Building a "Witch Hunter" for Eberron (OFFICIAL RULES ONLY)

[Arkhios]

Last weekend, I had a Pathfinder game where I played a character who was a member of an organization that gathers dangerous artifacts and lore, investigates rumors of malicious magic use, and hunts the perpetrators down to bring them to justice. Either immediately acting judge, jury and executioner, or if they surrender willingly, give them a fair trial, and a chance for penance.

The organization is a sub-section of a good aligned deity's church, so they're not like those people who would torch people up from even the slightest hint of magic use. Instead, knowing that magic is very real and part of everyday life (especially in Eberron), their normal procedure is to investigate whether magic has indeed been used for evil ends, and act only after - if necessary. But when they're forced to act, they do it relentlessly, and are not afraid to use force.

The game was a blast, and I had a good time myself, all things considered. But... I might have to leave the newly acquainted group nevertheless. (more of it below, inside spoiler)

The (newly acquainted) DM was less than respectful towards my fiancée, although polite. While she had a character of her own, literally everything she did, my character was given the credit for it, apparently because the DM had some kind of crush on my character's concept. The DM all but ignored her presence in the game, and at one point even spoke to us (or rather to me, as if she wasn't even there) in a manner that belittled her character as a mere bodyguard to my character, instead of a full-fledged character worth equal attention as everyone else. Due to respect and sympathy for my fiancée, who promptly said after the game that she's not coming again, I'm not sure if I can find it in myself to continue participating myself with these inconsiderate people acting like that towards her for absolutely no reason at all. But since he was polite towards me, and actively involved himself and his setting with my character's concept, I'm having mixed feelings.

My long-time DM, whose previous campaign is now on an intended hiatus (plans to continue are on the table), said a while back that in the meantime, he'd like to run a Campaign set in Eberron, and at first I was thinking of "reincarnating" my Valenar Warrior for it, but knowing that I've done it for every edition we've played in Eberron, I guess it should be time to move on from that character. After these unfortunate circumstances occurred I feel I'd like to play more with the "Witch Hunter", but I think the same concept could be ported into 5th edition reasonably well, so the concept wouldn't have to go to waste.

The character in question was an Occultist (http://pathfinder.d20srd.org/occultAdventures/classes/occultist.html) (or, more precisely, a slightly customized version of a Battle Host archetype), but since there's no similar class in 5th edition (at least none that's immediately obvious), I'm asking for help to come up with a build. I'm open for multicassing. In fact, I'm prepared for it.

My character's weapons of choice were a Bastard Sword (Geralt of Rivia was definitely involved in the concept) and a Light Repeating Crossbow (if you've seen Hugh Jackman's VanHelsing, you'll know why ^^)

Honestly, I really don't like Matt Mercer's homebrew classes, at all. That alone should be enough to avoid suggesting those classes...

The race is preferably human, although I might be persuaded to play an Aasimar (if DM allows them), or a Kalashtar.

In addition to how to build the character with 5th edition, I could use some help to tie the character better into Eberron lore. For example, I feel that the Church of the Silver Flame might be the best choice for providing patronage for the Organization's agenda, but that's all I've been able to conclude so far.

[JackPhoenix]

Lore bard is a good pick for Argentum agent. You got skills, including expertise (investigation, perception, insight and arcana may all be good picks), you *can* use weapons, unlike most full-casters (though lore bard sucks at it), and unlike rogue-based characters (though Inquisitive rogue may also be interesting) you have spells useful for the investigation, and your spell listt can be further improved by picking stuff from other classes through magical secrets.

If you care more about the "hunt" part than the investigation, monster slayer ranger can also serve... despite the name, most of the class abilities are aimed against spellcasters instead of "monsters".

[BarneyBent]

I reckon a Monster Hunter Ranger/Arcana Cleric multiclass could work. Mystra is the goddess of magic and is good aligned, so hunting down evil magic users would be within her Clerical Domain.

You could also do a Paladin/Lore Bard multiclass. Use your superior knowledge of Arcane and eldritch lore to smite evil, etc.

[BloodSnake'sCha]

Lore bard is a good pick for Argentum agent. You got skills, including expertise (investigation, perception, insight and arcana may all be good picks), you *can* use weapons, unlike most full-casters (though lore bard sucks at it), and unlike rogue-based characters (though Inquisitive rogue may also be interesting) you have spells useful for the investigation, and your spell listt can be further improved by picking stuff from other classes through magical secrets.

If you care more about the "hunt" part than the investigation, monster slayer ranger can also serve... despite the name, most of the class abilities are aimed against spellcasters instead of "monsters".

