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AdmiralCheez
2019-08-09, 08:34 AM
Let's say that you've read pre-written campaign books in the hopes of running it one day, and then someone else in the group starts running it. You know the story. You know the solutions to the puzzles, the answers, the twists and turns. What do you do about it? Do you tell the GM and try to get them to change it around, or do you just sit there and pretend to be surprised? Or do you prepare something awesome knowing what's about to happen?

And as a GM, if you find out that one of the players has already read the book for the campaign you're running, do you do anything about it?

legomaster00156
2019-08-09, 08:51 AM
As a player, I tell the GM that I know the story and hope that he twists it up, changing or adding things as needed. I pretty much expect that out of any GM of a pre-written campaign, but it bears worth mentioning.

LordEntrails
2019-08-09, 08:56 AM
Tell the GM, hope they change it up as needed. Don't metagame and prepare. And in general sit back and suck it up, your the one that read the "spoiler".

solidork
2019-08-09, 09:38 AM
Absolutely be upfront with your DM about this, and do your best not to let your knowledge affect what you do.

Zhorn
2019-08-09, 11:17 AM
Yep, first tell the DM that you've read the module (or ran it previously) so they have the opportunity to get ahead of any unintended meta-gaming.

Secondly, don't tell the other players you are in the know. Don't give them the temptation to look to you for all the answers, and don't steal away the feeling of victory for picking the right choices in some of the challenges.

Third, roll with it. Be something other than your usual type of character, or go for the things you didn't have any prior experience with. Different DM's will make different rulings, different players have different plans. Stack enough differences together can make even the most direct A to B module a unique experience.

Kraynic
2019-08-09, 11:28 AM
I would tell the DM. Then, I would try to be very careful to play to the character's knowledge instead of my own. Then it won't matter as much if the current DM changes the published material or not. After all, the way the campaign runs is likely to change as the players muck it up anyway.

Lacco
2019-08-09, 01:19 PM
Tell the GM. Find a way how to improve the game using IC knowledge.

Completely unrelated question: ever wanted to play an augur? :smallwink:

GreatWyrmGold
2019-08-09, 02:01 PM
Tell the GM, then either try not to metagame or pick character concepts and themes and whatnot that you know will pair well with the campaign. Don't try to break the campaign, try to compliment it.

GrayDeath
2019-08-09, 06:49 PM
That happened to me about 5 years ago.

An old friend came back and decided to run a campaign that I had partially played and, as it ended early and I was hellishly curious, read the rest. And was disappointed.

We decided to make the best of it. I told him the pitfalls I ahd found as a player, and what about the ending I ahted.
We made a character who was a history buff (important for the earlier plot of the campaign) and had visions from time to time, and rolled with it.

As the DM changed enough to make the campaign only feel vaguely as if I knew it, except for the first 2-3 sessions, and managed to create a good end, it went very well.

Still, let me reiterate what others have said:

Be up front.

Build for the campaign.

help the other players where youc an

and

DONT HOG THE SPOTLIGHT.

Elysiume
2019-08-10, 08:52 AM
I'll n'th the points about sitting back. You're somewhat forced to plan for the worst case scenario: the DM does everything perfectly by the book. That's a fine way to run a campaign--maybe they don't have the time or energy to change things, maybe they're new, maybe they like how it's done--but in terms of trying to avoid ruining the campaign for yourself and others, it's the worst case. If that happens, you want to not be the one solving the puzzles, not be the one untangling the mystery of whodunnit, etc. There are semi-puzzles that'll arise naturally as part of emergent gameplay, especially combat, where you'll have more leeway to think about things without having the looming awareness that you already knew what was coming.

Overall: tell the DM you've read the module, let them know you plan to take a backseat for anything that involves the story. They may still take umbrage to that, but that's another layer to an already-difficult situation.

PersonMan
2019-08-10, 09:35 AM
Let's say that you've read pre-written campaign books in the hopes of running it one day, and then someone else in the group starts running it. You know the story. You know the solutions to the puzzles, the answers, the twists and turns. What do you do about it? Do you tell the GM and try to get them to change it around, or do you just sit there and pretend to be surprised? Or do you prepare something awesome knowing what's about to happen?

