Realism (house rules)

[DanielLC]

Sometimes it looks like Wizards of the Coast didn't check their facts. I'd like to start a thread that lists some of the errors and house rules to fix them.

Galloping horse:
Normally riding a moving mount is vigorous motion, but riding a galloping horse (which is counter intuitively very smooth) is violent motion. I've never ridden a horse in full gallop, but from what I've heard, I'd guess that it's significantly less than vigorous, and would have a 5 DC concentration check at most.

Quicksand:
If you fail a swim check in quicksand, you sink. In reality, it's nearly impossible to sink in quicksand, or, for that matter, swim. How about making a strength check to get your foot out (the real problem)?

Gravity:
When you fall, you spend the first round falling 150 feet and fall 300 feet every round after that. If it is taken as a simplistic version of terminal velocity, with you accelerating at a constant rate for the first round then ceasing to accelerate, that comes out to 8 1/3 feet per second squared. In real life, gravity is about 32 feet per second squared. This could be interpreted as the game world having lower gravity, which would explain why a first level commoner with average strength and speed can jump up five feet if they're lucky. That's enough to jump over a rather short person. The problem with that explanation is that characters jump only slightly lower in d20 modern, and I can't find falling speeds, but I suspect it's the same.

[Gralamin]

Why Are you applying Reality to D&D, a game where people can fly, stop time, and shoot fireballs? The point is Heroic fantasy, not a story in reality.

[Justyn]

I don't mean to offend, but you just killed SO many catgirls.

And as for the horse, I would say that DC 10/15 is accurate: I draw in cars all the time, even the slightest movement can throw you off. Magic requires at least as much, if not more accuracy as drawing.

[SleepingOrange]

As a person who HAS ridden a galloping horse, you really have to be in tune with the creature and concentrating on what it's doing and where it's going; splitting your attention between a horse and some-thing as complicated and nuanced as casting a magical spell would be difficult. Remember, a horse isn't a car; no matter how smooth the action, you can't just let it keep going.

Quicksand is essentially a non-newtonian fluid; a smooth, gentle action like stepping in it offers little resistance, but a focerful, jerking action like trying to get out is difficult; thus, the continuous pull of gravity would pull you down further into the quicksand(unless the quicksand has high water content; being a colloid rather than a compound, there is no fixed ratio of sand to water, thus each sample of quicksand is unique. A sample with high water content may allow a fattish person to float in it). A swim check, in my opinion, is more appropriate than a strength one, although escape artist would be better still.

Okay, the planet in the D&D campaign is uch smaller than Earth, and thus has lower gravity.

[JackMage666]

Galloping horse:
Normally riding a moving mount is vigorous motion, but riding a galloping horse (which is counter intuitively very smooth) is violent motion. I've never ridden a horse in full gallop, but from what I've heard, I'd guess that it's significantly less than vigorous, and would have a 5 DC concentration check at most.

OK, you know how it's kinda hard to ride a bike without using your hands? Now, image the bike is intelligent, and hungry, and doesn't much care for 100+ pounds on it's back. Not so much that it will buck you off, but enough in that if you don't keep control, it will do whatever it wants. It requires a bit of concentration.

[Cybren]

Okay, the planet in the D&D campaign is uch smaller than Earth, and thus has lower gravity.

That must be why trees grow to be large enough for elves to build cities on.

[SleepingOrange]

And, of course...

A wizard did it!

[NakedCelt]

