Renegade Paladin
2007-10-10, 05:56 PM
Okay, I've been kicking this idea around for awhile, and the subject just came up in the AIM chat some of us from the boards run. The one I've seen the most is 2/5(level)+1, like the one that Otto the Bugbear uses in his redone classes. (See his fighter (http://dsenchuk.googlepages.com/fighter) for an example of how the progression works.) Now, it works well enough, causing the save progression to start at +1 and end at +9 at 20th level, but as you can see from looking at it in the provided link, it's staggered in kind of an odd way. (That is, most numbers are repeated only once, but 2, 6, and 7 are all repeated twice when they come up in the progression.)
Reina Sweet suggested 5/12(level)+1 since this is mathematically exactly between the RAW high and low saves (which are 1/2(level)+2 and 1/3(level), respectively), but that also staggers oddly towards the higher levels, though not as much. (It repeats numbers divisible by 3 twice and all the others only once... except for 8, which is also repeated twice.)
To illustrate what I mean, here's a chart showing the two methods, as well as the default high and low save progressions for comparison.
{table=head]Level|High Save|2/5+1 Save|5/12+1 Save|Low Save
1st|
+2|
+1|
+1|
+0
2nd|
+3|
+1|
+1|
+0
3rd|
+3|
+2|
+2|
+1
4th|
+4|
+2|
+2|
+1
5th|
+4|
+2|
+3|
+1
6th|
+5|
+3|
+3|
+2
7th|
+5|
+3|
+3|
+2
8th|
+6|
+4|
+4|
+2
9th|
+6|
+4|
+4|
+3
10th|
+7|
+5|
+5|
+3
11th|
+7|
+5|
+5|
+3
12th|
+8|
+6|
+6|
+4
13th|
+8|
+6|
+6|
+4
14th|
+9|
+6|
+6|
+4
15th|
+9|
+7|
+7|
+5
16th|
+10|
+7|
+7|
+5
17th|
+10|
+7|
+8|
+5
18th|
+11|
+8|
+8|
+6
19th|
+11|
+8|
+8|
+6
20th|
+12|
+9|
+9|
+6[/table]
Now, it seems to me that the most logical way would be very similar to the 5/12 method, only at 19th level the save would increase to +9 and remain that way to 20th, so that only numbers divisible by three are repeated twice; I just need a good formula to do that with, one that ideally wouldn't break down in epic level play. (5/12+1 almost does this; the result at 19th level is 8.916666, but you always round down.)
And the second part of my question is, once a medium save formula is decided on, what classes should get it and where? Things that immediately spring to mind to me is medium Fortitude for knights and medium Will for paladins (as well as Otto's method of giving medium Reflex and Will to fighters, since they're supposed to be conditioned to withstand the rigors of the battlefield, which include fireballs and mass Will-forcing effects), but is there anything else that it would be good for?
Reina Sweet suggested 5/12(level)+1 since this is mathematically exactly between the RAW high and low saves (which are 1/2(level)+2 and 1/3(level), respectively), but that also staggers oddly towards the higher levels, though not as much. (It repeats numbers divisible by 3 twice and all the others only once... except for 8, which is also repeated twice.)
To illustrate what I mean, here's a chart showing the two methods, as well as the default high and low save progressions for comparison.
{table=head]Level|High Save|2/5+1 Save|5/12+1 Save|Low Save
1st|
+2|
+1|
+1|
+0
2nd|
+3|
+1|
+1|
+0
3rd|
+3|
+2|
+2|
+1
4th|
+4|
+2|
+2|
+1
5th|
+4|
+2|
+3|
+1
6th|
+5|
+3|
+3|
+2
7th|
+5|
+3|
+3|
+2
8th|
+6|
+4|
+4|
+2
9th|
+6|
+4|
+4|
+3
10th|
+7|
+5|
+5|
+3
11th|
+7|
+5|
+5|
+3
12th|
+8|
+6|
+6|
+4
13th|
+8|
+6|
+6|
+4
14th|
+9|
+6|
+6|
+4
15th|
+9|
+7|
+7|
+5
16th|
+10|
+7|
+7|
+5
17th|
+10|
+7|
+8|
+5
18th|
+11|
+8|
+8|
+6
19th|
+11|
+8|
+8|
+6
20th|
+12|
+9|
+9|
+6[/table]
Now, it seems to me that the most logical way would be very similar to the 5/12 method, only at 19th level the save would increase to +9 and remain that way to 20th, so that only numbers divisible by three are repeated twice; I just need a good formula to do that with, one that ideally wouldn't break down in epic level play. (5/12+1 almost does this; the result at 19th level is 8.916666, but you always round down.)
And the second part of my question is, once a medium save formula is decided on, what classes should get it and where? Things that immediately spring to mind to me is medium Fortitude for knights and medium Will for paladins (as well as Otto's method of giving medium Reflex and Will to fighters, since they're supposed to be conditioned to withstand the rigors of the battlefield, which include fireballs and mass Will-forcing effects), but is there anything else that it would be good for?