Party cohesion (my group needs help)

[PostMortemCP]

So my group needs a more coherent way of filling out the roles. Let’s say a party with 6-7 people and a DM who always adds more and more npc to the party every session makes it a total mess.
Now I know what my next character is going to be way to far in advance. (Dwarven barbarian with the archetype of drunken brute and invulnerable rager.) and the only other player who knows how to fulfill a role is going to be a tactician from dreamscared press psionics book. So what do we need to help the party besides an alchemist for my “unkillable” dwarf gimmick?

[Elkad]

Step One. Kill the NPCs and take their stuff. 6-7 people is a great party size already.

We don't need Step Two.

Step Three. Profit.

[liquidformat]

Honestly this sounds like a lack of communication where everyone is just making whatever strikes their fancy rather than sitting down and talking about what roles need to be filled and who will fill them...

[Vizzerdrix]

Talk to the DM. As them to stop with the npcs. Then when the group sees that it is lacking in areas, work with them to fill in the gaps. With a group that large, you should be able to cover most areas.

[PostMortemCP]

So one thing I need to point out that these npcs are also like crazy unbalanced because the dm wants his power fantasies. If I bring up not liking the npcs then I may also be out of a adventuring group. As for the other players it doesn’t help that one is “slow” and the other 3 couldn’t read or write to save their own life.

[Jack_McSnatch]

So one thing I need to point out that these npcs are also like crazy unbalanced because the dm wants his power fantasies. If I bring up not liking the npcs then I may also be out of a adventuring group. As for the other players it doesn’t help that one is “slow” and the other 3 couldn’t read or write to save their own life.
If he's such a jerk that he'll kick you put for criticizing his unbalanced npcs, you might wanna find a new group. Otherwise, it might be a good idea to point out A) how much of a fustercluck combat is with 6 players, however many monsters, AND his mary-sues; or B) how none of the players get to do anything because his unbalanced npcs hog all the spotlight.

But ultimately, d&d is -and should be!- a story about the players, not the dm. He should be telling your story, not the story of his broken dmpc. If he refuses to understand that, than it may be time to move on.

[Elkad]

I love 6-8 player groups.

But you damn sure don't need NPCs in the group as well, especially overpowered ones.


The more I read, the more I like my joke answer. Kill the NPCs. Especially if they are DMPCs.

[pabelfly]

So one thing I need to point out that these npcs are also like crazy unbalanced because the dm wants his power fantasies. If I bring up not liking the npcs then I may also be out of a adventuring group. As for the other players it doesn’t help that one is “slow” and the other 3 couldn’t read or write to save their own life.

Sounds like the DM wants some time to play and not just DM. Do several people share DMing duties, or is he a forever DM?

[PostMortemCP]

Sounds like the DM wants some time to play and not just DM. Do several people share DMing duties, or is he a forever DM?

Others have dm’d but another player basically throws a bitch fit if you don’t DM like Matt Mercer. Who in my opinion is a boring dm

[PostMortemCP]

I’m going to ride out this campaign and for sure before the next one have the group sit down and discuss stuff for the next one. Cause the fastest combat we had was when I took over and said no do this this and this and boom combat is over way faster, and then had to argue over opening a magical locked door.... needless to say I was gonna open that door even if no one helped

[Crow_Nightfeath]

Sounds like the DM wants some time to play and not just DM. Do several people share DMing duties, or is he a forever DM?

I DM and play at the same time, but my characters are always more or less background characters who tend to fill a much needed hole in the party, mostly because I'm the only one who will play a healer. There is no reason whatsoever that the DM should have a character that actually takes any of the spotlight. It's part of what gives DM characters a bad rep. Course I also play in a smaller group, and I've been the soul DM in the group for years.

Sorry didn't mean to ramble on about myself, honestly though, if the DM is a close friend or just a friend if some kind I can understand not wanting to leave the group. But if this group is one you joined because they invited you to play with them then I'd leave.. if you aren't having fun what's the point?

[PostMortemCP]

I DM and play at the same time, but my characters are always more or less background characters who tend to fill a much needed hole in the party, mostly because I'm the only one who will play a healer. There is no reason whatsoever that the DM should have a character that actually takes any of the spotlight. It's part of what gives DM characters a bad rep. Course I also play in a smaller group, and I've been the soul DM in the group for years.

Sorry didn't mean to ramble on about myself, honestly though, if the DM is a close friend or just a friend if some kind I can understand not wanting to leave the group. But if this group is one you joined because they invited you to play with them then I'd leave.. if you aren't having fun what's the point?

