Making an Oathbreaker

[Sparky McDibben]

Hey Playground!

Quick little creative exercise: how would you make an Oathbreaker paladin who isn't an edgelord, isn't very dark (interpret how you will), and not deluding themselves into thinking they're the "good guys." Bonus points if they could conceivably qualify for a good alignment.

You can write anything in their backstory, and refluff any mechanics to fit. I would request that you not:


Recommend a different class, or a multi-class (I know what I want to play)
Give me build or mechanical advice (it's not needed)
Give me a backstory that doesn't allow for play (in other words, I need this character to be playable from level 1)


Bonus points if they fit into a "monsterland." Like, for example, Mordor.

Thanks!

[JackPhoenix]

Give me a backstory that doesn't allow for play (in other words, I need this character to be playable from level 1)

Well, that's kinda hard, considering that you need to get to level 3 as different subclass and THEN break your oath and turn evil to even qualify for Oathbreaker.

[Sparky McDibben]

Well, that's kinda hard, considering that you need to get to level 3 as different subclass and THEN break your oath and turn evil to even qualify for Oathbreaker.

I trust you to give me something I can build on, JackPhoenix.

[Quoz]

One way I've seen it done was an Ancients paladin devoted to the natural order of the world, particularly in the service to the cycle of life and death. Through loss of a character or NPC they have a very strong bond to, they would turn their back on that oath. You would devote yourself to seeking instead a mastery over life and death via necromancy, demonic pacts, and other means to circumvent the natural order.

Another that could work at higher levels, pull out the cursed item from previous editions Helm of Opposite Allignment. You were once a widely feared general at the head of an unstoppable army, a literal gods-chosen avatar of conquest. Then through trickery an enemy got you to wear a Helm of Opposite Allignment, turning you into a happy chaotic good anarchist. You still have the memories, skills, and reputation of a badass unstoppable conqueror but have wholeheartedly embraced a live and let live, use their own tricks against them philosophy.

[Grey Watcher]

Well, that's kinda hard, considering that you need to get to level 3 as different subclass and THEN break your oath and turn evil to even qualify for Oathbreaker.

This is kinda why I hate calling the DMG subclass the Oathbreaker. It seems pretty well-dedicated to something, albeit something a lot more overtly scary than the rest.

So, bit of advice number one is to ditch the name, if possible. I know some people absolutely insist that the name stays, but if you can, I'd call it something else.

As for what your deal is, I'd say let's look at what powers the sub-class gives you the following:


Your bonus spells involve damage, disease, and taking away people's autonomy and agency. With Animate Dead, Bestow Curse, and Darkness thrown in for good measure.
Your Channel divinity options are controlling the undead and making people afraid of you.
Your Aura boosts the melee attacks of any fiends or undead standing near you.
Resistance to non-magical weapons.
Your capstone involves putting a dimmer on the lights, hitting anything that's afraid of you with psychic damage, and being able to weaponize the shadows for good measure.


So we've got a suite of powers centered around fear, control, the undead, and darkness. Honestly, a lot of this could jive, fluff-wise with the non-Evil versions of the Oath of Conquest; it paints a very ends-justify-the-means kind of deal. It brings to mind that quote (which I've seen attributed to so many people it's absurd): "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." The Paladin in question is such a rough person.

[BloodSnake'sCha]

You were a Kobold paladin of Tiamat, but one day you mat a dragonborn that told you all about the magnificent Behemoth.
You broke you oath of conquest and became an oathbreaker Devoted to Behemoth.

Like the Kobold you are you see using a dirty tactics as something good.
You will cry mid combat to make an opening for your friends.
You will use your enemies bodies to fight for you.
You no longer get you power from you oath, you get it from breaking it.
You will curse Tiamat and the chromatic dragons and try to hunt them down.

Kobolds work great with dexadin and steed.

I will refloof the Pegasus to a little metallic dragon.
Maybe the dire wolf to a worg and the mastiff as a small worg.



I hope this is the stuff you were hoping to see.

[Nhorianscum]

An easy way to make this work conceptually is Oath of the crown > Oathbreaker.

A good example of implementation is the change of alliance from the crown to the blood of vol in Ebberon. No need for any edge or delusion as the given example is a purely pragmatic change based on the survival of a nation.