More:
The density of rock. According to the Giant entry in the Monster Manual, a Medium rock — that is, one about as big as a human — weighs about 60–80 pounds... light enough for a weaker-than-average human to lift over his head. The hardness of rock. Oriental Adventures would have you believe that jade and obsidian are softer than steel, an extension of the "Extremely Low Tech" rules in the Dungeon Master's Guide. Nonsense; obsidian is harder and keeps its edge better than steel. I've heard of surgeons who've done courses in Physical Anthro, learned about stone toolmaking, and have ever since insisted on using obsidian scalpels. The reason we don't all have obsidian kitchen knives is that (a) it can't be manufactured, only found (and it's pretty rare), and (b) once found, it can't be forged or molded into new shapes, only carved. Tribal society. From the Dungeon Master's Guide:
Tribal or Clan Structure: A tribe or clan usually has a single leader who wields great — almost absolute — power like the monarch in a monarchy.Tosh. Absolute tosh. Burrowing speed. My Encyclopaedia of Animals mentions, as a striking and noteworthy fact, that the short-beaked echidna (a roughly hedgehog-sized animal) can dig a hole big enough to contain its entire body in one minute. The Monster Manual would have you believe that your average badger can go a hundred feet through the earth in that time. The habits of ravens. Ravens are at least as strong as owls of equivalent size. They attack with their beaks, not their claws, and can do as much damage in a divebombing attack as a thrown dagger. Also, they're surely the one animal whose Treasure stat shouldn't read "None" (they'll carry away anything shiny). Feline attack modes, since we've got the Monster Manual open to the Animals chapter. Cats, including big cats, do "rake" with their hind claws, but not in conjunction with a pounce — only once they've got in a good choking bite to the neck. Vampires. OK, this is folklore, not science, but... we all know vampires are killed by a stake through the heart followed by decapitation. Surely, then, they should be the one exception to the rule that undead are immune to critical hits?Is that enough to be going on with?

[NakedCelt]

Oh — one more animal correction — camels spit, and do so before the enemy gets close enough to bite. Not mentioned in their stats.

[Roderick_BR]

Vampires. OK, this is folklore, not science, but... we all know vampires are killed by a stake through the heart followed by decapitation. Surely, then, they should be the one exception to the rule that undead are immune to critical hits?
Not critical hits, only the ones that can decapitate, like a vorpal weapon. Actually, some people theorize that any undead can be decapitated, the only thing about it is that they take no additional damage, and can continue fighting, except for vampires. A critical hit won't deal additional damage or others effects, but if it's a vorpal attack, he'll die if his read is chopped off.
I'm not sure how it affects mummies and others intelligent undeads.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Okay, the planet in the D&D campaign is uch smaller than Earth, and thus has lower gravity.

There are no planets in DnD. The DMG shows you what the standard D&D world looks like on page 153. The material plane may be spherical or merely semi-spherical, but it's quite clearly the center of the universe and therefore not a planet, since it has no orbit.

[Lord Zentei]

There are no planets in DnD. The DMG shows you what the standard D&D world looks like on page 153. The material plane may be spherical or merely semi-spherical, but it's quite clearly the center of the universe and therefore not a planet, since it has no orbit.

Isn't that more a abstract representation showing the relationships in the cosmology rather than a precise map? :smallconfused:

Anyway, there is nothing wrong with playing more realistic variants: the addition of magic does not preclude that the default physics works normally, after all.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Isn't that more a abstract representation showing the relationships in the cosmology rather than a precise map? :smallconfused:

Abstract? You're talking about a game that has literal anthropomorphisations of good and evil and you're expect to find the abstract?

[Lord Zentei]

Abstract? You're talking about a game that has literal anthropomorphisations of good and evil and you're expect to find the abstract?

:smallconfused:

You seem to be misunderstanding the post.

A map can be an abstract representation of the thing it depicts. Sort of like the maps you find in metro stations: they show how the stations interconnect, not the actual distances or bearings. I'm not speaking of literary or philosophical abstractions or anything like that.

Incidentally, the worlds of D&D do indeed have planetary systems: see Spelljammer.

[Magnor Criol]

Yeah, if you can get your hands on a copy of Lords of Madness, it has a description of abberation origins in the intro, one section of which is all about how some abberations (illithids, neogi, tsochari) are from other planets.

I was about to post a quote, but then I realized I don't know if that'd violate some sort of copyright clause so I think instead I'll just say that it very clearly uses terms like "other worlds", "moons", and "star-sailing", so it's pretty definite that they're meaning that there's other planets within the material plane. Theoretically, our Earth could be one of those planets, and all the other DnD worlds are planets somewhere else within this infinite Material Plane.

[Mewtarthio]

Vampires. OK, this is folklore, not science, but... we all know vampires are killed by a stake through the heart followed by decapitation. Surely, then, they should be the one exception to the rule that undead are immune to critical hits?

How often in folklore do vampires get staked in the middle of combat? Note that I'm talking about folklore here, not modern fantasy in which vampires have ridiculously weak ribcages and apparently some sort of wood-attracting magnet in their hearts.

[Altair_the_Vexed]

Why Are you applying Reality to D&D, a game where people can fly, stop time, and shoot fireballs? The point is Heroic fantasy, not a story in reality.

