Please help me build my character.

[Khrysaes]

So, my friend and DM will be moving in 3 weeks, so I will be starting up a new game with a different friend as the DM.

However, I can't decide what to play, as there are multiple thoughts I have that I think would be fun.

I mostly want to play a character that can support others, but isn't useless otherwise, so disregarding race, I have been thinking 2 primary combinations.

1: Ancients Paladin/Hexblade/Brute Fighter focusing on defense and melee

2: Life Cleric/Hexblade/Divine Soul Sorcerer focusing on ranged and spell support
Edit: I gain nothing in particular from hexblade, so I may switch the patron.

This will be a homebrew game, so I am not to worried about meeting multiclass requirements or pulling from multiple sources.

For races, I had 3 thoughts.

For build 1: a Warforged, built as an experiment by the patron(or his patron is a spirit of his weapon, thinking shadow of mordor here), trying to come into his own being. I was thinking of avoiding eldritch blast, or at the very least agonizing blast, and taking devil's sight and cloak of flies(but reflavored as shadow or spectral energy)

For build 1: A kobold that rides on the back of the bigger party members and protects them with his aura and mounted combatant feat(this is mostly because i think the mechanics are fun, less story)

For build 2: a Tiefling. I am actually thinking of flavoring it more like the Hellbred of 3.5e. I think it could be interesting to have a good favored soul and a demonic looking being gaining Angellic wings. Or maybe pulling from some novel and giving him 1 angelic wing and 1 Erinyes wings or some such.

I have no idea of the party make up, but I know one player wants to play a hobgoblin fighter that wants to be the leader of the party.

Edit: Some other thoughts

Warforged cleric of the Forge. A "self forged"

A Warlock battlefield controller with invocations for eldritch blast. Agonizing, Repelling, reduce movement one, and the pulling one. Better yet if they are the UA ones that aren't limited to once per turn. Combo with spike growth.

A Warforged Dream druid with 1 level of life cleric. Lots a healing.

A brute fighter with 1 level of barbarian for the unarmored AC(unless warforged_). Combo with Mariner fighting style from UA, and VDS, GWF, and Revenent blade from WfGTE. Only need dex and con if I don't care about the rest of barbarian. Can take more barbarian for for wolf/bear totem, advantage on initiative and dex saves. Paladin for Cha to AC... etc..

[Khrysaes]

Well, 6 hours and no replies. Makes me feel sad, though I guess I never asked an actual question.

I have decided which concept to go with, I want to make a warforged based on Talion(PC) and Celembrimbor(Warlock patron) from Shadow of Mordor and War. I think this would be more interesting story wise, and as the DM can act as the patron, allows him more direct involvement in the story.

I am having trouble decided how to build the character though, so please give me advice. What class combos/spells/and feats would you take to replicate Talion and Celembrimbor.


Here is what I have thought so far.

1: Hexblade/Eldritch Knight. Pact of the tome for ritual casting versatility, and EK for the weapon bond. I also feel that Eldritch blast + attack and Booming Blade + attack would be nice at EK level 7, and can be themed as character+patron combos.

2: Hexblade/Brute. Pact of the blade for weapon bond and weapon shape versatility. Brute with Dual Scimitar and Great weapon fighting style fun for 3d4+ per hit.

Other thoughts:
Race: Envoy Warforged, smiths tool's proficiency. This replicates Celembrimbor's smithing ability, and while mechanically it is my warforged attachment, it can be themed as the specter of the elf ghost in my weapon appearing to make an item.

Class: Forge cleric 1. Much for the same reasons as above, but +1 magic item and actually making items or copies of items.

Class: Ancients Paladin 7: So much defensiveness.. and smites.

Class: Bear totem Barbarian: much the same reason as above, has a bit of less overlap though, but less required investment.

Class: Hunter Ranger: Horde breaker gives a chance at another attack in a turn. This can be useful for both EK or Brute fighter, as with EK you can make the attack based of the bonus action attack from the level 7 feature, and with brute and vds, it is another 3d4+ damage. Also get a few more spells, and if revised ranger some nice features.

[Great Dragon]

Well, 6 hours and no replies. Makes me feel sad, though I guess I never asked an actual question.

