What is the "best" race? (ft. yuan-ti pureblood, warforged, aarakocra)

[Greywander]

Hi, playground, I was thinking about this and wondering what the most optimized race to play was? Obviously, this will depend fairly heavily on your specific build, but there are definitely some races that stand out to me.

Yuan-Ti Pureblood

Innate Spellcasting. Free Suggestion is the important part, though talking to snakes can definitely be useful if you make a special effort to use them a lot.

Magic Resistance. This is what draws people to this race. Note that it works against magic, rather than just spells. A basilisk's gaze is magic, but not a spell. It's really good. There's a few magic items that grant a similar trait, most against spells only, a few against all magic, but all of them require attunement.

Poison Immunity. Poison is actually pretty common, and it's also one of the main sources of non-magical CON saves, so it synergizes well with Magic Resistance.

Warforged Envoy

Age. The warforged lifespan is currently unknown. In theory, this could mean you're already immortal and unaffected by age. In practice, it means you die of old age at the exact moment that the DM has had enough of your "wait 100 years until I have the outcome I want" shenanigans. Still, potential immortality, if your DM favors you.

Warforged Resilience. You don't need to eat, drink, sleep, or breathe, and you are immune to disease. It's basically undeath without the Undead creature type, and you're a robot instead of a rotting corpse. Some might write this off as a ribbon, and it mostly is, but it makes you virtually immune to attrition tactics. You cannot starve, you cannot die of thirst, you cannot become exhausted by not being allowed to sleep, and you can't even be suffocated or affected by inhaled gasses.

Sentry's Rest. You can rest while maintaining your awareness of your surroundings. Translation: no one can sneak up on you while you are sleeping, because you're actually awake the whole time.

Integrated Protection. The main appeal of the warforged, this is like Unarmored Defense Premium Edition. Even at 1st level, your AC is comparable to the best mundane armor in the game, and as you level up, your AC will eventually outdo even armor +3. There's a plating option for every amount of DEX (maxed, modest, and dumped), making it work for almost any build. It weighs nothing (good if you dumped STR) and can't be taken away from you; at most, a DM might allow an enemy to strip you to your darkwood core, but that's still equivalent to studded leather +1, at 1st level.

Specialized Design. A skill, tool, and language. Allows you to add a lot of flavor to your character, and good for skill monkey types.

Integrated Tool. With Specialized Design, this makes the envoy the most appealing subclass. You get expertise in any tool, and that tool is built into your body, AKA it can never be taken away from you. Thieves' tools are the obvious choice, since they're the most likely tool for you to not have when you really, really need them (e.g. if captured and stripped of your equipment). Other tools can make for interesting choices as well, and you can already get expertise with thieves' tools if you take a level in rogue, whereas this is currently the only way to get expertise in other tools.

Aarakocra

Flight. Well, not just aarakocra, but any flying race. At-will flight with no concentration has its obvious benefits. Aarakocra have the benefit of extra speed, but at the price of not being able to fly while in medium or heavy armor.

Variant Human

Feat. Noteable only in that this is the only race that lets you get a feat at 1st level. It's flexible, and works for any build, but I feel like there are other, stronger options for specific builds. And besides, feats are available to all characters, whereas all of the racial traits above are unique to a specific race, or a similar feature is given only by a specific class.

What other races come across to you as "optimized"? Which ones have cool abilities unique to them that you like to use? Got a favorite race, and what is it about it you like?

[Chaelos]

In any point-buy game, Vhumans are going to be disproportionately powerful early on and--since most campaigns don't last very long--therefore more "optimal" overall. The reason for this is that most characters are going to need to use their level 4 and 8 ASI's to actually increase their primary stat, particularly if they're a spellcaster; this means that there's not really any room for Feats until level 12 (except for Fighters/Rogues, who get extra ASI's). Because Feats CAN be disproportionately powerful in the right build, a Vhuman's ability to get one right off the bat is of paramount importance.

