Mage armor/ Shield for duskblade?

[Voidstar01]

So I want to do a duskblade 5/Abj. Champion 5/ Duskblade 10 build. However from what I can see Duskblade doesn't have any spells that grant an armor or shield bonus, so they can't benefit from abjurant armor, precocious apprentice misses both mage armor and it's greater version, so what can I do to get these types of spells? are there cleric domains that grant it? any help is appreciated.

[bean illus]

Dip a level?
Yes, there are cleric domains, but i wouldn't.

Mage armor isn't an abjuration?

I assume you want your bab and duskblade caster level as high as possible. I don't know any way to get those spells on your duskblade list, but a dip in sorcerer/wiz 1 would get you both spells. If you found some spells to spam at caster level 19 it might be cool.

But you can't cast them in armor?

Beguiler 1 adds only mage armor, but also adds silent image, detect secret doors, whelm, and undetectable alignment (abj)

[Psychoalpha]

Mage Armor is a Conjuration spell, anyway, not Abjuration. So even if you got access to it, it wouldn't work.

You could take Arcane Preparation and be Exalted Good in order to cast Luminous Armor (and its Greater version) as Sanctified spells. They are, as long as stealth isn't an issue, strictly speaking better than Mage Armor.

You can get Shield by way of Ring of Theurgy, I think, but only once until someone has to refill your ring for you... so that's not great.

The lack of good abjuration spell protection in the ABJURANT CHAMPION prc was always kind of a facepalm, especially since the mention of Mage Armor in specific was a whups.

[Mr Adventurer]

Extra Spell feat might work, ask your DM.

Likewise, you could engage in spell research (talk to your DM). Also you could research a spell that's the same as Mage Armour but is of the Abjuration school.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Abjurant Champion doesn't benefit Mage Armor as it's not an abjuration. Luminous Armor and the greater version in BoED benefit from it though, anyone good-aligned who prepares spells can cast sanctified spells. Spend a feat on Arcane Preparation and you can cast those, and get a Rod of Bodily Restoration to fix the Str damage that occurs when the spell ends.

Another option is to take Magical Training in PGtF for a few 0-level spell slots and a spellbook in which you've scribed a few 0-level spells to prepare in those. Per the Rules Compendium, since you cast spells from a spellbook, you can learn new spells and add them to your spellbook via a method identical to the one Wizards use. Thus you can learn spells like Shield and (Greater) Mage Armor, among others, and count them as spells your character has knowledge of. Take Versatile Spellcaster in Races of the Dragon, that allows you to spend two spontaneous spell slots of the same level to cast any spell you know of one level higher, which would include spells you've learned and added to your spellbook.

Yet another option is to get a custom Runestaff (MIC p224), preferably via Ancestral Relic in BoED so you can freely determine which spells it contains. Max out Use Magic Device and you can emulate a class spell list when attuning to it each day to be able to cast the spells it contains using your Duskblade spell slots.

[Elves]

Or just houserule mage armor to be an abjuration like it should be.

[AnimeTheCat]

Or just houserule mage armor to be an abjuration like it should be.

BuT MuH CoNjuRaTioN MaSteR SchOoL!

Edit: sorry... forgot the /s in case anyone has thin skin.

[Kurald Galain]

Duskblade doesn't need mage armor since he wears actual armor :smallamused:

Shield is a good idea though, duskblade has a notorious lack of defensive spels on his list. I'd houserule shield to be a DB spell, really.

[Thurbane]

This is generally accepted as a good home-brewed expansion of the Duskblade's spell list.


The problem with the Duskblade spell list, as I see it, is the PHBII authors were constrained to include only spells from that book and the PH. There are plenty of thematically appropriate spells on other lists in other books. So, a while back Fax Celestis and I wrote up an expanded list of other spells that were consistent with the duskblade list. That initial discussion is here. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2416523#post2416523)

The list is here:
Seems like Fax and I put together a list a while back of spells that were in line with the types of spells Duskblades get, but were from other sources. These are the kind of spells already on the duskblade list - the spells we think WotC would have put on the list if they could have. (They generally write each supplement as if only it and core exists so that it doesn't require other books to use.)

So it isn't about what's super-powerful so much as extending the list to other reasonably similar choices.