I have decided which concept to go with, I want to make a warforged based on Talion(PC) and Celembrimbor(Warlock patron) from Shadow of Mordor and War. I think this would be more interesting story wise, and as the DM can act as the patron, allows him more direct involvement in the story.

I am having trouble decided how to build the character though, so please give me advice. What class combos/spells/and feats would you take to replicate Talion and Celembrimbor.


Here is what I have thought so far.

1: Hexblade/Eldritch Knight. Pact of the tome

2: Hexblade/Brute. Pact of the blade.



Talion(PC) and Celembrimbor(Warlock patron) from Shadow of Mordor

Sorry, I did read your post, but wasn't sure how to help. Other reasons apply as well.

I'm not familiar with either Talion or Celembrimbor, sorry.

There are two problems I'm having, (1) I'm not really sure what your goal is for this PC (see above), and (2) that a lot of the choices you have listed require DM intervention for full effect.
Stats: Point Buy or Rolled?

(IMO)
Are you going for more Attacks for better DPR?
Fighter for more attack, plus Action Surge to double base number, plus Bonus Action (ability mod to all hits) if TWF. Go EK if wanting some Magic Damage for Creatures Resistant to (non-magical) physical damage.

Are you going for Tough to kill with decent DPR?
Barbarian, Subclass added for flavor, Ancestral Guardian to help Party; but Bear Totem to resist everything but Psychic.

Are you going for Hard to Hit with (healing+) spell options? Cleric, with Domain for flavor.
Are you going for Crowd Control, Healing and sneaky?
Druids can be cool.

1) Depends on if you take Eldritch Smite Invocation, in which case Paladin gives just as good, with more spell choices.

(2) I don't have Brute available atm, but I'd say compaire this with Champion.


Race: Envoy Warforged, smiths tool's proficiency. This replicates Celembrimbor's smithing ability, and while mechanically it is my warforged attachment, it can be themed as the specter of the elf ghost in my weapon appearing to make an item.

If combined with Warlock, this could work, but requires DM adjustments.


Class: Forge cleric 1. Much for the same reasons as above, but +1 magic item and actually making items or copies of items.

Magic Armor/Weapon at start of the day is good, but actually crafting magic items is dependent on Downtime and resouces.


Class: Ancients Paladin 7: So much defensiveness.. and smites.
For me, This class competes with Monster Slayer Ranger for effectiveness against magical beings.


Class: Bear totem Barbarian: much the same reason as above, has a bit of less overlap though, but less required investment.
See above.


Class: Hunter Ranger: Horde breaker gives a chance at another attack in a turn.
Depends on how often the PC gets swarmed by Hordes of Mooks, really.

Multiclassing is tricky, I only do that if I really want/need a feature that is only available to another Class/Subclass.

[Khrysaes]

Sorry, I did read your post, but wasn't sure how to help. Other reasons apply as well.

I'm not familiar with either Talion or Celembrimbor, sorry.

There are two problems I'm having, (1) I'm not really sure what your goal is for this PC (see above), and (2) that a lot of the choices you have listed require DM intervention for full effect.
Stats: Point Buy or Rolled?

(IMO)
Are you going for more Attacks for better DPR?
Fighter for more attack, plus Action Surge to double base number, plus Bonus Action (ability mod to all hits) if TWF. Go EK if wanting some Magic Damage for Creatures Resistant to (non-magical) physical damage.

Are you going for Tough to kill with decent DPR?
Barbarian, Subclass added for flavor, Ancestral Guardian to help Party; but Bear Totem to resist everything but Psychic.

Are you going for Hard to Hit with (healing+) spell options? Cleric, with Domain for flavor.
Are you going for Crowd Control, Healing and sneaky?
Druids can be cool.



You are right, I tend to ramble as I make posts and make unclear requests.

So, Talion is a human warrior that gets killed and is revived because of a symbiotic bond with an elf ghost (celembrimbor) attached to a ring. Talion is a good fighter, but the elf brings to him mystical capabilities such as elf shot, which are spectral arrows; teleportation; mind control; tracking abilities; and the spectral elf appearing to fight with him. There may be more but I can't remember them at the moment without looking stuff up.

That being said, when I make characters, I try to come up with the theme of what I want them to do and find mechanics to fit it. I think a fighter/hexblade brings a lot of this to the character.

However, you are correct, I haven't really consolidated a mechanical goal, as I do not know what I want there ultimately. All I know is I want it to fit the character goal, be useful to the party, be fun to play at all levels, and not take some rediculous level to be effective or portray the character goal. The character goal should be achieved early, and just improved upon as I level up, regardless of what classes/features are picked.

I don't actually think DM intervention is needed for most of what I listed, and as of right now I have no idea the party comp or character creation rules. But thanks for your feedback.

[Tawmis]

I see Great Dragon replied here in this thread; but they also have a thread to help players build their characters!
Check it out:
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?595813-Build-A-Character

[Great Dragon]

Thanks, Tawmis !!


Elf shot(1) which are spectral arrows; teleportation; mind control; tracking abilities; and the spectral elf appearing to fight with him(2).

(1) Sounds like a variation on Arcane Archer

(2) Ancestral Guardian can cover this.
(Granting Disadvantage for foes attacking anyone other than the PC)

Do you think two classes can cover the idea for this PC?

Adding Hexblade would add Extra damage from Hexblade's Curse and Hex spell, but costs two rounds to set up.
But depending on how many Warlock levels, Invocations can add more.

Not sure if tripple classing is what you want to do, though.


C-Human. 1 forge cleric, 5 warlock tome, and 11 ek would be ideal, leaving me with 3 levels?
I can take 3 ranger.... darkstalker would fit thematically.
Sorry - It's late now (I've been up since 5 am), but I can work on this tomorrow all day if I need to.
I'll do my very best.

[Khrysaes]

This is why i was thinking hexblqde.

Tie the elf to weapon instead of ring. Though a ring would work as well.

Eldritch blast = elf shot.
Shield = the elf appearing to parry strikes.
Mist step = teleportation.
Charm person, suggestion, dominate = mind control
Invisibility = elf stealth
Expeditions retreat = a sprint boost that occurs in game
I think all of the elf themed mechanics can be reflavored spells.

That is why im thinking ek/hexblade.

I think there was also tracking stuff, which would work well with ranger.

And of course, previously mentioned elf smith forge cleric parrallels.

The biggest dilema i think i have is level splits and mechanical desires right now.

Blade pact fits better, but ek can do mostly the same thing

Tome pact is Super versatile, but requires an invocation

So which invocations do i want? Agonizing, devils sight, cloak of flies, tome ritual one?? How much warlock do i take?

I think 1 forge cleric, 5 warlock tome, and 11 ek would be ideal, leaving me with 3 levels? I can take 3 ranger.... darkstalker would fit thematically.

This worksout cjaracter wise, but how is it mechanically?

[Great Dragon]

I didn’t choose between ASIs or Feats, instead just noting when they were available.

Forge Cleric 1 proficiency with heavy armor and Smith's Tools.
Domain Spells: Identify and Searing Smite.
After Cleric, what mechanical benefit you want is going to determine what your PC takes.


Taking fighter after cleric gets you Martial Weapons, Second Wind and Action Surge until 3rd level. Weapon Bond is rather nice: Spells: Now, because EK is limited to Abjuration and Evocation (and one Other School at 1st level) until 8th level, this Subclass doesn’t seem to add much to the overall mechanical benefits before then. The ones listed below were what I thought you would be interested in.

03 Weapon Bond
Cantrips: Fire Bolt and True Strike
First: (2 slots) Absorb Elements (Abj) Chromatic Orb (Evo) Expeditious Retreat (Tran)

04 ASI (3 slots) +1 Spell Witch Bolt (Evo)

07 War Magic (Able to cast True Strike as an Action and attack as a Bonus Action)
(4 slots) First level
+1 spell Second level Melf’s Acid Arrow (Evo)

08 ASI +1 spell Detect Thoughts

10 Cantrip Ray of Frost
+1 spell Magic Weapon

11 +1 spell Shadow Blade



01 Hexblade’s Curse.
Cantrips (2) Eldritch Blast, Poison spray (Booming Blade)
First (2 known) Hex, Shield
02 Invocations Eldritch Spear, Agonizing Blast
+1 spell Hellish Rebuke
Devil’s Sight, Eldritch Sight
03 Tome (Trade Agonizing Blast for Book of Ancients Invocation)
+1 spell Crown of Madness

04 Suggested Feat - Spell Sniper (But only if keeping Eldritch Spear)
+1 spell Hold Person

05 Invocation regain Agonizing Blast
+1 Spell Tongues (Alternate = Fear)


Exact levels for what is taken? I’d suggest taking EK to at least 4th level for ASI/Feat, or Warlock all the way to 5th level, for full effect. Adding three levels of Ranger for Hunter can be done anytime, without too much trouble.

