Golems and Immutable Form (or... why can I polymorph X, but not Y?)

[SpikeFightwicky]

Question(s):
1) Is the Immutable Form ability common to golems explained anywhere? Is it part of the magic that creates them? For example, what if I had a living creature that was magically / alchemically altered with parts of other creatures into a weird amalgam (via homebrew)? Would it be out of the question that because there are 4-5 creatures that make up the whole, created by magic means, that it would be a reasonable candidate for immutable form?

2) Incorporeal beings can be polymorphed, right? Is that weird? Like... can a specter be ripped from the ethereal plan and turned into a corporeal cat, or does it turn into an ethereal cat?

3) If I turn a book into a bearded devil using True Polymorph, does that devil pop back to the nine hells if it dies and queue up in the infernal hierarchy like any other devil? If you treated that bearded devil with love and care and it remains friendly, is this a way to get someone on the "inside" of hell's hierarchy?

[Willie the Duck]

Question(s):
1) Is the Immutable Form ability common to golems explained anywhere? Is it part of the magic that creates them? For example, what if I had a living creature that was magically / alchemically altered with parts of other creatures into a weird amalgam (via homebrew)? Would it be out of the question that because there are 4-5 creatures that make up the whole, created by magic means, that it would be a reasonable candidate for immutable form?

Regarding Immutable form, I'm pretty sure what you see in the monster description is what you get. Grander questions of 'why' aren't usually forthcoming for monsters (unless they are expanded upon in further books, such as the spotlight monsters in Volo's). Historically (well, D&D historically) golems have been immune to all magic (their role was 'that encounter the magic user can't get us out of'). This seems to be a highly toned-down version of that. Regarding your specific scenario, homebrew means the only things out of the question are things the DM doesn't agree to.


2) Incorporeal beings can be polymorphed, right? Is that weird? Like... can a specter be ripped from the ethereal plan and turned into a corporeal cat, or does it turn into an ethereal cat?

I only looked at specters and polymorph doesn't appear to be in their list of immunities. As to weird, I'd say 'sorta?' -- I mean, incorporeal is another thing that has been toned down in this edition (specters specifically can't just hide out in walls for all time until needed, etc. A lot of that seems to have been done for play-balance reasons, as opposed to an overarching logic.


3) If I turn a book into a bearded devil using True Polymorph, does that devil pop back to the nine hells if it dies and queue up in the infernal hierarchy like any other devil? If you treated that bearded devil with love and care and it remains friendly, is this a way to get someone on the "inside" of hell's hierarchy?

Object into creature polymorphs are the least defined, and frankly unhelpful for questions like what happens after they die. If objects polymorphed into creatures suddenly have souls and afterlives, well then spellcasters seem to have an end-run over lots of things in the larger D&D cosmology. Regarding treating a bearded devil with love and care, remember that your apparent goal is to get your DM to agree that the object has become an actual bearded devil, so it will behave as a bearded devil. That means it will act as the DM thinks a bearded devil will act (towards people who have treated it with love and care). My understanding is that bearded devils are still devils, and don't really have friends (and/or certain will still betray them, etc.). That might be more positive than the average joe off the street, but it is best having "an 'in'" with someone "on the 'inside' of hell's hierarchy," not "having someone" there. Second issue-you may have created a new bearded devil, and the DM may rule that it is a real one and it will pop back to the nine hells when slain, but it still is a stranger down there with no network or anything. So it is unlikely to have any specific 'ins' upon which the party can capitalize.

[SpikeFightwicky]

1)
I figure it's all ok in the spirit of homebrew, my main worry is someone trying to polymorph an enemy and then calling shenanigans if it doesn't work. It's easier to design something if I can find a basis :smallbiggrin: I'm mostly glad I didn't miss anything in the golem descriptions (though I wish there was more fluff).

2)
I find it so strange how 5th edition did away with lots of traditional immunities. I'm trying to wrap my head around the logistics of polymorph when used against things that used to be immune to that kind of stuff. Though I do like the surprise factor. Like using Animal Shapes to make a bunch of lackeys into giant scorpions that pop back into lackeys to keep attacking.

3)
I find it odd because for the hour, the new creature is friendly towards you and your companions. When you lose control, it says it "might remain friendly, depending on how you treated it." But I also agree with you that it is a full devil. So will it be a lawful evil devil with a soft spot for you and your companions? I guess it's just DM's call.

NOTE: I just thought of a BBEG (probably a lich) who has been filling a massive library with books that are polymorphed people who have wronged them. Bonus points: each book is a biography on the polymorphed victim, but according to the lich, and negatively biased. Maybe the party will be sent to steal a book from the library :smallbiggrin: