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Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-11, 06:33 PM
Wizards learn to access the infinite magical potential of the world around them and store, through study and preparation, portions of that ambient energy in their own minds to be later unleashed in the form of powerful preconstructed spells.
Warlocks have a permanent link with the ambient power of the Cosmos through their extraplanar heritage. This flow of power strengthens them in mind and soul both, making them supernaturally resilient and enabling them to constantly shape and unleash blasts of power as easily as they can breathe.

Since the meeting of those two different magical disciplines, many individuals have sought to walk down both paths, learning arcane power and shaping eldritch energies. For generations, those individuals had to study first each separate path on its own before mastering them and being able to join them, study them as one. For a long time, noone had the innate talent of combining both paths in one at the very beginning. But from the schools that pursued those paths and the rare merging of the bloodlines of warlock and wizard were born individuals that did just that, manifesting a new talent that was the merging of the two. Like their wizard ancestors, they could learn and cast arcane spells while also inheriting the ability to invoke eldritch energies from warlocks in the bloodline. Unlike their wizard ancestors, they didn't store those energies in advance when resting but rather slowly gathered them from the world around them at all times like warlocks. Also unlike their warlock ancestors, the extra power required to sustain arcane spellcasting did not go into strengthening their physical bodies and additionally taxed them as well, resulting into physically weaker individuals with great supernatural power. Those new wielders of arcane energy were called magisters.

Magister
{table=head]Level|Base Attack<br>Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+0|
+0|
+0|
+2|Eldritch Blast 1d6, Cantrips, least invocation, Scorn the Material

2nd|
+1|
+0|
+0|
+3|1st level spells, least invocation

3rd|
+1|
+1|
+1|
+3|Eldritch Blast 2d6, Arcane Defence

4th|
+2|
+1|
+1|
+4|2nd level spells, least invocation

5th|
+2|
+1|
+1|
+4|Eldritch Blast 3d6, sustain dweomer 1

6th|
+3|
+2|
+2|
+5|3rd level spells, lesser invocation

7th|
+3|
+2|
+2|
+5|Eldritch Blast 4d6, lesser invocation

8th|
+4|
+2|
+2|
+6|4th level spells, Arcane Shield

9th|
+4|
+3|
+3|
+6|Eldritch Blast 5d6, lesser invocation

10th|
+5|
+3|
+3|
+7|5th level spells, sustain dweomer 2

11th|
+5|
+3|
+3|
+7|Eldritch Blast 6d6, greater invocation

12th|
+6/+1|
+4|
+4|
+8|6th level spells, greater invocation

13th|
+6/+1|
+4|
+4|
+8|Eldritch Blast 7d6, Spell Resistance

14th|
+7/+2|
+4|
+4|
+9|7th level spells, greater invocation

15th|
+7/+2|
+5|
+5|
+9|Eldritch Blast 8d6, sustain dweomer 3

16th|
+8/+3|
+5|
+5|
+10|8th level spells, dark invocation

17th|
+8/+3|
+5|
+5|
+10|Eldritch Blast 9d6, sustain dweomer 4

18th|
+9/+4|
+6|
+6|
+11|9th level spells, dark invocation

19th|
+9/+4|
+6|
+6|
+11|Eldritch Blast 10d6, sustain dweomer 5

20th|
+10/+5|
+6|
+6|
+12|Delay Reduction, dark invocation [/table]

HD: d4, 2 skill points/level. Skills from both warlock and wizard list as class skills.

Attack Bonus: Use the indicated attack bonus for everything except Eldritch Blast and ranged touch spells. In these occasions, use the warlock attack bonus instead.

Proficiencies: Magisters are proficient with all simple weapons and light armor.

Eldritch Blast: Magisters can create Eldritch Blasts like warlocks can. However, their Eldritch Blasts are slightly stronger than those of warlocks as indicated in the progression.

Invocations: Just like warlocks, Magisters learn a set number of invocations from the warlock list. At each level an invocation is listed, the magister learns a new invocation of the indicated level.