Other notable "optimal" picks:


Winged Tiefling/Aarakocra: Always-on flight is super powerful. (See pg. 83 of The Lesser Key of Sargon to see why I think so.)
Deep Gnome: The absolute best Abjurer Wizards around, if you take the Svirfneblin Magic feat. (I'm also partial to Forest Gnomes for all other Wizards.)
Yuan-Ti Pureblood: Immunity to Poison and Magic Resistance are ridiculously powerful, and a one-a-day Suggestion spell is very nice to boot.
Halflings: They really do make terrifying Rogues. The ability to re-roll a natural 1 seems to come up way more often than you'd think with Halfling players; I swear it's the Universe's way of showing favoritism.
Aasimar: Not the most optimal at first glance, I grant, but I've seen them put out a terrifying amount of damage per round in "boss" fights.
Half-Elf: The only race (AFAIK) that can start with three 16's in their stats in AL games. They also get access to both Elven Accuracy and Prodigy, which can both make for some interesting Sorlock combinations.


I'm sure I'm missing a few, but these are the standouts.

[Agent-KI7KO]

Not the “best” but very noteworthy:

It’s possible to start with 14 dex, 16 con 16 int as a hobgoblin wizard.

It’s also possible to start with heavy crossbow proficiency, so for the early levels you have the option to do 1d10+2 on a +2 or 1d10 on a +3.

You also get light armor proficiency, so you’re looking at studded leather and 14ac. Sacrifice an ASI and you can get moderately armored for halfplate and a shield and go to 19ac. Go War Wizard and you get 21ac on a reaction. 23 if you’re concentrating on a spell.

It’s not quite Bladesinger levels of absurdity, but it’s really good, and it’s easy to go 20int and 20con and ignore warcaster.

That and if you need to make a con check you can either use the racial for up to +5 to any d20 roll, or arcane deflection for a +4 to all saves.

[Psyren]

In any point-buy game, Vhumans are going to be disproportionately powerful early on and--since most campaigns don't last very long--therefore more "optimal" overall. The reason for this is that most characters are going to need to use their level 4 and 8 ASI's to actually increase their primary stat, particularly if they're a spellcaster; this means that there's not really any room for Feats until level 12 (except for Fighters/Rogues, who get extra ASI's). Because Feats CAN be disproportionately powerful in the right build, a Vhuman's ability to get one right off the bat is of paramount importance.

Don't several feats provide an ASI anyway? It's not like you necessarily have to choose one or the other.

[Snowbluff]

Don't several feats provide an ASI anyway? It's not like you necessarily have to choose one or the other.

Not quite an ASI, but a bunch of good feats do give a point in a stat bump. I like to take Resilient: Constitution on my human casters, which rounds the con to 16 for some good HPs and concentration checks, with the bonus of actually being prof in Con saves in general.

[strangebloke]

It's highly contingent on several factors. Vhuman is broken good but only at relatively early levels. A HAM fighter will feel unkillable at level 1 but at higher levels it's a pretty meh ability. Even a feat like GWM that scales well really just translates to an extra +2 to a stat in the long run.

It's similar for aarockra. A wood elf with boots of flying is basically better in every way. Once flying becomes important there are multiple ways of getting it. You can trivialize certain kinds of encounters, but only if you take a lot of risk on yourself by splitting off from the party.

Warforged have awesome AC, but once again I don't think by itself that merits calling them "the best in the game." In a normal game with magic items they'll be about 1-2 AC ahead of the competition. Not exactly have breaking.

Yuan-ti are broken overpowered, and they're a contender for best in the game, or they would be... But their stats suck and in practice I actually find them to be pretty weak in the early game. Late game, yeah, a lot of their abilities are crazy.

But you didn't mention the best race.

The mothers frocking variant half elf.

Dark vision. Net +4 to stats in a great distribution. Trance. Immunity to charms. Languages.

Then, as icing, you get to pick between free cantrips, weapon proficiencies, bonus skills or mask of the wild.

And you qualify for everything. Prodigy? Hey, you're a human. Elven accuracy? Kinda feeling elfy. Bladesinger? Pretty much an elf.

It's overpowered in the sense that unless there's very specific synergy you're shooting for, the half elf can do it almost as well.

It's easily the most popular race at my table.

[Greywander]

Half-Elf: The only race (AFAIK) that can start with three 16's in their stats in AL games. They also get access to both Elven Accuracy and Prodigy, which can both make for some interesting Sorlock combinations.

Not sure if warforged are AL-legal, but all warforged get +1 CON and envoys get two more +1s to distribute, so they can also end up with three 16s, albeit having to make do with three +1s instead of +2 to one stat like the half-elf. I really like warforged envoys because, like the vhuman, they're really versatile and can be built into just about any class. And that AC bonus makes them really tough.