He is a close friend and I have fun it’s just there’s some things I don’t like about the current campaign.

[PostMortemCP]

He is a close friend and I have fun it’s just there’s some things I don’t like about the current campaign.

That being said the group I play in had had various forms of issues on party cohesion for ever. Like some of them don’t even level up their own characters and make the dm do it

[RNightstalker]

That being said the group I play in had had various forms of issues on party cohesion for ever. Like some of them don’t even level up their own characters and make the dm do it

I'm not of the mind that everyone has to play a set, predetermined role in the party. When everyone does that people are basically rotating through the same characters which leads to boredom, burnout, and no fun.

As far as leveling up their own characters, I can relate on the DM side of frustration as one character was recently as many as two levels behind to the rest of the party, and I leave myself wondering why do I bust my ass to create the adventure and run it when the players can't commit...maybe FIVE minutes to level up their character between sessions every other week?!

It honestly sounds like y'all should have a sit down now before things get worse going further. People should be allowed to play the character they want to play, not who the rest of the party or the DM wants them to play. At the same token, if the players can't carry their own weight, it's time to cut the dead weight.

[mucat]

He is a close friend


If I bring up not liking the npcs then I may also be out of a adventuring group.

At least one of these statements is wrong.

[RNightstalker]

At least one of these statements is wrong.

Well said.

[PostMortemCP]

At least one of these statements is wrong.

So maybe I’m Doom singing the possibility because I just don’t want to risk upsetting him. Especially when two other players keep fighting over petty ****. One player is on their phone almost always and being annoying and walks out mid session to go do other **** like buy weed. And then the other player just wants him to focus and also stop making annoying sounds.
So right now the groups on edge about a lot

[EldritchWeaver]

So maybe I’m Doom singing the possibility because I just don’t want to risk upsetting him. Especially when two other players keep fighting over petty ****. One player is on their phone almost always and being annoying and walks out mid session to go do other **** like buy weed. And then the other player just wants him to focus and also stop making annoying sounds.
So right now the groups on edge about a lot

Sounds to me that this weed player should be removed from the group. Doesn't contribute much and has negative influence on the others.

[King of Nowhere]

So one thing I need to point out that these npcs are also like crazy unbalanced because the dm wants his power fantasies.

If I bring up not liking the npcs then I may also be out of a adventuring group.

As for the other players it doesn’t help that one is “slow” and the other 3 couldn’t read or write to save their own life.


another player basically throws a bitch fit if you don’t DM like Matt Mercer.


some of them don’t even level up their own characters and make the dm do it



two other players keep fighting over petty ****.

One player is on their phone almost always and being annoying and walks out mid session to go do other **** like buy weed.


Nice collection of red flags you have there. I only have a suggestion for you

GTFO out of that group. Do it ASAP.

They are your friends? Fine. You can be friend with them and go out with them and play board games or videogames with them. Just don't play rpg with them. Ever.

I have a party of VERY CLOSE friends (a married couple with whome I were friendly before they married, and their kids whom I saw grow up) and it has some of the same issues of your party and I came to the conclusion that after I finish the current campaign, I'm dropping roleplaying with them and will do some other form of gaming.
Your party has more, worse issues and I doubt they could be closer friends than I am with mine. So, if the right answer for my case is GTFO, it is doubly so for your situation.

[RNightstalker]

Nice collection of red flags you have there. I only have a suggestion for you

GTFO out of that group. Do it ASAP.

They are your friends? Fine. You can be friend with them and go out with them and play board games or videogames with them. Just don't play rpg with them. Ever.


I'll second the motion.

[denthor]

If half your group can not read. They are not running mages/bards or sorcerers. Maybe clerics. But most likely some variant of fighter. You need to be the change you want to balance the party you are a caster.

The DM power fantasy aside. I would run cleric/thief for the fun of it all wizard maybe but some form of caster.

Talk to NPC's get information coordinate an attack your party in one section his NPC assault from the other side. He gets his mental fun without hindering your party. Only allow what you want to fill gaps.

Congratulations it sounds like you are party leader by default

[PostMortemCP]

Nice collection of red flags you have there. I only have a suggestion for you

GTFO out of that group. Do it ASAP.

They are your friends? Fine. You can be friend with them and go out with them and play board games or videogames with them. Just don't play rpg with them. Ever.