+1 for bard.

I will say use the ritual caster wizard as a feat for extra finding magic and utilities stuff.

[Fable Wright]

May I present to you the Artificer class (https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/artificer), and specifically the (currently-UA, but will be released in Wayfinder's Guide to Eberron) Archivist archetype?

You...
—Are a half-caster
—Cast spells with your implements
—Can imbue objects with a bit of your mind, and gain powers in return
—Can handle yourself in hand to hand with Arcane Armament
—Can craft items to hand to your allies
—Get Detect Thoughts, Locate Objects, and other good info-gathering abilities
—Can partially respecialize given a long rest

It's the most Eberron class in D&D, and the closest thing to the Occultist I can find.

Alternatively, Knowledge Cleric, though that sacrifices melee for raw info-gathering.

[Arkhios]

I reckon a Monster Hunter Ranger/Arcana Cleric multiclass could work. Mystra is the goddess of magic and is good aligned, so hunting down evil magic users would be within her Clerical Domain.

You could also do a Paladin/Lore Bard multiclass. Use your superior knowledge of Arcane and eldritch lore to smite evil, etc.

Monster Hunter/Arcana Cleric is not a bad idea, to be honest. Although, I specifically mentioned the setting is Eberron. Mystra is Forgotten Realms deity. We prefer to stay with in-setting lore.

My character in the now-on-hiatus campaign is already a Paladin, and I'd like to avoid playing one this time, unless it's the only option. Which, it fortunately isn't, as seen below.


May I present to you the Artificer class (https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/artificer), and specifically the (currently-UA, but will be released in Wayfinder's Guide to Eberron) Archivist archetype?

You...
—Are a half-caster
—Cast spells with your implements
—Can imbue objects with a bit of your mind, and gain powers in return
—Can handle yourself in hand to hand with Arcane Armament
—Can craft items to hand to your allies
—Get Detect Thoughts, Locate Objects, and other good info-gathering abilities
—Can partially respecialize given a long rest

It's the most Eberron class in D&D, and the closest thing to the Occultist I can find.

Alternatively, Knowledge Cleric, though that sacrifices melee for raw info-gathering.

OH, right! Archivist, of course! I'm clearly in need of vacation (only 3 and half days left!) since I forgot the most obvious class: Artificer. I literally made a Valenar Archivist build maybe a month ago, to experiment (merely on paper) how you could play an Artificer "Out of the box". I even came to the same conclusions that an Archivist feels a lot like an Occultist.

I do prefer to be able to handle my prey one on one, so Knowledge cleric is perhaps not the best option, indeed.

There's just one 'but', however. I'd really want to get proficiency with Longsword or Greatsword. Any suggestions how should I get around with that "predicament"? It's really important part of the character concept. Should I multiclass or simply take the Weapon Master feat as my Human bonus feat? And, if I should multiclass, which class would you suggest? I know that a Fighter is probably the best option, but I'm not too worried about going for another route either, even with ability score restrictions in mind.

[BarneyBent]

That's not a bad idea, to be honest. Although, I specifically mentioned the setting is Eberron. Mystra is Forgotten Realms deity. We prefer to stay with in-setting lore

Right, of course, that was dumb of me! Maybe a cleric of Aureon, given the relationship with the Shadow?

[Arkhios]

Lore bard is a good pick for Argentum agent. You got skills, including expertise (investigation, perception, insight and arcana may all be good picks), you *can* use weapons, unlike most full-casters (though lore bard sucks at it), and unlike rogue-based characters (though Inquisitive rogue may also be interesting) you have spells useful for the investigation, and your spell listt can be further improved by picking stuff from other classes through magical secrets.

If you care more about the "hunt" part than the investigation, monster slayer ranger can also serve... despite the name, most of the class abilities are aimed against spellcasters instead of "monsters".

Since I'm at work I wasn't able earlier to dig deeper into what this Argentum is, but apparently it aligns perfectly with the initial idea of having Church of the Silver Flame in the background.

What would you say, would an "Archivist with a Warrior-bent" work as an Argentum Agent whose missions are involved with investigation and hunting down of evil magic users, including their tools (dangerous artifacts and lore), as was the character's idea? I'd be all game with delivering any found items to the agency for research, for example.


Right, of course, that was dumb of me! Maybe a cleric of Aureon, given the relationship with the Shadow?

Aureon isn't not a bad option, either. Definitely worth considering, if my DM feels that an Argentum agent is not good idea for some reason.

[Spectrulus]

In one of my campaigns, I have a player using Eldritch knight plus an amulet of detect magic doing very well. As a thought.