Spellcasting: Magisters can learn and cast arcane spells. At every odd level, they can access spells of the indicated level and automatically learn a single spell of that level. They must learn further spells from scrolls up to a limit of 1 additional spell per spell level per point of intelligence modifier-those spells are added to their spells known. To cast a spell, they must have an intelligence of 10+the spell's level. Spell save DCs are based on charisma rather than intelligence. Spells known for a magister are those formulae commited to memory that can be easily accessed. A magister keeps a permanent record of all spells she has gathered in a spellbook. Though it is not required to record spells, a magister with a spellbook can alter their repository of spells known by exchanging one spell known for another of equal level from her spellbook. This process requires meditation for a number of days equal to the spell level to be exchanged.
Unlike wizards, magisters neither memorise specific castings of spells nor require spell slots to cast their spells. They can cast all their spells known at will as a standard action by using their own innate energy. However, after a magister casts a spell she becomes mentally fatigued and cannot cast another spell for a number of rounds equal to the level of the spell cast. For example, a magister casting fireball cannot cast another spell for 3 rounds. A magister casting meteor swarm cannot cast another spell for 9 rounds. Magisters can cast cantrips and 1st level spells round after round since the delay is only 1 round. If a spell has a duration other than permanent or instantaneous, a magister has to sustain it subconciously. A magister can only sustain a single active spell at a time. Additional lasting spells either replace the previous spell or fail (magister's choice). Rendering the magister unconcious or otherwise helpless does not end the sustained spells but killing him does.
Spells cast by Magisters do not require non-expensive material components (magisters are considered to have the eschew materials feat). They still require any material component costing more than 1 gp, focuses and XP components. Magister spells still have the standard spell failure penalties from wearing armor, including light armor, even though their eldritch blast and invocations ignore light armor spell failure. Magister spells work normally with metamagic feats-the delay time is simply increased instead of spell slot level-though a magister can't metamagic a spell beyond his maximum available spell level.

Scorn the Material: Magisters focus exclusively on the supernatural. They not only receive little physical training but the energies flowing through them weaken their physical frame. Add only half the constitution modifier (round up) to a magister's hit points, to a minimum reduction of 1 HP per character level if the constitution modifier is 1 or less. This applies to all current and future HD, not only magister levels.

Arcane Defence: Add a magister's charisma modifier as a bonus to all saving throws versus spells and spell-like effects. This bonus is capped by the magister's class level.

Sustain Dweomer: Normally, a magister can only sustain one active spell at a time. Experienced magisters can sustain a number of additional spells at a time as indicated in the sustain dweomer progression.

Arcane Shield: While young magisters become physically weaker from the strain of channeling massive amounts of eldritch power, experienced magisters gain a compensation: those same energies that physically weaken them protect them against magical damage. Arcane Shield adds the magister's charisma modifier to hit points per level. Those extra hit points only absorb hit point damage dealt by supernatural sources. All damage from spells, spell-like effects andsupernatural abilities is first dealt to Arcane Shield. Arcane Shield can be replenished normally by resting or magical healing (healing is converted to supernatural energy and transferred to the shield, resulting in the same HP regain) and abilities such as fast healing and regeneration apply. The heal skill and other methods of mundane healing do not apply.

Spell Resistance: Powerful magisters can outright resist spells cast at them. At 13th level the magister gains a spell resistance score of 12+class level.

Delay Reduction: At that level of mastery, a magister is faster at replenishing her magical energies. All delay times are reduced by 1 round.


EPIC MAGISTER

The epic magister is a master of arcane magics surpassed by none. While a wizard is still more powerful in the short run, the magister's lasting energies and higher versatility can eventually tip the scales in her favor. Wether the magister wields her magical might in the forefront of every cosmic struggle, develops epic spells in her study or pursues the crafting of artifacts, she stands beside other legends as an equal.


