Question about Pryotechnics and Action Surge

[Phhase]

Since it is entirely possible to Action Surge a second spell, would it be possible, for example, to cast Fire Bolt at a creature, then Action Surge cast Pyrotechnics to detonate the fire to blind/obscure? Or alternatively, be a Red/Gold/Brass dragonborn and use your breath weapon instead?

[JackPhoenix]

No. Both of those effects are instantaneous, so there's nothing to cast on, it's one blast and it's gone. Also, Pyrotechnics must be used on non-magical fire, disqualifying Fire Bolt. You can use Fire Bolt to set some flammable object on fire instead of attacking a creature and THEN target that fire with Pyrotechnics, though.

[Phhase]

non-magical fire Are you sure? RAW it just says "Choose an area of flame that you can see and that can fit within a 5-foot cube within range."

Also the whole point of using Action Surge was kinda that both effects happen at more or less the same time so that Instantaneous isn't a problem, but ehh.

Actually, that gives me another idea. If you used a ready action, you might be able to use Pyrotechnics to counterspell Fireball since the initial projectile is just a little pea of flame. That would be pretty funny.

[Damon_Tor]

Since it is entirely possible to Action Surge a second spell, would it be possible, for example, to cast Fire Bolt at a creature, then Action Surge cast Pyrotechnics to detonate the fire to blind/obscure? Or alternatively, be a Red/Gold/Brass dragonborn and use your breath weapon instead?

My wizard would have his owl familiar carry a lantern. Useful in a dungeon anyway, and when fighting broke out the owl would fly the lantern to wherever the wizard wanted his pyrotechnics and he'd set it off.

[Mellack]

It only works on nonmagical flames.
"Choose an area of nonmagical flame that you can see and that fits within a 5-foot cube within range." Xanathar's pg 163

[NNescio]

Are you sure? RAW it just says "Choose an area of flame that you can see and that can fit within a 5-foot cube within range."

The spell was nerfed in Xanathar's Guide to Everything, which being a later release takes precedence over Elemental Evil Player's Companion. Like a lot of EE control/BFC spells, sadly. The new wording reads:


Choose an area of nonmagical flame that you can see and that fits within a 5-foot cube within range. (...)




Also the whole point of using Action Surge was kinda that both effects happen at more or less the same time so that Instantaneous isn't a problem, but ehh.

That's not how action surge works. You get another action, which you can use to do something. To use an example, note that you can use your attack action to do multiple attacks, bonus action attack again (via feats or TWF), and then Action Surge again for more attacks. None of these attacks occur simultaneously (otherwise you will run into unfortunate interactions with Death and Concentration saves, massive damage, damage negation effects, etc.).

Instantaneous also means there's no fire to cast Pyrotechnics on, even if the nonmagical requirement is waived.

Unless, of course, you managed to set something on fire with Fire Bolt:


A flammable object hit by this spell ignites if it isn't being worn or carried.

You can go ahead and Pyrotechnics that. It's nonmagical, despite being lit by magical fire.



Actually, that gives me another idea. If you used a ready action, you might be able to use Pyrotechnics to counterspell Fireball since the initial projectile is just a little pea of flame. That would be pretty funny.

Magical fire, no.

Ready action occurs after the triggering action has completed, like all reactions (unless there's a specific exemption built in, like in Shield and Counterspell). So, no.

Instantaneous means there's no lingering Fireball effect to cast Pyrotechnics on. Again, no.

(You can cast Pyrotechnics on objects set on fire by Fireball, but that does not negate the original Fireball.)

[Phhase]

The spell was nerfed in Xanathar's Guide to Everything

Boooring.


That's not how action surge works.

Boring!


Ready action occurs after the triggering action has completed



no
So, no.
Again, no.

Boooooooring:sigh:

Nah, it's fine lol. Was it really that OP when you could affect magical fire though? The hole you could put in a wall of fire I imagine wouldn't last, and while it might work, I imagine it wouldn't dispel Fire Shield or Investiture of Flame.