[Khrysaes]

Okay, I have learned the party composition and the character creation methods.

First: UA and Warforged are allowed.

Party:
Dwarf Monk
Vedalken Sorceror
Bard
Cleric
Me.

I wanted to make a Warforged character based on Talion of Shadow of Mordor, the DM likes my concept, and so my Hexblade patron is the active spirit of a elf hero who teaches my character how to fight.

So Hexblade/fighter.

Character creation: Start at level 5.
Stats will be rolled
Roll 4d6, 7 times and drop the lowest 4th d6 for every stat and your lowest 7th stat, for obvious reasons

My rolls: 10, 11, 14, 15, 16, 17

So, 11 str, 16 dex, 15(16) con, 10 int, 14 wis, 17(19) Cha

Contrary to my previous posts, I want to consolidate my character. I am not taking cleric levels, and I kind of don't want to have a lot of spells to cast, though a few would be nice.

I was thinking a few things.

Revised Spell Less gloomstalker ranger 3/Battlemaster fighter 12/Hexblade 3/??? 2(possibly 2 more ASI).

Or, use the Brute subclass, and maybe Rogue Swashbuckler subclass as it gives cunning action and synergizes well with Cha.

The spell less ranger/battle master combo would net me 8 known manuvers, 2 fighting styles, advantage on initiative, advantage on 1st round attacks, and 9 superiority dice. I can take the feat for 10 maneuvers and 10 dice. all recharging on a short rest. Downside, would key of my dex, not my Cha(although I could switch the two stats). This would certainly give me the weapon master feel.

Brute wouldn't care if my main stat is Cha.

Fighter's extra attacks don't blend well with booming blade or eldritch blast, and my extra attack is getting put off a few levels anyways(though I might be able to convince the DM to let bonus action attack with an off hand along with booming blade.

I dont know what to do. please advise me. I want something that gets the concept. and is fun to play regardless of level.

[Khrysaes]

I solve it.

Not that anyone cares, but I will be doing
8 revised spell-less ranger gloomstalker.
4 Monster hunter(UA) fighter.
5 College of Swords Bard
3 hexblade Warlock

This will get me 9 maneuvers known, 9 superiority dice, blade flourishes, 5 bardic inspiriation dice(at d8), two 2nd level spells. all rechargning on a short rest.

And 4 ASI.

[Great Dragon]

I cared, I just couldn't think of anything better, And I was super busy until today.

I'm really not very good at Maximum Optimization Building.

[Khrysaes]

I cared, I just couldn't think of anything better, And I was super busy until today.

I'm really not very good at Maximum Optimization Building.

Well thank you, I appreciate it. I just decided I wanted to be a melee master, and as such superiority dice and bardic inspiriation for 14 moves+ per short rest seemed fun.

[Great Dragon]

8 revised spell-less ranger gloomstalker.
4 Monster hunter(UA) fighter.
5 College of Swords Bard
3 hexblade Warlock (Blade Pact ?)

Is 5th Bard just for 3rd level spells?

If not, dropping to Bard 4 and increasing Warlock to 4 would give another feat.

[Khrysaes]

8 revised spell-less ranger gloomstalker.
4 Monster hunter(UA) fighter.
5 College of Swords Bard
3 hexblade Warlock (Blade Pact ?)

Is 5th Bard just for 3rd level spells?

If not, dropping to Bard 4 and increasing Warlock to 4 would give another feat.

Short rest inspiration, and 3rd level spells.

Blade flourishes uses inspiriation dice.


TL:DR for below.

Homebrew feats may be in play, I may change my build

Question 1, if I can take only 4 levels of bard, which would be more useful?