I have a party of VERY CLOSE friends (a married couple with whome I were friendly before they married, and their kids whom I saw grow up) and it has some of the same issues of your party and I came to the conclusion that after I finish the current campaign, I'm dropping roleplaying with them and will do some other form of gaming.
Your party has more, worse issues and I doubt they could be closer friends than I am with mine. So, if the right answer for my case is GTFO, it is doubly so for your situation.

I need to point out only three people in the group are considered friends and they are the DM, the other competent player who can’t go without being a caster, and the nearly illiterate paladin. The three big problem players I could literally do without and we even want to push some of them out. If I get my own place and we can stop doing d&d at the library I’m not having half that group over. And I’ll insist we play at a place where we don’t have to be quite as quiet. Cause when I DM I want 4 players and I’m going to have to push out on that is a friend simply because he needs to learn how to shower.... and for others who said that this group seems like a mess, this is the better of the two groups I’ve played in. I live in drug town and can’t find better players

[daremetoidareyo]

Be a buffer. Dragonfire inspiration words of creation bard. Add like 6d6 sonic damage to every attack roll by like level 6.

Your DM wants his npcs to kick butt too? Help him. Your buddies need to get into place? Buff them.

Then try to seduce every major bad guy. It's funny, it gets old, then it gets funny again.

[PostMortemCP]

Be a buffer. Dragonfire inspiration words of creation bard. Add like 6d6 sonic damage to every attack roll by like level 6.

Your DM wants his npcs to kick butt too? Help him. Your buddies need to get into place? Buff them.

Then try to seduce every major bad guy. It's funny, it gets old, then it gets funny again.
Problem is if I play bard it’s going to be a sandman because I want to long con an entire court. Make my way, playing “Deas Dea’mar” as they say. I have certain characters I would love to play but you see. No one is willing to let me make a banan-dra. You take one banana from the bunch and two grow in it’s place. It’s also a small hydra and do beware of the banan-gons when the peal then they get a free breath attack

[daremetoidareyo]

Problem is if I play bard it’s going to be a sandman because I want to long con an entire court. Make my way, playing “Deas Dea’mar” as they say. I have certain characters I would love to play but you see. No one is willing to let me make a banan-dra. You take one banana from the bunch and two grow in it’s place. It’s also a small hydra and do beware of the banan-gons when the peal then they get a free breath attack

uuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhh. okay?

If you want to quit, just dominate one of the DMPCs. DMs hate that.

[Roticet]

I need to point out only three people in the group are considered friends and they are the DM, the other competent player who can’t go without being a caster, and the nearly illiterate paladin. The three big problem players I could literally do without and we even want to push some of them out. If I get my own place and we can stop doing d&d at the library I’m not having half that group over. And I’ll insist we play at a place where we don’t have to be quite as quiet. Cause when I DM I want 4 players and I’m going to have to push out on that is a friend simply because he needs to learn how to shower.... and for others who said that this group seems like a mess, this is the better of the two groups I’ve played in. I live in drug town and can’t find better players


No DnD is better than bad DnD. Honestly dude, your replies show you keep going back and forth on whether you want to be in that group or not. I get that. Word of advice though, as most others have mentioned, just get out. Sounds like a ****ty group to play with. You would be better served goin to roll20 and getting a group there. A good DnD group is one that is cohesive, understands the wants, needs, and expectations out of the other players, the group itself, and the DM. While pretty much impossible to determine in the 1st session or 2 (possibly even longer really), there should still be some cohesiveness. Sounds like the group you are with were in the back alley of a dump bar, picked up in a white van, and brought over to play DnD. If half the group isn't paying attention, or just really preventing play, then there is no reason for them to be there. As other people have mentioned. It's the players' story. That means theirs, AND yours. If you are having so many issues with the other players, and having trouble figuring out if you want to leave the group, chances are, you are best off leaving that group. If the other half you are having fun with still want to play, then by all means, get together with that half and leave the others out of it. 3-4 people+DM is plenty big enough. Hell if anything, that's 1 shy of being an avg group anyways. And if you are able to work around the DM's power fantasies with his DMPC's, and you still have fun, then by all means get with those people and have fun.

Seriously, just call up the people that have actually vested time into the current campaign with you and the DM. Set up a day that works for you guys, and let the other half know that the current campaign was cancelled. Though, I would set up another place to play than the library. Look for game shops, coffee shops, hell, a freaking bar. Or, if someone has a place, maybe their apartment or house. Hell, if there is another town close by, like 5-10 miles away, go to a LGS there or something if you guys need to. Sides, you might find some people that are like-minded and may want to join the game who might be co-operative.