The point of applying reality to D&D is that the ability to fly and stop time and shoot fireballs is only actually interesting if it is not the normal state of affairs. If every commoner, watchman and sheep is bending the players' normal assumption of reality just by existing, then why the heck are we bothering with "wizards"?

We can use the D&D rules to model some sort of bizzare fantasy milieu where vast rock islands float through the sky and the great yellow sun is living being that is pulled by beetles in a chariot, but the black sun is the bringer of darkness - a vile thief that steals children in the night - cats go to the moon each evening to collect dreams for the mortals and time flows at random depending on your point of view - but that's ultimately unfamiliar and confusing. Fantasy works very well when it takes an otherwise realistic world and adds a few magic ideas to it, or maybe even takes away some Laws of Physics. In D&D, our paths are laid out by the spells and magic items and cosmology we're given, and the homebrew we come up with.

The OP's point is that when the non-magical physics of D&D fails to reflect that which the D&D players are used to, this causes a problem. There is thus a need to try out homebrew / houserule fixes to these mechanical issues - even if we have flying islands in our game.

[DanielLC]

Justyn: I was aware of the risk, but I figured it wouldn't happen because I'm only introducing realism to the part of the game that's trying to be realistic.

SleepingOrange: That still doesn't explain why it's harder to cast spells on a galloping horse than a trotting one.
Quicksand is very dense and virtually anyone can float on virtually any sand. Almost anyone can float on water, which is obviously less dense. The people who drown because of quicksand drown in the rising tides.
I gave your explanation for the lower gravity. It should be less likely to be replaced as it explains a more obviously unrealistic mechanic, and I was close to not putting it on here. I did so, however, because it's more likely a mistake than intentional.

JackMage666: Unlike a bike, horses are intelligent, and will steer themselves to some extent. If you own the horse, it probably does care for you.

NakedCelt: That density of rock one does explain why you sink in quicksand.

This doesn't quite belong here, but if you use a vorpal weapon on a monster whose head you couldn't normally cut off, such as a colossus, can it still decapitate them? My instinct was no, but it could be magically decapitating them on an otherwise normal strike. Also, if you use a vorpal weapon on a monstrous spider, does it have no effect, or does cut their cephalothorax in two?

[knightsaline]

You don't get how sharp a vorpal blade is. If, you dropped a vorpal blade point down into the ground, it would slice through the ground and emerge from the other side of the world itself, only to be slingshot back into the ground until it is in the centre of the world itself.

Vampires.hoo boy. Do NOT get me started on vampires. If you follow folk lore, you could beat a vampire just by throwing a bag of rice at it. Or put carrots into its ears, or ruin thier clothes, or get another vampire to drink its congealed blood. One house rule I would love to implment in regards to undead is that instead of having crit immunity, they have crit resistance, therefore taking less damage from a crit. This can be explained away by saying that the onyx gem needed to create the undead is effectively the plug to the negative energy plane. destroying that destroys it permanantly.

In answer to Mewthario saying that vamps dont get staked in the middle of a battle, what exactly do you call a crossbow bolt? or an arrow? now if only I could make arrows that explode when they hit something......

Ravens are weak IRL. the shinys they take are usually shiny things that either weigh nothing or are useless (Like a shiny pebble with no value). Ravens also have nowhere on their bodies to store treasure. Unless the body turns into shinys upon death, you won't find any sp or cp there.

Gravity. The "Default" world is only as large or as small as the DM wants it to be. If the Dm does not want Lantan in his FR game, Lantan does not exist. If the DM wants an inaccessable island with a way of jumping from one world to another to explain why there is only one Mr T in each world, he can do that as well. Why the wizard who lives on the coast did not add gravity spells is beyond me. Possibly because the Arcane caster could just cast Gravity3 on a gang of monsters, therefore shutting them down could be one reason.

Artefacts: Why do all artefacts come from the PAST? If television has taught us one thing about powerful things, its that they come from the FUTURE!

Elven Trancing: 100 year old beings that have never slept? Female hound, please!

[Andraste]

There are no planets in DnD. The DMG shows you what the standard D&D world looks like on page 153. The material plane may be spherical or merely semi-spherical, but it's quite clearly the center of the universe and therefore not a planet, since it has no orbit.

That is just a representation of how the planes can connect, but each are separate infinities or near infinities, so the material plane can include planets if the DM so chooses.