Epic Magister
{table=head]Level|Standard|Special

21st|Eldritch Blast 11d6, 10th level spells|

22nd|sustain dweomer 6|

23rd|Eldritch Blast 12d6|

24th|11th level spells|

25th|Eldritch Blast 13d6|bonus feat

26th|sustain dweomer 7|

27th|Eldritch Blast 14d6, 12th level spells|

28th|high arcana|

29th|Eldritch Blast 15d6|

30th|13th level spells|bonus feat

31st|Eldritch Blast 16d6|

32nd|sustain dweomer 8|

33rd|Eldritch Blast 17d6, 14th level spells|

34th|high arcana|

35th|Eldritch Blast 18d6|bonus feat

36th|15th level spells|

37th|Eldritch Blast 10d6|

38th|sustain dweomer 9|

39th|Eldritch Blast 19d6, 16th level spells|

40th|high arcana|bonus feat [/table]

Invocations: The epic magister does not learn new invocations at epic levels-she is required to invest feats-but her eldritch blast continues to increase in power. The caster level is still equal to her class level.

Spells: The epic magister continues to gain access to more powerful spell levels though at a slower rate. However, she does not gain new spells known and her delay time does not decrease unless she invests epic feats. In fact, delay times continue to increase with spell levels normally therefore a magister can only use her more powerful magics only once in a usual encounter.

Sustain Dweomer: The epic magister can hold active more spells at a time as her power increases-though the rate of increase is half of that in nonepic levels.

High Arcana: At 28th level and every 6 levels thereafter, the epic magister gains a high arcana as per the Archmage high arcanas. Magisters do not have spell slots-but a spell modified by one or more high arcanas has its delay time increased by 1. High Arcanas apply to invocations with no added cost provided they are compatible.

Bonus feat: The epic magister gains a bonus feat every 5 levels in epic.

Bonus feat list:
Additional Magic Item Space, Augmented Alchemy, Craft Epic Magic Arms and Armor, Craft Epic Rod, Craft Epic Staff, Craft Epic Wondrous Item, Black Gate*, Delay Reduction, Efficient Item Creation, Eldritch Sculptor*, Energy Resistance, Epic Spellcasting, Epic Spell Penetration, Eldritch Fury*, Eldritch Holocaust*, Extended Lifespan, Fast Healing, Improved Combat Casting, Improved Spell Resistance, Improved Arcane Shield, Lord of All Essences*, Master of the Dark Flame*, Word of Power*, Scribe Epic Scroll, Lord of Darkness*, Superior Initiative.
*epic invocation



The following feats are epic Magister feats. Some of these feats (those in italics) are epic warlock feats from wizards' Epic Insight articles.

Black Gate [Epic Invocation]

Your powers of mobility are so potent that you can travel between dimensions with a thought.
Prerequisites: Knowledge (the planes) 24 ranks, fell flight, flee the scene, path of shadow OR be able to cast Teleport, Planeshift, Greater Teleport, Teleportation Circle, Gate
Benefit:
You may open a gateway between any place within 1000 feet from you and any other place in any plane. The gateway manifests as a vertical circular or semicircular (your choice) portal up to 2 feet per caster level wide. In that surface the two places become joined as if they were conterminous planes and anyone can simply pass from one to the other by walking through the gate. The absence of astral links and any nonepic defences against teleportation or nonepic magic that would seal, block, surpress or dispel it have no effect on a black gate. The Black Gate remains open for as long as you concentrate.

Delay Reduction [Epic]

Your spell recovery time decreases due to your increased innate power.
Perequisites: Delay Reduction class ability
Benefit: All your delay times decrease by 1 round
Special: You may take this feat multiple times up to a maximum of 1 time per 2 epic feats you have.