Don't several feats provide an ASI anyway? It's not like you necessarily have to choose one or the other.
You do, it's either +2 to one stat, +1 to two stats, or a feat. Some feats give a +1 to a stat, but you often can't choose the stat or are restricted to picking between two stats. I've seen these commonly referred to as "half feats", as they provide half of the benefit of an ASI while still giving you the benefits of a feat, albeit usually a weaker one.


It's similar for aarockra. A wood elf with boots of flying is basically better in every way. Once flying becomes important there are multiple ways of getting it. You can trivialize certain kinds of encounters, but only if you take a lot of risk on yourself by splitting off from the party.
IIRC, Boots of Flying only work for a limited amount of time, and require attunement. Likewise, non-yuan-tis can get a Mantle of Spell Resistance, but this also requires attunement and only works against spells, not all magic. Attunement slots are valuable, so being able to get a powerful feature without spending an attunement slot can free you up to get something else instead.


Warforged have awesome AC, but once again I don't think by itself that merits calling them "the best in the game." In a normal game with magic items they'll be about 1-2 AC ahead of the competition. Not exactly have breaking.
It's the best AC in the game, but only by 1 point more than what you could potentially achieve with armor +3. And armor +3 doesn't require attunement.

That said, being able to start at 1st level with 20 AC is pretty strong. And warforged also come with some other nice traits, envoys in particular.


But you didn't mention the best race.

The mothers frocking variant half elf.
Yeah, I probably should have brought up the half-elf. It's an example of a race that is mechanically superior to a variant human, but only for CHA builds. The half-elf trades the vhuman's feat for +2 CHA (which is a fair trade, as feat = ASI), while also getting darkvision, fey ancestry, an extra skill, and extra language. If you were ever going to spend an ASI on +2 CHA, then you might as well go half-elf instead of vhuman.

[Laserlight]

Obviously depends on the campaign, but if I were picking without knowing anything about the campaign, I'd lean towards half elf (and variant half elf).

Yuan ti is good in a white room, but I think they're liable to face significant animosity from the usual PC races, and social encounters ought to be hazardous.

[jaappleton]

I think it’s purely dependent on what subclass you want.

For example, for Hexblade, I think Warforged is the best. Why? A big AC boost, if you pick Envoy you can bump Charisma, nobody ever says No to a Con bonus, and because of Invocations the lack of Darkvision doesn’t matter.

For Champion, I have zero doubt it’s Half Orc. The bonus damage on Crits is amazing.

Meanwhile, I think Goblins make spectacular Revised Rangers. Why? Because by being a Goblin, you get Cunning Action. On something like Gloom Stalker it’s especially good, but it’s good on all Rangers.

Also, Goblins also make spectacular Shadow Monks.

[Willie the Duck]

Variant human has the very obvious benefit of getting a feat right from the jump, meaning you can plan a build around it.
Half-elf has the obvious benefits (nothing you can't get elsewhere, but simply all the nice things and in excessive supply) for any cha-based classes.


Age. The warforged lifespan is currently unknown. In theory, this could mean you're already immortal and unaffected by age. In practice, it means you die of old age at the exact moment that the DM has had enough of your "wait 100 years until I have the outcome I want" shenanigans. Still, potential immortality, if your DM favors you.

From a roleplaying perspective, this is great. You can have a character who has been alive since <important historical reference>, or just play them as someone in absolutely no hurry (i.e. how we used to play elves, bitd). On a practical level, though, this is a non-advantage. The rest of the party is here now, the adventure hooks are here now. Unless this is a one-player gaming session, the DM is unlikely to let this advantage be, well, an advantage. To a lessor degree, this is true for Aarakocra as well. You can fly, but until the rest of the party can, you'll probably have to plod through a lot of situations you theoretically could avoid on your own.

The Yuan-ti Pureblood is an odd case. It's ability is insanely good, something that otherwise would show up as a late-game magic item which would require attunement. Otoh, it is still just resistance (in the general sense, not the game-term sense), not immunity, to a subset of saving throws. How powerful is that? Well, it's going to depend on how frequently you were going to be subject to such saving throws over your character's career, and more particularly how often you would have expected to otherwise fail those rolls. Given that three of the most obvious classes to play with the stat bonuses are Paladin, Bard, and Wizard, all of which already have good ways to pass saves or make them not be needed in the first place (counterspell), the yuan ti factor is often just a 3rd level of protection on already robust frames. That, along with the dis-synergistic stat allotment, is probably why they considered the ability allowable -- it is a strong ability, but you are unlikely to find a character where it makes them a runaway success (and it being the reason for said success).

