wrong; a Samaran should probably takes just as much damage sticking his hand into a fireplace as a normal person would.

Ideas: Maybe you could give the Helgram something like the advantage or double proficiency on checks for studying ice or snow (similar to Dwarven Stonecunning), to see things like how structurally sound is the ice on the lake, how fresh is the snow or its tracks. Maybe the Samaran could have something like the ability to go twice as long without sustenance (especially water) as a normal person.


I completely understand. I felt that the Samaran's fire resistance was largely a lazy feature for me to add because I couldn't think of anything else, and I'm very thankful that everybody has been so helpful with fixing this issue. However, I think the Helgrem's resistance is more appropriate, and I will explain why. The main reason is that the entirety of the campaign will take place in Samara, an arid and usually hot land with various kinds of deserts. Cold, already an uncommon damage type in a normal campaign, will be extremely sparse in the campaign Helgrem will be used in, and perhaps even weaker than cold in other places. Because of this, I felt it was appropriate to give the Helgrem resistance to cold to demonstrate their acclimation - and even preference for - the cold.

Again, thank you all for the help and support! :)

Mark Hall
2019-07-03, 12:37 PM
For Samarans: I would make it so they could halve their food and water requirements for a number of days equal to their Constitution modifier, minimum 1 (so even their sickly ones can take advantage of it). I really like that as an option; rather than gathering water, they just need less.

Maxidion
2019-07-03, 01:36 PM
I viewed it less as "I can find water" and more as "If you give me eight hours, I can create a dew trap and create a small amount of water overnight."

I had never even heard of dew traps before. Thank you for adding to my knowledge. :smallsmile:


I haven't touched the Polissian, it sounds like it's probably fine. I fixed the Mezhua's making attacks against surprised creatures to only be once on a turn, and I traded out the Samaran's fire resistance for Fasting, ... and Native, making their knowledge about the legends and history of Samara competent, which will be useful considering many of the possible questlines include Samaran legends and history.

I completely understand. I felt that the Samaran's fire resistance was largely a lazy feature for me to add because I couldn't think of anything else, and I'm very thankful that everybody has been so helpful with fixing this issue. However, I think the Helgrem's resistance is more appropriate, and I will explain why. The main reason is that the entirety of the campaign will take place in Samara, an arid and usually hot land with various kinds of deserts. Cold, already an uncommon damage type in a normal campaign, will be extremely sparse in the campaign Helgrem will be used in, and perhaps even weaker than cold in other places. Because of this, I felt it was appropriate to give the Helgrem resistance to cold to demonstrate their acclimation - and even preference for - the cold.

Again, thank you all for the help and support! :)

The Polissians are great, they only have a minor feature that helps in combat, but they more than make up for it with great versatility that, while not restricted, does have a cityish feel; and plenty of races don't have combat specific features anyway. I had actually thought that the Mezhua extra attack was fine, but I like your new changes to it. :smallbiggrin:

After thinking about it, I actually agree about the cold resistance. First I couldn't actually think of any obvious examples for it not making sense. Second, fire resistance may require you to be a demon, dragon, elemental or something related, but cold resistance only requires you to be a penguin. If someone else doesn't like the idea when they use them for their own campaign setting, it shouldn't be to hard to change it. Everything here looks great now. If I didn't know better, I could be easily convinced that these were officially made and play-tested content.

Your welcome for the help, but thank you more then that for coming up with the races in the first place, I will probably use them myself.

P.S. Apparently all my posts are long, sooo… I guess I will have to live with it until I slowly learn to say more with less words. Bye.

Mark Hall
2019-07-03, 02:08 PM
Y'all don't know about long posts. These ain't nothin'

Maxidion
2019-07-03, 07:55 PM
Y'all don't know about long posts. These ain't nothin'

:smallamused: True, I've read much longer; but it feels different when I am constantly looking at what I wrote 2/3rds of and am finding it significantly longer then I though it was going to be.

P.S. I just discovered there is no laughing emote, is that on purpose?