Eldritch Sculptor [Epic Invocation]

You control and shape your eldritch blasts like a master sculptor.
Prerequisites: One invocation from the least, lesser, greater, and dark blast shape invocation categories, Spellcraft 24 ranks.
Benefit: You can use two eldritch blasts per round as a full attack action, rather than the normal limit of one. You can apply eldritch essences to both blasts. If you possess the Lord of All Essences feat, you can imbue each blast with two eldritch essences. Activating this ability is part of the action to use an eldritch blast.
The area and range of all your eldritch blasts is doubled. Activating this ability is part of the action to use an eldritch blast. If you imbue your eldritch blast with the eldritch spear blast shape, the range increases to 500 feet. If you are using the hideous blow invocation, you no longer suffer attacks of opportunity for invoking this power in melee and all attacks of opportunity you make can include hideous blow. If you imbue your eldritch blast with the eldritch chain blast shape, you may start the chain up to 120 feet away from you and the maximum distance between each target increases to 60 feet. The area of the eldritch doom blast shape increases to 40 feet from you. The range of your eldritch cone increases to 120 feet.
You gain +2 bonus on attack rolls to hit an opponent with your eldritch blast. This is an extraordinary ability.
Normal: A warlock can use only one eldritch blast per round. Using the hideous blow blast shape provokes attacks of opportunity and cannot be used as part of an attack of opportunity.

Improved Arcane Shield [Epic]

Your ability to absorb spells increases.
Prerequisites: Arcane Shield, spellcraft 24 ranks
Benefit: Your arcane shield hit points per level increase by 3

Eldritch Fury [Epic Invocation]

You can blast a single target repeatedly with your Eldritch Blast
Prerequisites: Eldritch Blast 15d6, Eldritch Sculptor
Benefit: As a full-attack action, you may use your unmodified (without shapes or essences) eldritch blast to ranged full-attack a single enemy. You gain as many eldritch blast attacks as you have attacks in a normal full attack but at each attack you strike with two eldritch blasts due to Eldritch Sculptor.

Eldritch Holocaust [Epic Invocation]

You conjure an eldritch inferno, immolating large areas of land
Prerequisites: Eldritch Doom, spellcraft 34 ranks, Eldritch Blast 15d6
Benefit: You replicate a long-range, enlarged, widened firestorm spell. Unlike firestorm, you deal eldritch blast damage and any additional effects. Eldritch Sculptor does not apply to Holocaust but Lord of all Essences does.


Lord of All Essences [Epic Invocation]

You have mastered the art of enhancing your eldritch blast with multiple essences.
Prerequisites: One least, lesser, greater, and dark eldritch essence invocation, Spellcraft 24 ranks.
Benefit: When you use the eldritch blast ability, you can apply two eldritch essence invocations simultaneously. You could choose to fire an eldritch blast with both the repelling blast and noxious blast eldritch essences. This also allows you to apply the same effect twice, though this is not beneficial in the case of all eldritch essences. The effects of each essence are resolved separately. If you imbue your eldritch blast with two different types of damage, half of the damage (rounded down) is dealt by each source. You must choose which essences you will use in conjunction with your eldritch blast before you start your action. If you possess the Eldritch Sculptor feat, you can apply two eldritch essence invocations to both your eldritch blasts in a single round. Activating this ability is part of the action to use an eldritch blast.
For example, if Morthos is fighting an outsider he has never encountered, he can choose to imbue his eldritch blast with both hellrime blast and brimstone blast. He rolls 10d6 damage, dealing half fire and half cold damage. If the outsider happened to be immune to cold, but not fire, it would still take damage from the half that dealt fire damage.
In addition, the DC of all eldritch essence invocations you use increases by 2. This is an extraordinary ability.
Normal: A warlock can apply only one eldritch essence to an eldritch blast.

