Weaponizing drowning

[daremetoidareyo]

I was mucking about with the changeling's racial emulation feat and I stumbled across breathing link. (Stormwrack, p. 92)



You can allow a person adjacent to you to breathe water.

Prerequisite
Aquatic elf or water genasi, base Will save +2,

Benefit
As a free action on your turn, you can select one creature within 5 feet of you and give that creature the ability to breathe water as easily as you do. This supernatural ability renews automatically for that creature until you direct the ability to another creature or withdraw your power from it (a free action). The creature's ability to breathe water ends immediately if you are separated by more than 5 feet or if you die, at which point the creature begins to drown if it is still underwater. This ability does not hamper the creature's ability to breathe air, nor does it change the creature's ability (or inability) to swim.

Special
You can select this feat more than once. Each time you take this feat, you can affect an additional creature with this ability. All such creatures need to remain within 5 feet of you (not each other). If one creature exceeds the range of this power, its subsequent distress has no effect on the other creatures you are helping.

This lead me to notice some peculiar wording:

As a free action on your turn, you can select one creature within 5 feet of you and give that creature the ability to breathe water as easily as you do.

If you're a changeling, and you're emulating an aquatic elf, and you don't have an airbreathing subtype or ability, can you make a fish drown? You give that creature the ability to breathe water as easily as you do, but, you can't breathe water.


More importantly: Can you make a construct drown? Can you make an intelligent magic item drown?

If the creature does not breathe, and you give it the ability to do so, can it opt not to?

Besides the thought provoking question above, this is where yall come in: But how do we get these non-aquatic enemies doused in water so that we can drown them unexpectedly?

[SangoProduction]

I was mucking about with the changeling's racial emulation feat and I stumbled across breathing link. (Stormwrack, p. 92)



You can allow a person adjacent to you to breathe water.

Prerequisite
Aquatic elf or water genasi, base Will save +2,

Benefit
As a free action on your turn, you can select one creature within 5 feet of you and give that creature the ability to breathe water as easily as you do. This supernatural ability renews automatically for that creature until you direct the ability to another creature or withdraw your power from it (a free action). The creature's ability to breathe water ends immediately if you are separated by more than 5 feet or if you die, at which point the creature begins to drown if it is still underwater. This ability does not hamper the creature's ability to breathe air, nor does it change the creature's ability (or inability) to swim.

Special
You can select this feat more than once. Each time you take this feat, you can affect an additional creature with this ability. All such creatures need to remain within 5 feet of you (not each other). If one creature exceeds the range of this power, its subsequent distress has no effect on the other creatures you are helping.

This lead me to notice some peculiar wording:

As a free action on your turn, you can select one creature within 5 feet of you and give that creature the ability to breathe water as easily as you do.

If you're a changeling, and you're emulating an aquatic elf, and you don't have an airbreathing subtype or ability, can you make a fish drown? You give that creature the ability to breathe water as easily as you do, but, you can't breathe water.


More importantly: Can you make a construct drown? Can you make an intelligent magic item drown?

If the creature does not breathe, and you give it the ability to do so, can it opt not to?

Besides the thought provoking question above, this is where yall come in: But how do we get these non-aquatic enemies doused in water so that we can drown them unexpectedly?

I'm going out on a limb and say...no. And explain why. I won't even question the validity of a changeling taking it. (Hell, you could just polymorph as aqua elf.)

1: If a creature doesn't breathe, that means it has no need to breathe. The fact that it *can* breathe water as easily as you doesn't change its need.
2: You could probably drown fish...in a couple minutes. Of course, 5 foot "step" away and immediately it can breathe again, and now you have to start all over.

[daremetoidareyo]

I'm going out on a limb and say...no. And explain why. I won't even question the validity of a changeling taking it. (Hell, you could just polymorph as aqua elf.)

1: If a creature doesn't breathe, that means it has no need to breathe. The fact that it *can* breathe water as easily as you doesn't change its need.
2: You could probably drown fish...in a couple minutes. Of course, 5 foot "step" away and immediately it can breathe again, and now you have to start all over.

Aww c'mon. Explore the glitch a little.

[Psyren]

Agree with Sango; "ability to breathe water" != "necessity to breathe water."

Aboleth mucus has wording that's closer to what you're after, and even then it wouldn't impart the need to breathe on something that doesn't at all.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

I'd allow a character to use it on creatures that normally breath water. Heck, I'd probably even rule that without some reason to anticipate this, they'd count as surprised and not have the opportunity to hold their breath before starting to drown.

No way no how would I let a player drown a construct using this feat.

[EliDupree]

Well, there's 2 things going on here. There's the reasonable answer, and the RAW answer. Since you're mainly interested in the RAW answer, let's go with that:

Personally, I'd interpret the RAW like this: When you activate Breathing Link, it grants the other creature the ability to, if it so chooses, breathe water as easily as you do. It also retains its own natural ability, if any, to breathe water. Not very impressive.