Anyways, on to my picks. Best is too subjective, so I'll highlight some of the surprising ones. SCAG cantrips (particularly Booming Blade) make for some odd bedfellows. Clerics who actually want to be swinging their weapons (and only get one attack) want BB (particularly if it makes escaping their Spirit Guardians radius that much harsher), but don't really want to pay an ASI for Magic Initiate. For them*, a high elf (/half elf with that selection) is a surprisingly good option, despite no Wis boost. Likewise, warlocks already get BB, but don't have a spell like Spirit Guardians to make having opponents retreat be a benefit. For them, being a goblin makes all sorts of sense. A non-hexblade goblin warlock with moderately armored feat at 4th makes a surprisingly decent 2nd-tier melee combatant.
*arcana clerics not needing to, but that's a part of their schtick so it makes sense.

Also, Hobgoblin wizard (with moderately armored at 4th) makes a resilient wizard for groups who are bad at protecting the back line.

Also also, if your DM is the kind who is going to make it painful to play dump stats or optimized builds (let's say, optional encumbrance rule is enforced, as is tracking arrows, and you can't pick your preferred skill for athletics/acrobatics), then a bugbear is a great way of getting a high-Str, high-Dex character (who also has good carrying capacity).

[Yakmala]

As other folks have mentioned, at the early levels, its the Variant Human without a doubt. There's no beating the extra power of starting with a Feat.

Mid to late levels, in my opinion, its a Yuan-Ti: I had a Yuan-Ti Ancients Paladin and they were as close to magic immune as you can get. Yuan-ti Magic Resistance + Aura of Protection (20 Charisma) + Aura of Warding = +5 with Advantage to all saves vs magic (with a 20 Charisma and +3 proficiency, that was +13 with Advantage to Charisma saves) And if he did somehow fail a magic save, he still had resistance.

Once, while trying to figure out a magical puzzle with a "save or be cursed" trap, he managed to brute force the solution, successfully making seven saves in a row before getting the correct answer.

[Waazraath]

As you already say in the OP, there isn't a single 'best'. 5e is balanced very well in this respect. That being said, of course Vhuman and Half-elf are very strong, as are the flying races (though here, it's already quite deep in ymmv territory, cause in campaigns with lots of dungeons with narrow corridors and low ceiling rooms, they loose there main benefit and will be much worse than other races).

Special mentions from my side: Simic Hybrid for grapplers, Firbolg (underestimated imo, especially for str/wis builds), Protector Aasimars (very nice for most builds needing either wis or cha due to versatility), and high elfs for dex builds that need a cantrip (rogues or clerics wanting a SCAG cantrip, for example).

[Tallytrev813]

In nearly every instance Variant Human is either the best race, or tied for the best.

Starting with a Feat is just too good, outside of a few classes.

[RulesJD]

Best/Tied Best in all circumstances:

V. Human

Top Tier:

Kobold - No/low-sunlight campaigns, classes that don't use heavy weapons (Rogue, Monk, Ranged Fighter/Ranger) or make a lot of Attack rolls (Warlock)

Yuan-ti - Mid-level and higher campaigns, also outdoor/traps (lots of poison)

Aasimar - Undead/Radiant damage heavy campaigns (low party healing also boosts effectiveness)

Aarakocra - Low-Mid level campaign, often outdoors and not a lot of dungeon/urban fighting

Half-Elf - If V. Human is banned, Charisma based classes/multiclassed

[Waazraath]

Dunno about 'vhuman always best or tied for best'. There are some classes that benefit less from feats. For a (non abjurer) Wizard for example, I'd rather start with medium armor, a free cantrip and 2 free spells from Githyanki than with a feat. Same with monk: there are only a few feats that are really nice, and for me they don't weigh up to what a Ghostwise halfling gives (next to perfect stat increases mainly telepathy and reroll of all 1's).