Master of the Dark Flame [Epic Invocation]

You have achieved mastery of the four elements -- air, earth, fire, and water.
Prerequisites: Spellcraft 24 ranks, breath of the night, chilling tentacles, stony grasp, wall of perilous flame OR ability to cast summon monster I-IX
Benefit: As a full-round action, you can shape an eldritch blast into a darkfire elemental as if you used summon monster IX to summon a fire elemental. However, this elemental is much more powerful. Add half your Eldrich Blast damage dice as additional HD to the elemental. In addition, whenever the elemental would deal fire damage, it deals damage of the same type as your eldritch blast-though the amount of damage remains unchanged. The monster serves you for a number of rounds equal to your caster level. Activating this ability requires a standard action.
You gain energy resistance 10 to acid, cold, electricity, fire and sonic. If you have energy resistance from another permanent source (class, race, template, feat), your resistance to those two elements increases by 10. This is an extraordinary ability.


Word Of Power [Epic Invocation]

Your words are charged with supernatural power.
Prerequisites: Baleful utterance, beguiling influence, warlock's call, word of changing OR able to cast any 3 power word spells
Benefit: As a standard action, you can emulate the effects of power word blind, power word kill, or power word stun by speaking a single word in the language of Creation. The limits of Word of Power are either 10 HP per caster level for a single target or 3 HP per caster level for every individual target if you choose to target up to 1 creature per caster level. Beings normally immune to mind-affecting spells can be affected by Word of Power but they receive a will save at 10+1/2 your magister level + your charisma modifier.
When you use your beguiling influence invocation, the bonus granted on your Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate checks is equal to double your Charisma bonus or +6, whichever is greater. Using this ability is part of the casting of the beguiling influence invocation. It is an extraordinary ability.
Normal: The warlock's call invocationhas a casting time of 10 minutes and does not allow suggestions to be imbued. The warlock's call invocation allows the recipient to deal 10 points of damage to you. The beguiling influence invocation grants you a bonus on Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate checks equal to your Charisma modifier.


Lord of Darkness [Epic Invocation]

You have walked the path of shadows, and now you have mastered its secrets.
Prerequisites: Spellcraft 24 ranks, beshadowed blast, dark discorporation, darkness, enervating shadow OR be able to cast Nolight, Darkness, Deeper Darkness, Shadow Evocation, Greater Shadow Evocation, Shadow Conjuration, Greater Shadow Conjuration, Shades, Utterdark.
Benefit: As a 3-round action, you can spread impenetrable darkness as per the Utterdark spell. Unlike Utterdark, only creatures you allow to can see in the darkness. You can see and hear perfectly anywhere within the darkness regardless of distance, line of sight, line of effect or illusions. While the darkness lasts, as a standard action, you can attempt to end any one evocation or conjuration: summoning effect anywhere within the darkness. An effect of 8th level and lower is automatically ended. An effect of 9th level and higher requires a succesful opposed CL check.
You are immune to all spells with the darkness or shadow subtype and to effects that involve the use of darkness or shadows (such as the breath weapon of a shadow dragon). This is an extraordinary ability.


DESIGNER'S NOTES:

For all those people crying out loud against the batman here is arcane magic without the brokenness of huge spell combos or going nova in high levels or getting only 2 spells per day at low levels. Magisters are stronger than standard casters at low levels while being weaker at the higher levels. They are physically weaker than the warlock in hit points, armor class and normal attack bonus (they're supposed to be casters) and even weaker than wizards due to Scorn the Material but they are considerably stronger in later levels in defences against magic.
Yes, they can cast arcane spells at will. However, the delay time after casting prevents any attempts at going nova and overwhelming opponents in a round or two. A magister will pull off one, two at most, big spells during a fight while relying on her eldritch blast and invocations for attacks in other rounds.

Magisters are DM-friendly. They can't go nova at high levels. They require a more even ability score spread than wizards so no overwhelming spell DCs. They only get 1 spell known automatically per level, allowing the DM to better control available spells (if you don't want celerity or shivering touch, don't put a scroll in the game and they can't learn them). They are difficult to powergame-their spell level access is slower than that of the wizards and their good abilities are at mid levels so taking a dip in another class hurts. Taking a dip in magister for easy access to low level abilities nets a large penalty from Scorn the Material so dipping in the class is not very effective. By having both invocations and spells, they don't have a prestige class very suitable to them, with the sole exception of eldritch disciple. Due to their limit of sustained spells, they can't overbuff like CoDzilla.