[Nhorianscum]

Last weekend, I had a Pathfinder game where I played a character who was a member of an organization that gathers dangerous artifacts and lore, investigates rumors of malicious magic use, and hunts the perpetrators down to bring them to justice. Either immediately acting judge, jury and executioner, or if they surrender willingly, give them a fair trial, and a chance for penance.

The organization is a sub-section of a good aligned deity's church, so they're not like those people who would torch people up from even the slightest hint of magic use. Instead, knowing that magic is very real and part of everyday life (especially in Eberron), their normal procedure is to investigate whether magic has indeed been used for evil ends, and act only after - if necessary. But when they're forced to act, they do it relentlessly, and are not afraid to use force.

The game was a blast, and I had a good time myself, all things considered. But... I might have to leave the newly acquainted group nevertheless. (more of it below, inside spoiler)

The (newly acquainted) DM was less than respectful towards my fiancée, although polite. While she had a character of her own, literally everything she did, my character was given the credit for it, apparently because the DM had some kind of crush on my character's concept. The DM all but ignored her presence in the game, and at one point even spoke to us (or rather to me, as if she wasn't even there) in a manner that belittled her character as a mere bodyguard to my character, instead of a full-fledged character worth equal attention as everyone else. Due to respect and sympathy for my fiancée, who promptly said after the game that she's not coming again, I'm not sure if I can find it in myself to continue participating myself with these inconsiderate people acting like that towards her for absolutely no reason at all. But since he was polite towards me, and actively involved himself and his setting with my character's concept, I'm having mixed feelings.

My long-time DM, whose previous campaign is now on an intended hiatus (plans to continue are on the table), said a while back that in the meantime, he'd like to run a Campaign set in Eberron, and at first I was thinking of "reincarnating" my Valenar Warrior for it, but knowing that I've done it for every edition we've played in Eberron, I guess it should be time to move on from that character. After these unfortunate circumstances occurred I feel I'd like to play more with the "Witch Hunter", but I think the same concept could be ported into 5th edition reasonably well, so the concept wouldn't have to go to waste.

The character in question was an Occultist (http://pathfinder.d20srd.org/occultAdventures/classes/occultist.html) (or, more precisely, a slightly customized version of a Battle Host archetype), but since there's no similar class in 5th edition (at least none that's immediately obvious), I'm asking for help to come up with a build. I'm open for multicassing. In fact, I'm prepared for it.

My character's weapons of choice were a Bastard Sword (Geralt of Rivia was definitely involved in the concept) and a Light Repeating Crossbow (if you've seen Hugh Jackman's VanHelsing, you'll know why ^^)

Honestly, I really don't like Matt Mercer's homebrew classes, at all. That alone should be enough to avoid suggesting those classes...

The race is preferably human, although I might be persuaded to play an Aasimar (if DM allows them), or a Kalashtar.

In addition to how to build the character with 5th edition, I could use some help to tie the character better into Eberron lore. For example, I feel that the Church of the Silver Flame might be the best choice for providing patronage for the Organization's agenda, but that's all I've been able to conclude so far.

Looking at it battle host is pretty much workable as a Hexblade or EK as those directly tie into the mechanics of the class

I'd go with a crown loyalist in Karrnath as concept and build from there. The Blood of Vol is into some deeply shady shiz and trying to connect them in some form or another with worship of the dragon below (be it as a whole, as a splinter group, or as a mad delusion) to discredit the organization just seems like pure fun. Worshiping the silver flame is a nice bit of additional character motivation but the flame itself nessecarily our driving force for a witchhunter. (I may be slightly obsessed with Karrnath and house Oriens). Pretty much any hunt for dragon below cultists works for the witchhunter concept though.

My personal preferance would be to start with inquis rouge or monster hunter fighter as a base (Mark of passage human) and roll with it for low magic, for more oomph knowledge cleric/artificer is our pull.

If you want to recreate battle bond though Hexblade or EK becomes our base of choice dipping for better skills into rouge/bard (or just taking prodigy).

(Alternate concepts include a gnome operative of the trust, a xenophobic orc druid, etc. Intruige in Ebberon is like water in more water. Honestly I'd sit down with your group and DM and work out a concept that jibes with the rest of the table to prevent excessive party conflict. The nation of choice for this campain really heavily determines our opportunities for witchhunting.)

[Fable Wright]

There's just one 'but', however. I'd really want to get proficiency with Longsword or Greatsword. Any suggestions how should I get around with that "predicament"? It's really important part of the character concept. Should I multiclass or simply take the Weapon Master feat as my Human bonus feat? And, if I should multiclass, which class would you suggest? I know that a Fighter is probably the best option, but I'm not too worried about going for another route either, even with ability score restrictions in mind.