HOWEVER! The place where it gets interesting is the termination condition. "The creature's ability to breathe water ends immediately… at which point the creature begins to drown if it is still underwater" doesn't technically limit itself to removing the ability you granted. It point-blank removes the creature's ability to breathe water, and better yet, unconditionally causes it to begin drowning (regardless of whether it normally needs to breathe, and probably bypassing creatures' normal ability to hold their breath). So it's even better than you're thinking!

(Note that you have to manually move more than 5 feet from the creature, since the important clause doesn't explicitly apply when you merely use the free action of withdrawing your power from the creature.)

[daremetoidareyo]

Well, there's 2 things going on here. There's the reasonable answer, and the RAW answer. Since you're mainly interested in the RAW answer, let's go with that:

Personally, I'd interpret the RAW like this: When you activate Breathing Link, it grants the other creature the ability to, if it so chooses, breathe water as easily as you do. It also retains its own natural ability, if any, to breathe water. Not very impressive.

HOWEVER! The place where it gets interesting is the termination condition. "The creature's ability to breathe water ends immediately… at which point the creature begins to drown if it is still underwater" doesn't technically limit itself to removing the ability you granted. It point-blank removes the creature's ability to breathe water, and better yet, unconditionally causes it to begin drowning (regardless of whether it normally needs to breathe, and probably bypassing creatures' normal ability to hold their breath). So it's even better than you're thinking!

(Note that you have to manually move more than 5 feet from the creature, since the important clause doesn't explicitly apply when you merely use the free action of withdrawing your power from the creature.)

Go to law school.

[Bohandas]

Agree with Sango; "ability to breathe water" != "necessity to breathe water."


That's the thing about the unusual wording "as easily". "as" is equally, not greater-than-or-equally

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Well, there's 2 things going on here. There's the reasonable answer, and the RAW answer. Since you're mainly interested in the RAW answer, let's go with that:

Personally, I'd interpret the RAW like this: When you activate Breathing Link, it grants the other creature the ability to, if it so chooses, breathe water as easily as you do. It also retains its own natural ability, if any, to breathe water. Not very impressive.

HOWEVER! The place where it gets interesting is the termination condition. "The creature's ability to breathe water ends immediately… at which point the creature begins to drown if it is still underwater" doesn't technically limit itself to removing the ability you granted. It point-blank removes the creature's ability to breathe water, and better yet, unconditionally causes it to begin drowning (regardless of whether it normally needs to breathe, and probably bypassing creatures' normal ability to hold their breath). So it's even better than you're thinking!

(Note that you have to manually move more than 5 feet from the creature, since the important clause doesn't explicitly apply when you merely use the free action of withdrawing your power from the creature.)

You sir a genius.

[Psyren]

Well, there's 2 things going on here. There's the reasonable answer, and the RAW answer. Since you're mainly interested in the RAW answer, let's go with that:

Personally, I'd interpret the RAW like this: When you activate Breathing Link, it grants the other creature the ability to, if it so chooses, breathe water as easily as you do. It also retains its own natural ability, if any, to breathe water. Not very impressive.

HOWEVER! The place where it gets interesting is the termination condition. "The creature's ability to breathe water ends immediately… at which point the creature begins to drown if it is still underwater" doesn't technically limit itself to removing the ability you granted. It point-blank removes the creature's ability to breathe water, and better yet, unconditionally causes it to begin drowning (regardless of whether it normally needs to breathe, and probably bypassing creatures' normal ability to hold their breath). So it's even better than you're thinking!

(Note that you have to manually move more than 5 feet from the creature, since the important clause doesn't explicitly apply when you merely use the free action of withdrawing your power from the creature.)

So you can drown someone... as long as you can hold them underwater.

How magical. :smalltongue:

[daremetoidareyo]

So you can drown someone... as long as you can hold them underwater.

How magical. :smalltongue:

How do we get our nemeses underwater while landlubbin?

[Zaq]

How do we get our nemeses underwater while landlubbin?

Bull rush, Knockback, baleful transposition, scramble true position, telekinesis, defenestrating sphere, grapple checks, Setting Sun throws...

[animewatcha]

Plane of water...

There has to got to be a RAW way to drown the plane of water.

[WhamBamSam]

A Changeling emulating an Aquatic Elf with Racial Emulation gains the aquatic subtype and therefore can breathe water. So you don't have an inability to breathe water to subject people to, even if it was ruled that you could.

[daremetoidareyo]

A Changeling emulating an Aquatic Elf with Racial Emulation gains the aquatic subtype and therefore can breathe water. So you don't have an inability to breathe water to subject people to, even if it was ruled that you could.

It says that you "can" emulate subtypes, not must.