On the other hand, they are also player-friendly. They have both invocations (cool) and arcane magic (also cool). They are more versatile than either wizard or warlock because they can do a wide range of spells, invocations, metamagic and item creation (cool) and they don't run out of magic (very cool). They are useful combat-wise where warlocks usually are not due to low damage output compared to everyone else (cool) but they don't outshine the other classes in high levels (cool-for the other players in the party).

Arbitrarity
2007-10-11, 06:47 PM
Actually, those are incredibly balanced at first glance. I haven't carefully, carefully reviewed it, just read over the text once, but it seems remarkably unbreakable.

It has spontaneous spellcasting, with wizard strategic flexibility, as well as "unlimited" spells per day. However, it can't buff into oblivion, as it has limits on maximum spells running at the same time. Furthermore, it can't APPLY the spells where it needs them, as it's only getting off a few spells per encounter, unless it's very prolonged. Given the state of D&D combat, that's not happening. When it's not using the mighty wizard spells, it is supplemented with warlock invocations, which, while not incredible, are at least decent.

I think this looks pretty good. Nerfs wizard, buffs warlock nicely.

Rigel Cyrosea
2007-10-11, 07:01 PM
I think this is great too. Really makes for a nice balance. I have one small problem though.

Magister spells work normally with metamagic feats-the delay time is simply increased instead of spell slot level.
The problem with this is that the Magister can just heap every metamagic feat he has onto one spell. Sure, he won't be able to cast again for 2 minutes, but with enough metamagic, he only needs one spell. I would suggest putting in something about them not being able to raise the delay time with metamagic above the delay time for their maximum level of spell. Other than that, the class looks great.

Arbitrarity
2007-10-11, 07:06 PM
The problem with this is that the Magister can just heap every metamagic feat he has onto one spell. Sure, he won't be able to cast again for 2 minutes, but with enough metamagic, he only needs one spell. I would suggest putting in something about them not being able to raise the delay time with metamagic above the delay time for their maximum level of spell. Other than that, the class looks great.

I think I'll second that. Blastificer is broken for a reason, and it isn't generally lots of spells. See, this is what I get for a quick read-through.

Twinned Repeating Chained Maximized Empowered Enervation!
(12 neg levels now, 12 next round, with a bunch of touch attacks. Paiin.)

Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-11, 07:16 PM
It is implied-though maybe I should clarify it. Wizards can't metamagick beyond their max spell level-so why would Magisters?

Though you can't chain or repeat an enervation, you could definitely maximise+splitray it for 8 negative levels in one blow for a 9th level spell.

Lochar
2007-10-11, 07:49 PM
Can I play test this in your undead campaign? :P

Arbitrarity
2007-10-11, 07:51 PM
It is implied-though maybe I should clarify it. Wizards can't metamagick beyond their max spell level-so why would Magisters?

Though you can't chain or repeat an enervation, you could definitely maximise+splitray it for 8 negative levels in one blow for a 9th level spell.

Actually, wizards can. That's the thing. Metamagic rods, Sudden Metamagic? They let you increase beyond maximum casting level, and apply spontaneously.

Doh! I forgot split ray!

There, 24 negative levels/round. This sounds good :smallbiggrin: (Note: No longer a criticism, a combination of a joke and an artificer reference)

Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-11, 07:57 PM
Well, metamagic rods and sudden metamagic would work for Magisters just as well.

As for playtesting it in my undead campaign, this class will actually replace the sorceror and warlock classes so a spontaneous arcane caster will have to be a magister.


