An odd question, but I need some feedback.

[Magic_Hat]

I'm thinking of buying a scooter. I'm an adult so obviously I need an adult scooter. All the scooters I've looked said they can "support riders up to 220 lbs." I exceed that weight. I'm wondering (in general) how much faith I should put into these weight requirements? I mean I've heard that expiration dates aren't 100% accurate, and you can go past them.

I'm just wondering if someone heavier than 220 lbs. would break it as I don't want to buy something I end up break.

[Anymage]

Unfortunately this sort of question is tricky for the board. If I tell you that a scooter can handle a lot more weight and it turns out that I'm wrong, you'll have damaged or destroyed a device and possibly injured yourself. Since the best guess most of us can give is that the company lists their specs for a reason, it's best to accept what's written on the box.

[Razade]

Yeah. The answer is pretty much "listen to the listed weight". Any other answer would be irresponsible at the least and a liability to boot. Find a scooter that fits your weight.

[darkrose50]

I kept telling my family: "Honest to god, there are grown-***-men on <kick-to-move> scooters downtown." I don't fault them, it is just new and somewhat shocking. For a few years it was just men that I saw. This summer I have seen about four women scooting around so far.

[DavidSh]

These days I see a couple of competing brands of free-range rental electric scooters on the sidewalks, with the basic shape of a kick-to-move scooter. Both men and women seem to be using them, but I haven't noticed anybody obviously heavy among them.

Then there are motor scooters more like the classic Vespa. I saw a couple of them on a bike path the other day, annoying everybody else.

[ve4grm]

I'm thinking of buying a scooter. I'm an adult so obviously I need an adult scooter. All the scooters I've looked said they can "support riders up to 220 lbs." I exceed that weight. I'm wondering (in general) how much faith I should put into these weight requirements? I mean I've heard that expiration dates aren't 100% accurate, and you can go past them.

I'm just wondering if someone heavier than 220 lbs. would break it as I don't want to buy something I end up break.

Background - I'm an engineer, and I am familiar with design limits and what goes into them. I do not design scooters or other mechanical devices, but I have taken the courses to understand the subject matter at a basic level. As such, this is not professional advice, just educated statements.

First off, yes there is a certain factor of safety built into these limits. A 220-lb rated scooter won't shatter if a 221-lb person gets on it. The difficulty is in figuring out what that factor of safety is. Some things (buildings, elevator capacities, etc) have relatively large factors of safety, because it's a major issue if they fail, and it's not hard to build in that safety. Other things have lower factors of safety because it's physically impossible to build in a higher one (airplanes run on low factor of safety, but get examined extremely thoroughly so it's still sufficient), not cost effective to do so, or just not required because it's considered to be a minor risk.

A scooter like this would fall into that last category of cost savings and minor risk if it fails. As such, I'd expect it to have a 10-20% factor of safety at most. (And note that "failure" and "comfortable to ride because it isn't sagging in the middle" are two different things.)

So if you're 230 lbs? You're probably ok. Know you're still voiding the warranty, though.

If you're 270? I probably wouldn't waste the money.

Anywhere in between, and that's a judgement call you need to make based on how much you can afford to waste if you do break it because it wasn't built well enough.

[ve4grm]

Also, there apparently are some scooters made for us bigger folks. This comparison has a 264-lb and an 800-lb scooter (though the amazon link for that one is out of stock) - I'd say do more research before buying a small one.

https://www.outsidepursuits.com/best-adult-kick-scooter/

Link to the scooters in question: https://www.xootr.com/

[Xyril]

So I was reading the review, and apparently the deck is made up of "solid magnesium," apparently powder coated so that it doesn't spontaneously react with the atmosphere. Is that really safe? I mean, if it's as strong as they claim it is, then I suppose breaching the passivation layer would require enough force to seriously harm the rider anyway, but it seems a bit risky using a flare as your structural support.

[Peelee]

So I was reading the review, and apparently the deck is made up of "solid magnesium," apparently powder coated so that it doesn't spontaneously react with the atmosphere. Is that really safe? I mean, if it's as strong as they claim it is, then I suppose breaching the passivation layer would require enough force to seriously harm the rider anyway, but it seems a bit risky using a flare as your structural support.

Depends. If you have a bottle of O2 and a bottle of O3, you have two bottles of pure oxygen but they'll react very differently.

[Xyril]

Depends. If you have a bottle of O2 and a bottle of O3, you have two bottles of pure oxygen but they'll react very differently.