And as a GM, if you find out that one of the players has already read the book for the campaign you're running, do you do anything about it?

Honestly, I think this is a lot less of an issue than it's sometimes presented as being. Unless you just finished reading the entire thing, and are at the tail end of extensive studying and note-readying to run it, you're not going to remember all the details. Broad strokes, sure. But I know that, when it's come up for me, by the time I'm reading the final conclusion of a pre-written campaign, I've forgotten the solution to the puzzle in room B-4 in the second dungeon of the first part of the campaign.

So in most cases, I'd say it isn't something that requires you to turn into a super-passive player out of fear of stealing the spotlight. Just inform the others and don't abuse your knowledge (feel free to use it in a constructive way, though - if you do have an amazing puzzle memory, for instance, and the party is stuck on a puzzle that's very quickly going from 'oh, neat' to 'meh, when can I start rolling checks to solve this IC?', I'd say it's good if you bring things to a quick, elegant end rather than waiting around for everyone to get bored because you don't want to solve it).

Zhorn
2019-08-10, 09:50 AM
Building on what Elysiume is saying; it's not ALL bad for the DM.
Knowing there's someone in the party that is in-the-know potentially gives them an undercover-ally for the story, as long as you're both in agreement that you primarily are in the back seat of the party for the story-problems so the other players get a good crack at solving things themselves and being in the spotlight, AND the other players are to not know you have insider information.
Party taking too long to solve a puzzle, missing a key detail, or not paying attention to a vital plot hook? The insider can get a subtle queue from the DM to nudge that into the party's field of view, or do an action that lets the DM more explicitly point it out.
Examples:

Important NPC in town the party needs to talk with to advance the plot?
Insider: "I want to get to town stock up on supplies"
DM: "Inside the shop is another customer, looking very concerned. They inform your group of some terrible rumours circulating about town"

Secret clue hidden in that one spot the party keeps walking past?
Insider: "While they inspect the old cart, I'm going to refill the waterskins in the nearby water barrels."
DM: "As you fill the skins with cool water, a dark wrapped mass catches your attention as it sticks out from between the barrels. It looks like a hidden get-away package hidden in-case of emergency escapes"

ngilop
2019-08-10, 10:04 AM
Honestly, I think this is a lot less of an issue than it's sometimes presented as being. Unless you just finished reading the entire thing, and are at the tail end of extensive studying and note-readying to run it, you're not going to remember all the details. Broad strokes, sure. But I know that, when it's come up for me, by the time I'm reading the final conclusion of a pre-written campaign, I've forgotten the solution to the puzzle in room B-4 in the second dungeon of the first part of the campaign.

So in most cases, I'd say it isn't something that requires you to turn into a super-passive player out of fear of stealing the spotlight. Just inform the others and don't abuse your knowledge (feel free to use it in a constructive way, though - if you do have an amazing puzzle memory, for instance, and the party is stuck on a puzzle that's very quickly going from 'oh, neat' to 'meh, when can I start rolling checks to solve this IC?', I'd say it's good if you bring things to a quick, elegant end rather than waiting around for everyone to get bored because you don't want to solve it).

Yeah.. pretty much this. Unless you have extensive notes you are not going to remember every 'story breaking' detail. Most of what you are going to do in regards to that OOC knowledge is the same or close to actions you would already be doing.

But that is also in addition to you (the person) not having the actual module/adventure/campaign on physical form at hand and are deliberately using out of game knowledge to make it worse for everybody.


I have ran the same campaign back to back but as different characters and it felt like a new game each time. First a rogue/warblade then I went with a Divination Wizard.

Quertus
2019-08-10, 10:31 AM
Tell the GM. Berate the GM for not asking in the first place.

Personally, having had more GMs ruin modules by changing them than I have seen make improvements, I'll argue for not having the GM change anything, so as not to ruin the experience for anyone else, and to not ruin the shared experience of the module. Play it as is. If that isn't of interest to you, bail.

Jay R
2019-08-10, 11:21 AM
Me personally? I tell the DM that I cannot play because I know the module.