Here it is (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34943)

Fax's list from the Spell Compendium:
From the Spell Compendium, adjusted to what I think would be fair Duskblade level:
L0
Caltrops
Electric Jolt
Know Greatest Enemy
Launch Item
Stick

L1
Corrosive Grasp
Critical Strike
Deafening Clang
Fist of Stone
Ie Dagger
Lightfoot
Nerveskitter
Nightshield
Persistent Blade
Phantom Threat
Rhino's Rush
Snowshoes

L2
Battering Ram
Bladeweave
Body of the Sun
Bristle
Combust
Daggerspell Stance
Delusions of Grandeur
Fireburst
Flame Dagger
Infernal Wound
Ironthunder Horn
Mountain Stance
Rainbow Beam
Scorch
Shadow Spray
Weapon Shift
Wracking Touch

L3
Belker Claws
Body Blades
Clarity of Mind
Diamondsteel
Find the Gap
Knight's Move
Know Opponent
Moon Blade
Ring of Blades
Spectral Weapon
Spider Poison
Steeldance
Sppress Breath Weapon
Unluck
Whirling Blade

L4
Bands of Steel
Blindsight
Displacer Form
Flame Whips
Forcewave
Frost Breath
Lion's Charge
Mind Poison
Vulnerability

L5
Acid Sheath
Aura of Evasion
Charge of the Triceratops
Emerald Flame Fist
Fireburst, Greater
Girallon's Blessing
Ray Deflection
Translocation Trick

From Magic of Incarnum:
L2
Divest Essentia

L4
Rend Essentia
Soulbleed

L5
Valiant Spirit

From Complete Scoundrel:
L1
Armor Lock

L2
Enlarge Weapon

L4
Spell Theft

From the PHB-II:
L2
Cloud of Knives

My list from other sources:
First, I would give them access to every 0-level spell. I know they get some as spell-like abilities from Arcane Attunement, but I think they might as well have access to all of them on the spell list (and not the mere four listed).

(I don't have my SC right now, but here's what I've culled from other sources.)

My premise is that I'm just extending the list to where it should be had the PHBII authors not been constrained to PHB & PHBII. Thus, I assume they included all the PHB & PHBII spells they desired, so while I might want to add more, it's not really in keeping with their intent. (I do think there are more PHB spells that would be fun on their list, perhaps even in keeping with the duskblade flavor, but I'm reluctant to go there.)

BoED
1
Lantern Light
Eyes of the Avoral
2
None
3
Elation
Warcry
4
Radiant Fog
Radiant Shield
5
Vanishing Weapon
Emerald Burst
Touch of Adamantine

BoVD
0
Unnerving Gaze
No Light
Slash Tongue

1
Death Grimace
Abberate
Bestow Wounds
Tongue Tendrils
2
Unheavened
Addiction
Masochism
Sadism
Sap Strength
Darkbolt
Shriveling
3
Devil’s Eye
Evil Eye
Tongue Serpent
Vile Lance
4
Abyssal Might
Hell’s Power
Wrack
5
Resonating Resistance

Libris Mortis
1
Ectoplasmic Armor
Necrotic Awareness
2
Blade of Pain and Fear
Ghost Touch Armor
Necrotic Cyst
Spawn Screen
3
Ectoplasmic Feedback
Necrotic Bloat
4
None
5
Kiss of the Vampire
Necrotic Burst
Night’s Caress
Other:
Spectral Touch (6) as (4)
Avasculate (7) as (5)
Energy Ebb (7) as (5)

Later, when someone asked about the spells from Complete Mage, I added:


Hmm, buffs, rays, movement enhancements, and touch or weapon delivered spells are most consistent with the duskblade list. Off the cuff...

Complete Mage
Assassin Spells
Bloodletting (1)
Catsfeet (1)
Summon Weapon (2)
Rusted Blade (3) (or (4) as per Wiz/Sorc list)
Unseen Strike (4)

Wiz/Sorc Spells
Steam Jet (1)
Escalating Enfeeblement (2)
Heart of Air (2)
Tenacious Dispelling (3)
Heart of Water (3)
Prickling Torment (3)
Heart of Earth (4)
Crypt Warden's Grasp (5)
Touch of Vecna (5)
Heart of Fire (5)
Tactical Teleportation (6) as (5)

Very cautiously, I might suggest the following in an otherwise highly optimized campaign...
Adamantine Wings (7) but as (5)
Unicorn Heart (7) but as (5)

I didn't even consider the WuJen or Hexblade spells nor the divine ones. And this is quite off the cuff based on the short descriptions and my memory.


