ToB - Maneuver's with one action

[smetzger]

Q: manuevers which have an Initiation of 1 action. If I have multiple attacks, can I use the manuever on the first attack and then make my other attacks as normal? Or must I give up my other attacks?

[Venger]

Q: manuevers which have an Initiation of 1 action. If I have multiple attacks, can I use the manuever on the first attack and then make my other attacks as normal? Or must I give up my other attacks?

maneuvers in tob will specify what kind of action they are (standard, swift, immediate, etc)

actions are different from attacks. if a maneuver requires a standard, you cannot also attack. many maneuvers have you attack as part of the maneuver. these are called "strikes." what maneuver specifically are you asking about?

[smetzger]

maneuvers in tob will specify what kind of action they are (standard, swift, immediate, etc)

actions are different from attacks. if a maneuver requires a standard, you cannot also attack. many maneuvers have you attack as part of the maneuver. these are called "strikes." what maneuver specifically are you asking about?

Thanks. That answers it.
So, for example Leading the Attack is a standard action. So, even if I am level 6 and have a second attack I would need to forgo my iterative attack and just use one attack.

[MisterKaws]

Adding to what Venger said: Attack Actions are a different kind of action, and are very infrequently used for extra systems. There are no maneuvers that are initiated as an Attack Action, though there are two that grant them, namely Flashing Sun and Time Stands Still. Another notable exception is Quicksilver Motion, which gives you a Move Action, which in turn can be used to take Move Action maneuvers, like Iron Heart Surge and Shadow Stride.

[Venger]

Thanks. That answers it.
So, for example Leading the Attack is a standard action. So, even if I am level 6 and have a second attack I would need to forgo my iterative attack and just use one attack.

Yes. These two things are mutually exclusive. Under normal circumstances, you may either

1) full attack with all iteratives, getting multiple attacks if your ba is above 6
2) take a standard action to initiate a maneuver, cast a spell, etc

you cannot do both of these things at once. a standard action does not consume one of your attacks. they are from two entirely separate pools

action types (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm) are the most fundamental part of gameplay, so if you have a good grasp of what they are and how they work, everything else will be much easier.

your analysis gets to the right conclusion, but it goes about it slightly the wrong way.

You're not consuming one of your iteratives to do this maneuver (so when you get ba 11, you can't initiate leading the attack and then attack twice) you are using a standard action instead to initiate a maneuver and are not interacting with or thinking about iteratives at all. Does that make sense?

You make an attack as part of the standard action used to initiate this maneuver. It's done at your highest attack bonus.

[MisterKaws]

Yes. These two things are mutually exclusive. Under normal circumstances, you may either

1) full attack with all iteratives, getting multiple attacks if your ba is above 6
2) take a standard action to initiate a maneuver, cast a spell, etc

you cannot do both of these things at once. a standard action does not consume one of your attacks. they are from two entirely separate pools

action types (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm) are the most fundamental part of gameplay, so if you have a good grasp of what they are and how they work, everything else will be much easier.

your analysis gets to the right conclusion, but it goes about it slightly the wrong way.

You're not consuming one of your iteratives to do this maneuver (so when you get ba 11, you can't initiate leading the attack and then attack twice) you are using a standard action instead to initiate a maneuver and are not interacting with or thinking about iteratives at all. Does that make sense?

You make an attack as part of the standard action used to initiate this maneuver. It's done at your highest attack bonus.

And since you're taking a Standard Action only, you can still use a Move Action. This is actually one of the most important parts of martial adepts: they are innately more mobile than normal martial classes.

[Venger]

And since you're taking a Standard Action only, you can still use a Move Action. This is actually one of the most important parts of martial adepts: they are innately more mobile than normal martial classes.

Yeah, you've still got your swift too, so you could initiate a boost or change stance.

In a normal round on your turn, you can take:
1 full-round, 1 swift or immediate
or
1 standard, 1 move, 1 swift or immediate
or
2 moves, 1 swift or immediate

with any of these options, you can take any number of free actions.

you are only allowed 1 swift OR immediate action a round. if you use one that round, you cannot use another or the other.

all these action types can only be taken on your turn, except immediate. you can use those when it's not your turn.

even though you can use immediate when it's not your turn, you CANNOT use immediates while you are flat-footed.

for example, if an enemy vrock beats you in initiative, gets a surprise round, and hurls of a cliff with telekinesis, you aren't allowed to use an immediate action to cast feather fall until your initiative comes up and you are no longer flat-footed.

[Thurbane]

As an aside, if you can wrangle the reqs, Cloak Dance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#cloakDance) gives you something to do with a move action, before or after a standard action strike.