Oh, certainly, I could play the trivial parts -- making tactical decisions in combat after everybody has seen exactly what the enemies are. [Even there, if I know one of them is immune to certain attacks, or if I know that there is a second white dragon we haven't seen yet, I'm not really making tactical decisions as a real player, one who didn't have meta-knowledge, would do it.]

But I can't play the real game -- solving puzzles, interpreting clues, exploring the unknown, trying to make the decisions that my character would make based on the information he has.

I could "really" play in any situation I don't remember -- but by definition, these are not the memorable parts. I will remember the BBEG, the impressive traps, the shocking twists. That second white dragon I mentioned above? It's a real example from a module I read last century. The only things I remember are that shocking revelation, the location of the rhemoraz, and where the Ring of Wishes is. I remember the long series of rooms that had no impressive details -- just ordinary encounters. But the fact that those encounters aren't big deals is enough to spoil them. And knowing about the second dragon and the rhemoraz hiding the Ring spoils the best part of those encounters

I know that there are people who believe that they can make choices ignoring their meta-knowledge. And maybe they can.

But even if they make the decision that they know is wrong because they know where the trap door is, or use up all their fire spells before the second white dragon appears, it's not playing the game. Playing the game is trying to learn what you don't know and make the best possible decisions.

Consider a poker game in which I can see the other players' cards. Sure, I could choose to bet on my straight when I know it will lose to your full house, or I could fold when I know you're bluffing. But that isn't me playing poker. It's me trying to simulate what a real poker player in a real game would do.

Similarly, if I know what's coming, then whether I prevent it or choose not to prevent it, I'm not playing D&D; I'm trying to simulate what a D&D player in a real game would do.

I like playing the role of a ranger, or a wizard -- because I can't really be one. I don't want to play the role of a D&D player; I'd rather be one.

Other players don't have to like the things I like. But take away the suspense of the unknown, the essence of exploring to find out, and the attempt to make the best possible decision each time, and you've taken away the aspects that most appeal to me.

Yllin
2019-08-11, 07:44 PM
First, decide if you want to participate. As Jay R pointed, you can't really play the game if you know it. What you can do though, is chill with your friends while discussing imaginary dragons and demons. That won't be "playing DnD", but another activity which you might or might not enjoy. It's ok as long as you don't spoil the fun for other players - that would be your most important task from ethical perspective.

If you decide to participate, don't tell your DM anything. I know, this sounds controversial, so let me explain. If you tell the DM, 3 things could happen: 1) they ban you from the game; 2) they allow you to play, but change the game; 3) they allow you to play and don't change anything. In case of (3) nothing changes compared to the situation where you told nothing: everybody behaves the same and enjoys the game just as much. In case of (2) the DM changed the game - and if we assume that the DM was going to provide the best game they can, that would mean that the actual game won't be as good for the rest of the group. In case of (1) you don't get to play the game that you wanted, which is bad.

So, if you trust yourself not to ruin the fun for your friends, it's better to hide the fact from the DM. If you don't, just follow Jay R's advice.

CTurbo
2019-08-13, 02:09 AM
This happened to me once and I told the DM, but not the players. Rather than sitting out the campaign or having the DM switch to something else, we decided that I would play a big dumb Barbarian that had really strong strengths and really weak weaknesses. Obviously such a character was never involved in any real decision making and I played the character as true as I possible at all times even sometimes knowingly getting the group in trouble because it was in character.

Also, the DM was able to use my character as a tool to the story since I was in the know and it worked out great. It still ended being a lot of fun and obviously much better than not playing at all.

RNightstalker
2019-08-13, 05:14 PM
I agree with the rest of the Forum on this one, communication is key.

Talk to the GM OOC and figure out how y'all want to proceed, if at all. DM may decide to change parts to keep you honest, may decide to do another one altogether, or allow you to use player knowledge to keep the game moving if it hits a lull or the rest of the party gets stuck.

I'll also echo though to take more of a back seat to other PC's, and be honest with them if they ask you. "Hey, you're the party leader, what are you doing passing the buck?"