[Zetakya]

Tabaxi make excellent Monks; stat bonus to DEX, even more movement and climbing enhancement specials, proficiency with 2 really good Monk skills and Darkvision to boot. Plus the ability to choose between Bludgeoning and Slashing Damage for Unarmed Strikes.

Sure, the +1 CHA is largely a waste, but everything else is gggggg-rrrreat!

[Wizard_Lizard]

hill dwarves are pretty good.

[Snowbluff]

hill dwarves are pretty good.

No. No they are not. You would take hill dwarve for wis and bonus HP. However, if you play a variant human, you can take Inspiring Leader to give your entire team +1 HP/level, or that tough feat for 2 HP/level, and still be able to start with 16 wis and con.

[Willie the Duck]

No. No they are not. You would take hill dwarve for wis and bonus HP. However, if you play a variant human, you can take Inspiring Leader to give your entire team +1 HP/level, or that tough feat for 2 HP/level, and still be able to start with 16 wis and con.

? And the hill dwarf gives darkvision, a fair share of martial weapon proficiencies, ability to wear heavy armor despite insufficient strength, poison resistance (and advantage on poison saves), and you can (in point buy) start with a 16 wis and 17 con (setting up 18 con when you take resilient:con for your cleric or the like).

There are reasons that a hill dwarf may or may not be a good choice, depending on build, but that they don't happen to be a variant human is an odd argument to make.

[Waazraath]

? And the hill dwarf gives darkvision, a fair share of martial weapon proficiencies, ability to wear heavy armor despite insufficient strength, poison resistance (and advantage on poison saves), and you can (in point buy) start with a 16 wis and 17 con (setting up 18 con when you take resilient:con for your cleric or the like).

There are reasons that a hill dwarf may or may not be a good choice, depending on build, but that they don't happen to be a variant human is an odd argument to make.

+1. They are absolutely great for Clerics. And Inspiring Leader can be good, but it also depends on the party: if there are other characters that generate temporary hp it's a lot less great, since they don't stack.

[zinycor]

Half orcs are very good, whenever I am making a martial character I always have to ask myself if I want this character to be one.

Half elves are also amazing

[Zetakya]

+1. They are absolutely great for Clerics. And Inspiring Leader can be good, but it also depends on the party: if there are other characters that generate temporary hp it's a lot less great, since they don't stack.

I'm playing a Hill Dwarf Drunken Master Monk in one game at the minute. ALL OF THE HIT POINTS ARE MINE!

[Snowbluff]

? And the hill dwarf gives darkvision, a fair share of martial weapon proficiencies, ability to wear heavy armor despite insufficient strength, poison resistance (and advantage on poison saves), and you can (in point buy) start with a 16 wis and 17 con (setting up 18 con when you take resilient:con for your cleric or the like).

There are reasons that a hill dwarf may or may not be a good choice, depending on build, but that they don't happen to be a variant human is an odd argument to make.

Well, considering the net effect of being a variant human is much great, it's pretty obvious.

Also, the strength score doesn't remove the ability to wear the armor, it just lowers your speed. As for the person that says they make good clerics, a healthy chunk of the clerics that actually get heavy armor also get martial weapons. What's an extra mod in Con gonna get you if you would've had the bonus HP regardless. If you're intent on having a feat, V. Human just sets you up from the start.


Furthermore, Inspiring Leader is substantially underrated. Not many classes have THP as a feature, and those that get it as a spell can just swap it for something else and bask in the speech. Having played at high levels with Inspiring Leader, it really makes a big difference.

[Setharious]

I am surprised at the lack of mentioning of the kalashtar. They have mind link to talk to any creature that speaks a language, not needing to share one with you. You just have to see them within 60 feet. They have resistance to psychic damage, which doesn't seem like much until you combine it with bear totem barbarian to have resistance to all damage. You can use your reaction to get advantage on wisdom saves. Then my favorite, choose insight, intimidation, performance, or persuasion, you have advantage on all ability checks of that chosen skill. Not to mention +1 to wis, cha, and anything of your choice.

[Mitsu]

Variant Human remains best, most optimum choice for almost every build in point-buy system. That is due to few facts:

1. Most people don't play higher than level 12. Therefore extra ASI/Feat is extremely strong. For example a PAM on level 1 is extra attack, something that any other martial class gets only at level 5. Or things like Magic Initiate, Lucky, GWM or Mobile are all game changers on levels 1-8, where majority plays.