College of Fools: Sleight of Hand and Thieve's tools proficiency, bonus action to simultaneously dash and disengage and reduce fall damage by half.

College of Swords: Blade flourishes, but without bard 5, the inspiration is per long rest.

Question 2, Can I be a warforged and get 5 ASI somehow with 11 fighter, 3 ranger, 3 bard, and 2 warlock? Most I can find is 4.

Question 3, What order would be best to take the feats below?

Although, now, since I have talked with the DM here are some... interesting things.

1: My Double scimitar gets my hexblade even though it is two handed.
2: I can use the double scimitar's special bonus action attack after using booming blade.
3: I can take blade revenant even though I am not an elf.

Additionally,

There may be some homebrew feats in play, some of which are QUITE powerful. If they aren't in play, then I already have a plan.

My favorites are:

Anti-somatic casting:
- Increase your Charisma, Wisdom or Intelligence score by 1 point, to a max of 20.
- You can add your spell casting ability modifier to spell damage rolls.
- You can cast spells without somatic components.

Spell Focus:
Choose one school of magic, You gain +2 to your saving throw DC, +2 to any spell attack roll and +2 to the DC required to dispel magical effects or to counterspell the spells you cast of the chosen school. In addition, you gain a cantrip of choice from that school from any spell list. This cantrip will count as if it were a cantrip from your class if you choose one from another spell list (meaning you'll use your spellcasting ability to cast it).

Cantrip Mastery:
Cantrip Mastery allows the caster use a bonus action to cast any cantrip they know.

Must be possess the ability to cast cantrips.
As a bonus action, cast a cantrip.
Add +1 to Int, Cha, or Wis, base stat may not exceed 20.

Finesse weapon master:
You've learned to spot the weak spots in a creature's defenses, capitalizing on their mistakes with your finesse weapon. You gain the following benefits:

If they are made with a finesse weapon, your weapon attacks score a critical hit on a roll of 19 or 20.
Before you make a melee attack with a finesse weapon that you are proficient with, you can choose to take a -5 penalty to the attack roll. If the attack hits, you add +10 to the attack's damage.

And of course, revenant blade and warcaster.

Revenant blade makes Double Scimitar a finesse weapon, opening up increased crit AND power attack.

Cantrip master would make booming blade & eldritch blast castable as a bonus action.

Antisomatic adds my stat to the spells again, so EB and BB will be +10 damage each

Warcaster makes either cantrip castable as a reaction.

Spell focus is just cool, but lowest priority. It would allow say, a cleric, to have a wis based EB, THEN multiclass Warlock for agonizing blast to add cha to damage. Light clerics at level 8 would add wis to damage. And with antisomatic they could add wis again. Potentially a +15 EB..


So I have been playing around with my feats and levels and determined that:

If I do 6 Fighter/8 ranger/4 bard/2 warlock, I keep most of my build, and get 5 feats. I would love to get to Fighter 11, but I havent figured out how to do that ad get 5 feats while keeping 3 ranger, 3 bard, 2 warlock. Most I have gotten is 4.

The questions are at the top.

[nickl_2000]

Question 1, if I can take only 4 levels of bard, which would be more useful?

College of Fools: Sleight of Hand and Thieve's tools proficiency, bonus action to simultaneously dash and disengage and reduce fall damage by half.

College of Swords: Blade flourishes, but without bard 5, the inspiration is per long rest.



If you are going to be only going 4 levels into bard then College of Fools will be better. At 5 I would likely takes Swords instead




Question 2, Can I be a warforged and get 5 ASI somehow with 11 fighter, 3 ranger, 3 bard, and 2 warlock? Most I can find is 4.



Nope. You will only get ASIs at 4,6,8,10 Fighter and nothing else. You would have to get to Fighter 12 or something else 4 to get an additional ASI. Considering how overpowered some of the Feats you mentioned are, I would definitely be interested in as many ASIs as possible. Even to the point of forsaking bard altogether. You could easily go Fighter 12, Ranger 4, Warlock 4, and get 3 more ASIs to break the game.