EDIT: added the epic levels.

raichi
2007-10-12, 08:52 AM
k well im ussualy not the type to think a class to be overpowered but this class is really overpowered for starters, it's getting both wizard and warlock class skills, second it's getting just as many invocations and at its peak a better elidritch blast at it's max 3rd though it's spells known are extremely limited it still doesn't make up for the fact that cantrips and 1st level spells are completely limitless and the only restriciton on other spells is a couple rounds of waiting but during that time they can still blast them with a full powered elidritch blast or invocation so the best comparison i can give this class is inbetween a sorcerer and a warlock to a warlock they loose maybe 2-5 hitpoints at most a level for standard melee they go down a bit in bab and a few later class abilities and to a sorcerer all they loose is a familiar and some spells know for the 2 biggest features of a warlock at full power so to end it it's a good idea but needs alot of work and playtesting.

Rigel Cyrosea
2007-10-12, 09:30 AM
k well im ussualy not the type to think a class to be overpowered but this class is really overpowered for starters, it's getting both wizard and warlock class skills, second it's getting just as many invocations and at its peak a better elidritch blast at it's max 3rd though it's spells known are extremely limited it still doesn't make up for the fact that cantrips and 1st level spells are completely limitless and the only restriciton on other spells is a couple rounds of waiting but during that time they can still blast them with a full powered elidritch blast or invocation so the best comparison i can give this class is inbetween a sorcerer and a warlock to a warlock they loose maybe 2-5 hitpoints at most a level for standard melee they go down a bit in bab and a few later class abilities and to a sorcerer all they loose is a familiar and some spells know for the 2 biggest features of a warlock at full power so to end it it's a good idea but needs alot of work and playtesting.
:smallyuk:
If you're going to critisize something, at least use understandable grammar.

Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-12, 10:02 AM
k well im ussualy not the type to think a class to be overpowered but this class is really overpowered for starters, it's getting both wizard and warlock class skills, second it's getting just as many invocations and at its peak a better elidritch blast at it's max 3rd though it's spells known are extremely limited it still doesn't make up for the fact that cantrips and 1st level spells are completely limitless and the only restriciton on other spells is a couple rounds of waiting but during that time they can still blast them with a full powered elidritch blast or invocation so the best comparison i can give this class is inbetween a sorcerer and a warlock to a warlock they loose maybe 2-5 hitpoints at most a level for standard melee they go down a bit in bab and a few later class abilities and to a sorcerer all they loose is a familiar and some spells know for the 2 biggest features of a warlock at full power so to end it it's a good idea but needs alot of work and playtesting.

It is getting both wizard and warlock class skills-but still only 2 skill points per level plus intelligence. And intelligence is a secondary stat. So, it could have 4 skills maxed but not more than that. Spellcraft, K: Arcana, Concentration, Bluff. That's the basic skills for all casters anyway.

Now, to actually comparing classes, we all know Warlock is underpowered. 9d6 is an average of 31 damage per round. Compare that to a warrior that does 100+ per round of full attack or a sorceror that can easily do 150 or kill outright and you see how weak warlocks are. The only class that does less damage than the warlock is a rogue that's fighting elementals.

Now, to compare the "unlimited" spells and eldritch blasts with the spells of a sorceror. Assuming 4 fights per day and each fight lasting 5 rounds, the total fighting each day lasts 20 rounds.

A 20th level sorceror with charisma 28 (counting items one could go to 34, 38 if cheesy) can cast seven 9th level spells, seven 8th level spells and six 7th level spells.

A 20th level magister may cast a 9th level spell every fight. He can also cast invocations at will-but no invocation is stronger than a 5th level spell anyway. That's four 9th level spells and sixteen 5th level spells.

So, for 4 fights a day, a sorceror can unleash a total of 161 spell levels and a magister a total of 116 spell levels. A sorceror can thus unleash a substantially larger amount of spell levels over the fights of 1 day than the magister.

Now if we take it to 10 fights instead of 4 fights, a sorceror can unleash seven 9th level, seven 8th level, seven 7th level, seven 6th level, eight 5th level, eight 4th level and six 3rd level spells. That's 300 spell levels

A magister can unleash ten 9th level spells plus forty invocations (5th level equivalents). That's 290 spell levels-still somewhat weaker than the sorceror.