2. Mostly best choice for any uneven multiclass builds due to how many ASI most of those builds lose. The best example is Sorcadin 6/14. By taking Vuman you can have 3 ASI till level 10, enough to grab one stat to 20 and take one feat, while any other race would have to wait to level 10 to even get second ASI.

3. Some builds benefit from other races (like Eleven Accuracy), however most of those builds are late game builds, going fully online on levels 12+ if even that. Vumans always comes online faster.

Though there are some builds that are 100% better as other races like Samurai Archers are just made for Elfs for example and with Fighters extra ASI- Vumans are not as necessary. But when it comes to Battlemaster for example and that Xbow Expert build- yup, vuman.

Second best race would be Half-Elf, because of Hexblade 1 level dip + Elven Accuracy. Then I would say Winged Tiefling and Deep Gnome Wizards probably.

[samcifer]

I think that half-elf variant grants a huge amount of flexibility in darkvision, immunity to sleep and advantage to saves against charmed condition and +1 to two different stats as well as +2 to Charisma, which is a valuable trait to have without a penalty to your stat in it. The variations allow for even more customization to fit any kind of role and the Elven Accuracy feat is amazing to have on the right build.

[Willie the Duck]

Well, considering the net effect of being a variant human is much great, it's pretty obvious.

'Is much great?' I don't want to put too much weight on a typo, but I think this just highlights that perhaps the argument you have formulated in your head is much more thorough than the one that has come out here.

Regardless, again, in the situation of someone else saying 'X is pretty good,' you saying 'no they're not,' because they happen not to be some one other thing that is also good seems decidedly odd. Vuman being a good choice does not make a hill dwarf an ungood one. The entire premise seems flawed.


Also, the strength score doesn't remove the ability to wear the armor, it just lowers your speed.

Which is a big deal, except for those specific builds where it isn't.


As for the person that says they make good clerics, a healthy chunk of the clerics that actually get heavy armor also get martial weapons.

But not all of them. And you do not need to benefit from both traits. Heavy armor clerics will appreciate not needing a 13+ or 15+ Strength. Medium armor clerics might not care about that, but appreciate the Warhammer proficiency. Dwarves have multiple facets, which was the entire point of my response to you-- they aren't just a hit point bonus.


What's an extra mod in Con gonna get you if you would've had the bonus HP regardless. If you're intent on having a feat, V. Human just sets you up from the start.

The dwarf with a 17 Con picks up resilient:con at 4th and ends up with an 18 Con and an additional +1hp/level, totaling +5. The vuman can take resilient on top of a 15 or 15+1 at start, ending up with a 17 and needing an additional ASI or half-feat to get to 18, which still only nets them +4, and means that they aren't taking Inspiring Leader.


Furthermore, Inspiring Leader is substantially underrated. Not many classes have THP as a feature, and those that get it as a spell can just swap it for something else and bask in the speech. Having played at high levels with Inspiring Leader, it really makes a big difference.

IL is indeed a great feat. Particularly for a charisma-based class, so it is staggeringly bizarre that you seem to consider it a natural refutation to hill dwarves. A party with a bard (so extra healing during short rests, if HD expended) with IL and a thief-rogue with the Healer feat might well be able to do well without a cleric. Great. That really seems incredibly orthogonal to the question of whether a hill dwarf is good (particularly at the things for which you might take them, such as making a durable, weapon-wielding, cleric).

[Segev]

I'm not familiar with the variant half-elf, but I will say that I find any argument that says "it's so versatile that it can fill any role almost as well as the best option for that role" to be...lackluster...in a thread on "the best race." If this translated to half-elves being able to shift roles, or to being able to do dual-role builds well, that'd be one thing. But it sounds like they'll always be second-best, which means that, for any GIVEN role, there's always some better race to choose.

I'm not actually saying this is the case; I'm only critiquing the argument.

[RulesJD]

*snip*
That really seems incredibly orthogonal to the question of whether a hill dwarf is good (particularly at the things for which you might take them, such as making a durable, weapon-wielding, cleric).

If I had to guess his argument isn't that Hill Dwarfs aren't good in certain builds. It's that they aren't the "best", which is what the OP asked. Lots of races are good in certain areas/builds, but definitely not the best.