Vhuman with Weapon Master nets you +2 Str/+1 Int, four weapons of choice, and one wildcard skill.

High Elf nets you +2 Dex/+1 Int, Longsword and Bow proficiencies, and Perception, plus a cantrip and Darkvision.

Fighter or Paladin dips make level 5 painful, but it's a question of whether you like heavy armor, fighting style, and action surge or heavy armor, fighting style, smite, and a few extra spells known at the cost of Cha investment.

[RedMage125]

Regarding the Lore, a member of the Ashbound druid sect immediately came to mind for me when you discussed your concept.

Now, you wouldn't have to be a member of a druid class. Ranger or Bard could work as well, but I would favor Ranger, as tracking down malicious magic users fits the theme.

Just another thematic note. I fully agree that CotSF and Aureon also work great.

[Man_Over_Game]

I reckon a Monster Hunter Ranger/Arcana Cleric multiclass could work.

Conceptually, I'm fairly certain the Monster Slayer was designed with Geralt in mind.

[Vogie]

Monster Slayer/Arcana Cleric is probably the best Wisdom MC you can get. Ranger Supplies required weapon proficiency

If you want a non-artificer option that is a Intelligence-Based MC (focusing on investigation & Arcana), your best bet is likely Eldritch Knight / War Wizard, flavoring your spells as activating items, similar to how the PF Occultist works. Fighter supplies required weapon proficiency

If you want a Charisma-Based MC, I'd use Lore Bard with a 3 level dip in Hexblade Warlock. Either handwave the RAW patron entirely, or have your Eberron House or deity be the ultimate patron that is supplying you with the weapons. Hexblade supplies required weapon proficiency.

Another Charisma option, provided UA is available, is a Seeker Warlock pairing with either Paladin or Fighter for armor & weapon proficiency. While Seeker is high-utility, high-survivability subclass, it's ultimate goal is seeking out hidden knowledge

[Arkhios]

I think I'm settling in with the Artificer (Archivist), but likely starting with 1 level of Fighter, for both the armor and weapon proficiencies, even though Intelligence saving throw proficiency would be very thematic for the character concept. It's simply that, from the beginning, I've envisioned the character slightly more as a warrior and less as a spellcaster, and the character needs the training to use any weapon he might get his hands upon.

I'll go with the CotSF and Argentium, because I like how the Church has officially denied any connection to and the existence of the agency. Unofficially, however... :smallwink:

I was thinking of taking Aberrant Dragonmark as my extra feat, with the aberrant mark flaw being "a source of constant physical pain". The character is from Thrane, and sought aid for the pain from the priests of the Church, and because he showed eagerness and great promise to fight the corruption in all of its forms, both external -- and internal, he was taken in as an Acolyte and eventually joined the Argentium. The character is not, however, blind to the corruption within Thrane's theocracy, and would actually prefer to see the monarchy restored.

I'm still unsure whether we roll stats or use point-buy, so I'm going to use Point-Buy for the time being. If we roll instead, I can use the point-buy as guideline for how to distribute the rolls.

Str 16, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 8; (including +1 Str & +1 Int from vHuman; +1 Con from Aberrant Dragonmark).

From Fighter, my Fighting Style is going to be Archery, both because it's traditional in Thrane and because with that I can mitigate the lower Dexterity bonus to ranged attack rolls, while focusing on increasing Strength the most. As a result, my melee and ranged attack bonuses will start as equal, and eventually melee will become slightly better. I'm fully aware that the bonus to my ranged weapon damage rolls is just +1 due to Dex, but that's okay to be honest.

The primary weapon of choice will be Longsword, and as a ranged back-up weapon I'll have Heavy Crossbow, which I can use with Repeating Shot infusion later. As for armor, the heavier, the better.

[Corran]

Just in case no one mentioned it yet, take a look at this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?583957-An-Eclectic-Collection-of-Fun-and-Effective-Builds) arcana cleric build (it's build #4 in the op). Zone of truth would be a nice spell to have for your concept too.

[Arkhios]

Just in case no one mentioned it yet, take a look at this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?583957-An-Eclectic-Collection-of-Fun-and-Effective-Builds) arcana cleric build (it's build #4 in the op). Zone of truth would be a nice spell to have for your concept too.

Thanks for the suggestion, but I like Fighter/Archivist more, conceptually, because it's very much like the original class from PF (Occultist/Battle Host, which is basically a warrior-like occultist, and the occultist is intelligence based class).