Ummm, that's true, but oxygen is an element that forms molecules through covalent bonds, meaning (among other things) that a tank full of 3-atom molecules and a tank full of 2-atom molecules actually presents a meaningful distinction. (Also, that the bonds in one form might be far less stable than the bonds in another form.)

As far as I can remember, the same can't really be said about metallic bonds in a solid metal. I mean, I suppose if you're knocking magnesium bits around using a high-energy plasma, then maybe there's a meaningful difference between a Mg2 particle and an Mg3 particle in terms of how they interact with the environment. For a solid, pure metal, however, I don't think there's a distinction between calling something a large chunk of individual Mg all stuck together, and a single Mggigantic number times a mole

IIRC, early magnesium aircraft parts would burst into flames because they didn't do a good enough job keeping them sealed away. I don't know if this problem was solved by better engineering, or just using better metals or alloys as a substitute.

[Peelee]

Ummm, that's true, but oxygen is an element that forms molecules through covalent bonds, meaning (among other things) that a tank full of 3-atom molecules and a tank full of 2-atom molecules actually presents a meaningful distinction. (Also, that the bonds in one form might be far less stable than the bonds in another form.)

As far as I can remember, the same can't really be said about metallic bonds in a solid metal.

Nonsense, you just have to push the atoms really close together. Also, i solved alchemy - you just take lead and rip off a few protons. Boom! Gold. Nobody cares about the neutrons, they probably won't mind having a few extras.

https://media1.tenor.com/images/b4f2052a26aa3633a1073e9577f6b70c/tenor.gif

[Tvtyrant]

So I was reading the review, and apparently the deck is made up of "solid magnesium," apparently powder coated so that it doesn't spontaneously react with the atmosphere. Is that really safe? I mean, if it's as strong as they claim it is, then I suppose breaching the passivation layer would require enough force to seriously harm the rider anyway, but it seems a bit risky using a flare as your structural support.

They used to use very high percentage magnesium in car engines without it being a common issue. You can watch videos of people who heat them up to cherry red and then strike them to ignite them, it takes a lot of effort. I also owned a magnesium firestarter as a kid and tried to get it to ignite without having any success. So I doubt there is any danger there, unless they set out with a blowtorch and a crowbar to get it to burn.

[shawnhcorey]

Another problem with going over the weight limit is that the scooter may not function properly. For example, the steering may bind making it difficult to turn. There may be more to the weight limit than it simply breaking.

[Glimbur]

They used to use very high percentage magnesium in car engines without it being a common issue. You can watch videos of people who heat them up to cherry red and then strike them to ignite them, it takes a lot of effort. I also owned a magnesium firestarter as a kid and tried to get it to ignite without having any success. So I doubt there is any danger there, unless they set out with a blowtorch and a crowbar to get it to burn.

Alloyed magnesium will not burn nearly as readily as the pure stuff. And they are using an alloy because it is stronger. So, I would not worry about it.

[ve4grm]

So I was reading the review, and apparently the deck is made up of "solid magnesium," apparently powder coated so that it doesn't spontaneously react with the atmosphere. Is that really safe? I mean, if it's as strong as they claim it is, then I suppose breaching the passivation layer would require enough force to seriously harm the rider anyway, but it seems a bit risky using a flare as your structural support.

Yeah, ignore that part of the review, they don't know what they're talking about. The Mg deck makes it lighter, not stronger. The strength looks like it comes from that nice arched aluminum connector between the deck and the steering column, and that it folds from the bottom if the arch, not the top.

Also, while MG is part of flares, it doesn't react with air or water except to oxidize (https://www.webelements.com/magnesium/chemistry.html). It's used in flares because, once lit, it burns hot and bright, but so as long as you don't make a habit of setting the scooter on fire you're probably fine. (And the flares contain powdered Mg, not solid, anyways because solid doesn't even burn well. I have a Mg fire starter at home. You need to shave the Mg off of it in order to ignite it. Otherwise it just sits in your pocket, quite safe. Here's a video from Wikipedia showing the ignition of a solid Mg block. It takes 2.5 minutes of direct heat from a white-hot blowtorch for it to flare. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Burning_Magnesium_Block!.ogv))

Besides, they have cheaper ones on their website with wood and plastic decks, rated for the same weight, so I wouldn't bother with the Mg one anyways.