[Aussiehams]

Maybe start Vengeance trying to track down a necromancer to take your revenge for (insert back story here), but when you catch up with them they convince/tempt you to join them or sell their POV and the benefits of Necromancy. Switch sides, thereby breaking your oath and getting an undead focus. It might be hard to be Good though.

[Evaar]

You were a Paladin loyal to your king, but madness gripped him. When revolution started you defended him, but his cruelty only grew. On the final night of his reign, when the revolutionaries stormed the castle, he commanded his pyromancers to burn the entire city to the ground - loyalist, revolutionary, civilian, and all. Finally you could not accept his cruelty and you turned your sword on him.

Now you are shamed for the greatest thing you have ever done. Oathbreaker, they call you. Among other names.

Now you hold a grudge against those who claim to be superior to you on the basis of an honor that would have you stand idly while thousands of innocents burn. Oaths are for fools and the blind. Now you fight for your own heart, no longer bound to the whims of lords and kings.

*May be ever so slightly inspired by a pre-existing fictional character.

**EVER so slightly.

[moonfly7]

I have one actually. A female drow oath breaker. She used to be oath of conquest, and worked as a paladin of lolth capturing slaves and working to break them. But one day, her caravan was hit by orcs. She almost died. But was saved by an adventuring party. At first, she tried to kill them, but over time, she stops, and renounces her ways. She never gains a new oath after she breaks the one to lolth, refusing to swear fealty to another creature, or bind her free will again. Now, she fights who she wants, while struggling to remember that drow aren't the superior race. She's now true neutral slash neutral good. Her time on the surface and her humbling by the orcs has made her realize drow society isn't what she thought it was, and she's loyal now only to herself, and those she considers friends. She can still be a jerk though, especially to men.

[GlenSmash!]

I have one actually. A female drow oath breaker. She used to be oath of conquest, and worked as a paladin of lolth capturing slaves and working to break them. But one day, her caravan was hit by orcs. She almost died. But was saved by an adventuring party. At first, she tried to kill them, but over time, she stops, and renounces her ways. She never gains a new oath after she breaks the one to lolth, refusing to swear fealty to another creature, or bind her free will again. Now, she fights who she wants, while struggling to remember that drow aren't the superior race. She's now true neutral slash neutral good. Her time on the surface and her humbling by the orcs has made her realize drow society isn't what she thought it was, and she's loyal now only to herself, and those she considers friends. She can still be a jerk though, especially to men.

Nice. Oath of Conquest, and then stop conquesting was my first thought too.

[Tawmis]

I have one actually. A female drow oath breaker. She used to be oath of conquest, and worked as a paladin of lolth capturing slaves and working to break them. But one day, her caravan was hit by orcs. She almost died. But was saved by an adventuring party. At first, she tried to kill them, but over time, she stops, and renounces her ways. She never gains a new oath after she breaks the one to lolth, refusing to swear fealty to another creature, or bind her free will again. Now, she fights who she wants, while struggling to remember that drow aren't the superior race. She's now true neutral slash neutral good. Her time on the surface and her humbling by the orcs has made her realize drow society isn't what she thought it was, and she's loyal now only to herself, and those she considers friends. She can still be a jerk though, especially to men.

This sounds like a smashing idea for a character background! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?591882-Need-a-character-background-written-up&p=24035048#post24035048) :smallwink:

#UsingMoonFly7sOwnRequestToPromoteMyThread :smallamused:

[Sparky McDibben]

Another that could work at higher levels, pull out the cursed item from previous editions Helm of Opposite Allignment. You were once a widely feared general at the head of an unstoppable army, a literal gods-chosen avatar of conquest. Then through trickery an enemy got you to wear a Helm of Opposite Allignment, turning you into a happy chaotic good anarchist. You still have the memories, skills, and reputation of a badass unstoppable conqueror but have wholeheartedly embraced a live and let live, use their own tricks against them philosophy.

This is an outstanding idea, and I fully embrace it! My only hitch is that it also links the character's alignment to an item that can be destroyed, which might take it out of the player's hands.


So, bit of advice number one is to ditch the name, if possible. I know some people absolutely insist that the name stays, but if you can, I'd call it something else.