This was not an attempt to "power-up" the duskblade, just to include material from other sources that was in line with the existing list. More variety represents a slight theoretical increase in power, but not much. Depending on the optimization level of the game, I might also increase the spells known slightly. (I've played one such game with moderately well-optimized allies and it didn't seem unbalancing.)

Just FYI, if you really want Shield on the Duskblade's known spells, in a 100% RAW method, there's Dragonblood Spell-Pact (DoF p.115).

[Khedrac]

And iirc the main AC spells that Abjurrant Champion does boost (both near useless) are lesser deflect and deflect - which the Duskblade does get (though should never take).

[Mr Adventurer]

This is generally accepted as a good home-brewed expansion of the Duskblade's spell list.

What did you add when someone asked about Complete Mage?!

[Thurbane]

What did you add when someone asked about Complete Mage?!

I've added the missing nested quote to my post.

[Anthrowhale]

Arcane Disciple[Spell] might be pretty good. It gives you access to Mage Armor, but also to Anyspell. Anyspell is really good if you can use it, which is in doubt due to requiring a domain slot that you don't have. Nevertheless, it's reasonable to ask a DM.

[DEMON]

My advice: Knight of the Weave (CoV) PrC. Easy to qualify for, provides both Shield and Mage Armor (though you don't really need the latter).

Alternatively just ask the DM to allow you to take Shield as Duskblade spells, it comes at a cost anyways, since he need to use one of his precious few spells known for it (and while you're at it, ask him for Magic Vestment as well...).

[bean illus]

My advice: Knight of the Weave (CoV) PrC. Easy to qualify for, provides both Shield and Mage Armor (though you don't really need the latter).

Alternatively just ask the DM to allow you to take Shield as Duskblade spells, it comes at a cost anyways, since he need to use one of his precious few spells known for it (and while you're at it, ask him for Magic Vestment as well...).

Mage armor will be useful at low levels, shield in abjurant levels, and Divine Favor at Abj Champ 5, when KotW's caster level is set to BaB (+3 luck bonus as a spontaneous spell).

[Kurald Galain]

Mage armor will be useful at low levels,
Why, though? It gives the same AC as a chain shirt, which you're proficient with. Am I overlooking something?

[OGDojo]

So I want to do a duskblade 5/Abj. Champion 5/ Duskblade 10 build. However from what I can see Duskblade doesn't have any spells that grant an armor or shield bonus, so they can't benefit from abjurant armor, precocious apprentice misses both mage armor and it's greater version, so what can I do to get these types of spells? are there cleric domains that grant it? any help is appreciated.

i just recently came across the Beguiler (Kind of a stealthy spellcaster) but one of its abilities grants you the ability to pull spells from the sorcerer wizard spell list. might be worth checking out.

Also if you need more armor why not just buy more armor and buy a shield, and enhance the armor and shield.

[animewatcha]

Duskblade are spontaneous so why not Knowstones?

[Malphegor]

I'd probably just get Bracers of Armor. to eventually get upgraded into Bracers of Mailed Might of the Magelords when it becomes convenient to do so.

[Elkad]

Why, though? It gives the same AC as a chain shirt, which you're proficient with. Am I overlooking something?

Armor check penalty, dex cap, weight, initial cost, enchanting it as you level up instead of just shifting to Greater Mage Armor, etc.
It's not a terrible detriment, but it's there.

[Thurbane]

Mage Armor also protects against incorporeal attacks, which regular armor won't without Ghost Touch or similar...

[bean illus]

Mage armor will be useful at low levels, shield in abjurant levels, and Divine Favor at Abj Champ 5, when KotW's caster level is set to BaB (+3 luck bonus as a spontaneous spell).


Why, though? It gives the same AC as a chain shirt, which you're proficient with. Am I overlooking something?


Armor check penalty, dex cap, weight, initial cost, enchanting it as you level up instead of just shifting to Greater Mage Armor, etc.
It's not a terrible detriment, but it's there.


Mage Armor also protects against incorporeal attacks, which regular armor won't without Ghost Touch or similar...

You can sleep in mage armor ...

[Thac0 Redeye]

We house ruled to add the bard and assassin spell list to the duskblade.