[Khrysaes]

If you are going to be only going 4 levels into bard then College of Fools will be better. At 5 I would likely takes Swords instead




Nope. You will only get ASIs at 4,6,8,10 Fighter and nothing else. You would have to get to Fighter 12 or something else 4 to get an additional ASI. Considering how overpowered some of the Feats you mentioned are, I would definitely be interested in as many ASIs as possible. Even to the point of forsaking bard altogether. You could easily go Fighter 12, Ranger 4, Warlock 4, and get 3 more ASIs to break the game.

I think you mean Fighter 12 not 10, as 10 is a martial archetype feature.

That being said, I had thought about dropping bard too, I may do it.

[nickl_2000]

I think you mean Fighter 12 not 10, as 10 is a martial archetype feature.

That being said, I had thought about dropping bard too, I may do it.

Yup, my mind was confusing Fighter and Rogue bonus ASIs.

[Keravath]

My biggest question was that your stated goal didn't correspond well to any of the builds you were considering.

"I mostly want to play a character that can support others, but isn't useless otherwise"

While all of the builds you mention go fairly strongly into melee damage which really doesn't go that far towards supporting others.

If by "isn't useless otherwise" you mean being able to do single target damage when not supporting and controlling the combat then then I think one of the best options is lore bard X/ hexblade warlock 2 ... using agonizing blast for direct damage on those turns when you aren't using spells like Suggestion/Blindness/Dissonant Whispers/Faerie Fire/Hypnotic Pattern/Fireball/Mass Suggestion to totally control and disrupt combat. You also have all the skills needed to do well at the social skill checks as well as exploration and depending on race you will have good stats across the board. Starting half-elf with good stats and extra skills or variant human with resilient constitution both work pretty well. I would usually take the hexblade dip early so that by level 5 you are 3/2 so that you have your direct damage all lined up as well as the ability to wear medium armor and shields, wield martial weapons which can be useful in tier 1, as well as having two first level short rest spell slots, shield and hex spells without needing to use magical secrets and other goodies.

However, this only really applies if your stated goal of being a good support that can do some damage applies. All your other builds have so many classes that their effectiveness at higher level (if the game will even go that far) could be imparied a bit ... certainly the spell casters to some extent. If you want ritual spells, just take the ritual caster feat at some point though you will want two ASI for charisma and resilient constitution at least.

Anyway, just something to consider if you are still building the character.

[Khrysaes]

My biggest question was that your stated goal didn't correspond well to any of the builds you were considering.

"I mostly want to play a character that can support others, but isn't useless otherwise"

While all of the builds you mention go fairly strongly into melee damage which really doesn't go that far towards supporting others.

If by "isn't useless otherwise" you mean being able to do single target damage when not supporting and controlling the combat then then I think one of the best options is lore bard X/ hexblade warlock 2 ... using agonizing blast for direct damage on those turns when you aren't using spells like Suggestion/Blindness/Dissonant Whispers/Faerie Fire/Hypnotic Pattern/Fireball/Mass Suggestion to totally control and disrupt combat. You also have all the skills needed to do well at the social skill checks as well as exploration and depending on race you will have good stats across the board. Starting half-elf with good stats and extra skills or variant human with resilient constitution both work pretty well. I would usually take the hexblade dip early so that by level 5 you are 3/2 so that you have your direct damage all lined up as well as the ability to wear medium armor and shields, wield martial weapons which can be useful in tier 1, as well as having two first level short rest spell slots, shield and hex spells without needing to use magical secrets and other goodies.

However, this only really applies if your stated goal of being a good support that can do some damage applies. All your other builds have so many classes that their effectiveness at higher level (if the game will even go that far) could be imparied a bit ... certainly the spell casters to some extent. If you want ritual spells, just take the ritual caster feat at some point though you will want two ASI for charisma and resilient constitution at least.

Anyway, just something to consider if you are still building the character.

Youre right. It doesnt fit what i originally said. My goal changed i guess.

That said, i didnt want to be a strong caster. Or i posted in the wrong thread i dont know.

My methodology was to take a battle master fighter and improve it. Hence the multiclass of monster hunter fighter and spell less revised ranger. 6 known maneuvers, 7 if 5 ranger, 8 dice, more if higher fighter and other good features.

Warlock mostly was for story, booming blade, and eldritch blast.

At this point i am trying to decide if 1 extra attack is worth the loss of bard skills, jack of all trades, expertise, flourishes or tumble, and spells. As of right now no.