As for what your deal is, I'd say let's look at what powers the sub-class gives you the following:


Your bonus spells involve damage, disease, and taking away people's autonomy and agency. With Animate Dead, Bestow Curse, and Darkness thrown in for good measure.
Your Channel divinity options are controlling the undead and making people afraid of you.
Your Aura boosts the melee attacks of any fiends or undead standing near you.
Resistance to non-magical weapons.
Your capstone involves putting a dimmer on the lights, hitting anything that's afraid of you with psychic damage, and being able to weaponize the shadows for good measure.


So we've got a suite of powers centered around fear, control, the undead, and darkness. Honestly, a lot of this could jive, fluff-wise with the non-Evil versions of the Oath of Conquest; it paints a very ends-justify-the-means kind of deal. It brings to mind that quote (which I've seen attributed to so many people it's absurd): "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." The Paladin in question is such a rough person.

This is an excellent recap, thank you!


You were a Paladin loyal to your king, but madness gripped him. When revolution started you defended him, but his cruelty only grew. On the final night of his reign, when the revolutionaries stormed the castle, he commanded his pyromancers to burn the entire city to the ground - loyalist, revolutionary, civilian, and all. Finally you could not accept his cruelty and you turned your sword on him.

Now you are shamed for the greatest thing you have ever done. Oathbreaker, they call you. Among other names.

Now you hold a grudge against those who claim to be superior to you on the basis of an honor that would have you stand idly while thousands of innocents burn. Oaths are for fools and the blind. Now you fight for your own heart, no longer bound to the whims of lords and kings.

*May be ever so slightly inspired by a pre-existing fictional character.

**EVER so slightly.

"By what right does the wolf judge the lion?" :smallsmile:


I have one actually. A female drow oath breaker. She used to be oath of conquest, and worked as a paladin of lolth capturing slaves and working to break them. But one day, her caravan was hit by orcs. She almost died. But was saved by an adventuring party. At first, she tried to kill them, but over time, she stops, and renounces her ways. She never gains a new oath after she breaks the one to lolth, refusing to swear fealty to another creature, or bind her free will again. Now, she fights who she wants, while struggling to remember that drow aren't the superior race. She's now true neutral slash neutral good. Her time on the surface and her humbling by the orcs has made her realize drow society isn't what she thought it was, and she's loyal now only to herself, and those she considers friends. She can still be a jerk though, especially to men.

I really like this, actually. How did you fluff the oath-breaker abilities considering she became less evil?


This sounds like a smashing idea for a character background! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?591882-Need-a-character-background-written-up&p=24035048#post24035048) :smallwink:

#UsingMoonFly7sOwnRequestToPromoteMyThread :smallamused:

I didn't want to clutter up your thread with 3rd-party prompts. Sorry, Tawmis!

[Tawmis]

I didn't want to clutter up your thread with 3rd-party prompts. Sorry, Tawmis!

Oh, don't worry - you could have posted it there! I love the challenge! And the link is to an Oathbreaker I just wrote (for Moony).

[Waazraath]

An easy way to make this work conceptually is Oath of the crown > Oathbreaker.


Is my first thought as well Crown is all about 'serving the law'. A pally finding out that the law he was serving unquestionably is terrible and corrupt, has a good reason to break his/her oath and become an oathbreaker. Is the law formerly served is vile enough, it might be justifiable to use the evil means of the Oathbreaker against it.

If that would still qualify for 'good alignment', that depends on your table - imo neutral should be acceptable, at the least. But we could talk for pages about that here (and there has been pages of discussions about alignment stuff like this), but in the end it only matters what your table feels about this.

[Bjarkmundur]

I just came by to check if Tawmis had already posted.

Carry on

[moonfly7]

I really like this, actually. How did you fluff the oath-breaker abilities considering she became less evil?


Well, she has no qualms using every feature as is, drow don't have the cultral taboos abput mind control, necromancy, and the like.
The reasons her powers manifest at all, in my mind, is that, your drawing on an oath that doesn't exist. A paladin draws strength from specific ideals, generally from gods. Now, without the god or the ideal, your pulling from the void between the planes. Thus, necrotic powers TM.