[Willie the Duck]

If I had to guess his argument isn't that Hill Dwarfs aren't good in certain builds. It's that they aren't the "best", which is what the OP asked. Lots of races are good in certain areas/builds, but definitely not the best.

Except that he specifically refuted that "hill dwarves are pretty good," (not best, good) and chose not to refute the OP's original suggestions of Yuan-ti, warforged, and Aarakocra, even though those were much more framed as being contenders for the top spot. Did Wizard_Lizard deviate from the original topic of best? Sure, but so did the OP, who specifically stated that build would effect things, and instead focus on "some races that stand out to me" instead.

I think Vumans are great. I think Inspiring Leader is great (also in certain areas/builds). Honestly, I would be perfectly fine with a straight up "I think Vumans are the absolute best, hands down," argument. It's straight up opinion, probably with support, and we can hash over it up, down, and every which way from Sunday and have a raucous good thread. It is just really a non sequitur as a point of refutation against the status of hill dwarves as good.

[Spiritchaser]

Unless it’s in the context where other ways to get Darkvision are available (gloomstalker, Spell, devil’s sight) I can’t vote for variant human.

Instead I’d vote for half elf or yuan ti in the general case.

I’m also going to vote for hobgoblin. The hobgoblin makes for one of the better wizards and wizards are arguably the most generically powerful class... being best at the best class has to count for something.

[Rerem115]

I find myself agreeing with a lot of what's being said; however, since most of the campaigns I've been in use rolled stats (and generously rolled stats, at that), it shakes up the tier list just a little bit.

SS Tier

Still Variant Human, but not by as much. While an extra feat can still make a build, other races have much more leeway to take feats than normal when they have high rolled attributes.

Anything with wings, so much so that almost every table I've been at didn't even ask if they could play something that could fly.

S Tier

Aasimar, because it's the one thing with wings that does get played on a regular basis in my experience, and it's got a solid chassis besisdes.

Half Elf. You're a VHuman who swapped out their feat for +2 Cha, darkvision, advantage vs. charms, access to Elven Accuracy, and whichever Variant feature you want. There's a good chance it's better than VHuman if you're a Charisma based class...Which is a plurality of the PHB.

Warforged (Envoy, because that's the only one anyone's ever taken in my experience). Also like VHuman, only instead of a feat you get +1 Con, Expertise in a tool, advantage vs. poison, immunity to toxic air, sleep, or exhaustion, and an AC matched only by a character stacking a bunch of Rare and Very Rare magic items.

Yuan-Ti, because they're essentially Gnome 2.0.

A Tier

Most of the options fall here; if I didn't mention it elsewhere, it's here. Honorable mentions go out to Grung, Hobgoblins, Changelings, and Variant Tieflings; they probably have an edge over most of this tier, but not nearly enough to be S tier.

B Tier

Less successful options fall here, but still good; Dragonborn, PHB Tieflings, Kobolds are the primary denizens.

C Tier

It's pretty lonely down here, with only the Orc in residence.

[Warlush]

I have to say, I've never felt more powerful than when playing a halfling. Laughing at nat 1s is the best thing ever. Especially if your DM is mean. Also being able to hide anywhere is great. Not just for rogues.

[Snowbluff]

But not all of them. And you do not need to benefit from both traits. Heavy armor clerics will appreciate not needing a 13+ or 15+ Strength. Medium armor clerics might not care about that, but appreciate the Warhammer proficiency. Dwarves have multiple facets, which was the entire point of my response to you-- they aren't just a hit point bonus.
Again, you won't need it. Dwarves don't get a free armor without strength, they get to reduce, not remove a penalty, by 5 feat. However, they get 25 speed, always. This means if you were to wear lighter armor, you've been penalized 5 feat. It's an antifeature.





IL is indeed a great feat. Particularly for a charisma-based class, so it is staggeringly bizarre that you seem to consider it a natural refutation to hill dwarves. A party with a bard (so extra healing during short rests, if HD expended) with IL and a thief-rogue with the Healer feat might well be able to do well without a cleric. Great. That really seems incredibly orthogonal to the question of whether a hill dwarf is good (particularly at the things for which you might take them, such as making a durable, weapon-wielding, cleric).

Either you get 1 HP/level for 1 player, or you get it for all players. Hill Dwarf is the strictly worse option for this use.