[Magic_Hat]

Also, there apparently are some scooters made for us bigger folks. This comparison has a 264-lb and an 800-lb scooter (though the amazon link for that one is out of stock) - I'd say do more research before buying a small one.

https://www.outsidepursuits.com/best-adult-kick-scooter/

Link to the scooters in question: https://www.xootr.com/

Thank you. I will look into those.

[veti]

Another problem with going over the weight limit is that the scooter may not function properly. For example, the steering may bind making it difficult to turn. There may be more to the weight limit than it simply breaking.

Yes, this would be my worry too. The body may not fail catastrophically, but it might bend a little bit and become harder to manoeuvre. Or the suspension (yes, that's a thing on modern scooters) might gradually fail. And failures like that would get slowly worse over time, they wouldn't be immediately obvious when you first try it out.

[ve4grm]

Yes, this would be my worry too. The body may not fail catastrophically, but it might bend a little bit and become harder to manoeuvre. Or the suspension (yes, that's a thing on modern scooters) might gradually fail. And failures like that would get slowly worse over time, they wouldn't be immediately obvious when you first try it out.

Yeah, all of those should be what the weight limit (and its factor of safety) actually refer to. You probably won't snap the deck too easily.

[razorback]

As a motorcycle rider for 30+ years, my guess is the riding/handling characteristics, breaking performance and acceleration are the major concerns for the weight limit.
Maybe a 250 or 300 motorcycle would have the weight capacity you would need.

[Magic_Hat]

As a motorcycle rider for 30+ years, my guess is the riding/handling characteristics, breaking performance and acceleration are the major concerns for the weight limit.
Maybe a 250 or 300 motorcycle would have the weight capacity you would need.

:smallconfused:

I'm in the market for a scooter. Like a scooter your power by your feet and stand on.

[Peelee]

:smallconfused:

I'm in the market for a scooter. Like a scooter your power by your feet and stand on.

"Scooter" can refer to a skateboard with a handlebar or a very low powered automatic-transmission motorcycle. It was pretty clear to me you meant the former, but I can understand someone assuming the latter at first.

[razorback]

:smallconfused:

I'm in the market for a scooter. Like a scooter your power by your feet and stand on.


"Scooter" can refer to a skateboard with a handlebar or a very low powered automatic-transmission motorcycle. It was pretty clear to me you meant the former, but I can understand someone assuming the latter at first.

Yup, scooter in my head means motor powered. Never heard of the foot one referenced that way. Learn something new everyday.

[Magic_Hat]

Yup, scooter in my head means motor powered. Never heard of the foot one referenced that way. Learn something new everyday.

Then what do you call these:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/85/Kickboards_Jahrhunderthalle_Probe_Zauberfl%C3%B6te _04-09-03.JPG/800px-Kickboards_Jahrhunderthalle_Probe_Zauberfl%C3%B6te _04-09-03.JPG

[razorback]

I thought they were called Razor's or something. Honestly, I've never given them any thought outside of watching them on Failarmy.

[Maryring]

Then what do you call these:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/85/Kickboards_Jahrhunderthalle_Probe_Zauberfl%C3%B6te _04-09-03.JPG/800px-Kickboards_Jahrhunderthalle_Probe_Zauberfl%C3%B6te _04-09-03.JPG

I call em kickbikes.

[Peelee]

I call em kickbikes.

That could also be confusingly similar to balance bikes.

Not that scooters and scooters aren't confusingly similar to begin with, of course.

[darkrose50]

The kick scooters are all over downtown Chicago. At first only men were using them (that I saw). I found the trend to be new, and unexpected. I found it to be puzzling as to why I only saw men using them. The ratio this month of men to women using kick scooters that I have seen is likely ~5:1. Cheap, quick, get some exercise (some are powered), and enjoy the summer.

The trend must be popular among the upper-class 20-30-somethings. I work in an neighborhood where the upper-class lives (it is expensive to live here). All classes work here, and commute though the area. There are ~3 yoga studios within 3-blocks, and more lamp stores, decorating stores, galleries, and bars than you can shake a stick at within walking distance. The building I work in is an old printer building (not fancy in the least). It has more men's bathrooms than women's bathrooms, and I thought that was odd . . . but printers back in the day were almost all men. They are talking about making the bathrooms more 50/50, but the company rents the building.

[Maryring]

That could also be confusingly similar to balance bikes.

Not that scooters and scooters aren't confusingly similar to begin with, of course.

It helps that I've never heard of a balance bike to begin with.