Now, from the above we have the following:


Over the course of 10 fights of 5 rounds each, a 20th level sorceror using spell slots and a 20th level magister using unlimited magic can unleash roughly the same amount of magic with the sorceror having a slight edge.

So, where, exactly, is the magister overpowered?

raichi
2007-10-12, 09:15 PM
wellllllllll okay i guess but i don't think warlock is too underpowered anyway to the point where they would get regular spells but i'll take your word for it.

warbacon
2007-10-13, 05:18 PM
Wow. Just, wow. This is exactly the sort of thing I have always wanted. It's like Christmas! Fiendish arcane Christmas, I tell you!

I really think it fixes Warlock nicely! In support of this, I would like to remind the nay-sayers out there that for a Magister to learn and cast Wizard spells, they must have an Int score of 10 + the spell's level, but their spell and invocation saves are based off Charisma. Further that with a need for a decent Dex because of Eldritch Blast goodness and the loss of the incredible Deceive Item ability, you have some serious multiple attribute dependency. However, it's quite appropriate. Yes, you can eldritch blast and fireball all day long, but in order to get a reasonable spread of wizard spells (and the important high-level ones) you have to pump Intelligence over Charisma and Dexterity, lowering save DCs. Quantity over quality. I think it's a reasonably well-balanced class. It epitomizes the glass cannon approach, but it epitomizes with style.

Now, if only you had posted this a week ago so I could have built one instead of my new Warlock... *grumble*

Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-13, 06:28 PM
Invocations-wise, Magister is identical to the warlock. It should be easy to adapt if your DM would allow it.

That said, you're right in the MAD requirement. It is a balancing feature of the class.

warbacon
2007-10-13, 06:43 PM
Invocations-wise, Magister is identical to the warlock. It should be easy to adapt if your DM would allow it.

Correct. You could even multi-class into it without modifying your current character. Although it's doubtful that you built your Warlock the same way you would have built your Magister.

Perhaps a note stating that for multi-class Warlock / Magisters, your class levels stack for determining eldritch blast damage and invocations known?

Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-13, 07:17 PM
As a Magister intends to replace warlock rather than complement it, there should be no multiclassing between them.

warbacon
2007-10-13, 08:40 PM
One more question: currently Scorn the Material has no effect if you have no Con bonus or no Con score ... Do you think it could be changed to a permanent and retroactive decrease of (Con bonus /2) hit points per level, minimum 1?

Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll
2007-10-13, 08:48 PM
Wow. This is really good. Supreme Yoinkage. At first i thought that it should be a prestige class, but this is much better!

warbacon
2007-10-16, 09:30 PM
OK, some things that I'm pondering as time goes by:

1. I think the light armor proficiency doesn't mesh well with the "harvesting the power of their blood instead of training their body" fluff.

2. Does a Magister get to trade out invocations known like a Warlock does, once whenever she gains a new rank of invocations? In this case, 6th, 11th, 16th.

3. The spell resistance at 13th is a powerful ability. although I admit that it fits the fluff. I mention this because unlike a warlock, the magister does not get deceive item, or bonus metamagic feats like a wizard. Personally I think a bonus feat or two would help give the class some more variance in high-level builds. Warlock is already feat-intensive, and trying to cram in metamagic into the limited feat choices is quite difficult.

Belial_the_Leveler
2007-10-26, 05:31 PM
On the armor proficiency: a magister wearing armor still faces spell failure for their arcane spells. It is a risk.

Yes, the magister gains invocations like the warlock-so that would include shifting old ones around.

The SR ability is there instead of extra feats or energy resistance. Magisters are neither warlocks with their demands for item creation and combat-related feats nor wizards with their demands for school focus related or item creation feats. They are more like the sorceror in function. They shouldn't differ based on their feats but on what spells and invocations known they have.

PS:
Replaced the epic warlock feats with homebrew Epic Invocations for the magister.