[Great Dragon]

My methodology was to take a battle master fighter and improve it. Hence the multiclass of monster hunter fighter and spell less revised ranger. 6 known maneuvers, 7 if 5 ranger, 8 dice, more if higher fighter and other good features.

Warlock mostly was for story, booming blade, and eldritch blast.

At this point i am trying to decide if 1 extra attack is worth the loss of bard skills, jack of all trades, expertise, flourishes or tumble, and spells. As of right now no.

Well, if all you're going for with Warlock is Hex and Eldritch Blast, just take vHuman with Magic Initiate and get those plus another Cantrip. (Light or Message)

Agonizing Blast Invocation plus Eldritch Spear Invocation with Spell Sniper feat (1d10 +Cha damage, 600' range and ignore everything but full cover/concealment) Hexblade's Curse plus Hex, and (especially) Story are really all I see as a reason to take Warlock; but Hexblade without a Pact (usually Blade) is not very impressive, to me.

Sword Bard plus Battlemaster Fighter sounds like an interesting combination.

But, honestly, I see Rogue: either Swashbuckler (able to SA a foe even if sperated from the Party) or Mastermind (to Help party members up to 30 feet away) with Mobility Feat (and maybe Stalker feat for Improved Stealth) being a bit more effective for your "limited spells" build, with only the above MI feat giving any spells. True, not a complete replacement of Swords Bard, but fairly close for no spells.

Swashbuckler (Mobility feat) combined with Battlemaster (Sentinel feat) with Skulker feat for Stealth has potential, both in and out of combat.


Rangers
Hunter is effective once the target has taken some damage; (being spell-less doesn't hurt, since Hunter's Mark isn't really a big deal after 10th level.)

Monster Slayer is potent against spell-using foes but really only at high levels. (Being spell-less can be a setback, since some of the higher spells are rather useful)

Gloomestalker would pair nicely with Rogue options. But, remember to take a Race with Darkvision. Drow rule here, with 120' see-in-the-dark vision.


****
Searched monster hunter fighter and it looked like a Homebrew combination of Battlemaster Fighter and Monster Slayer Ranger. Needs DM approval.

[Khrysaes]

Some thoughts.
I'd be happy to look at some more in depth options if you'd be interested in posting in my Build A Character (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?595813-Build-A-Character) thread.



Well, if all you're going for with Warlock is Hex and Eldritch Blast, just take vHuman with Magic Initiate and get those plus another Cantrip. (Light or Message)

Agonizing Blast Invocation plus Eldritch Spear Invocation with Spell Sniper feat (1d10 +Cha damage, 600' range and ignore everything but full cover/concealment) Hexblade's Curse plus Hex, and (especially) Story are really all I see as a reason to take Warlock; but Hexblade without a Pact (usually Blade) is not very impressive, to me.

Sword Bard plus Battlemaster Fighter sounds like an interesting combination.

But, honestly, I see Rogue: either Swashbuckler (able to SA a foe even if sperated from the Party) or Mastermind (to Help party members up to 30 feet away) with Mobility Feat (and maybe Stalker feat for Improved Stealth) being a bit more effective for your "limited spells" build, with only the above MI feat giving any spells. True, not a complete replacement of Swords Bard, but fairly close for no spells.

Swashbuckler (Mobility feat) combined with Battlemaster (Sentinel feat) with Skulker feat for Stealth has potential, both in and out of combat.


Rangers
Hunter is effective once the target has taken some damage; (being spell-less doesn't hurt, since Hunter's Mark isn't really a big deal after 10th level.)

Monster Slayer is potent against spell-using foes but really only at high levels. (Being spell-less can be a setback, since some of the higher spells are rather useful)

Gloomestalker would pair nicely with Rogue options. But, remember to take a Race with Darkvision. Drow rule here, with 120' see-in-the-dark vision.


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Searched monster hunter fighter and it looked like a Homebrew combination of Battlemaster Fighter and Monster Slayer Ranger. Needs DM approval.



Monster hunter fighter was UA. So official test content. Already approved by DM.

Given the choice between an asi for magic initiate and a warlock level, i choose the warlock level since it is short rest and gets more features.

DM wanted everyone to start with a magic item. So mine is two scimitars that combine to the double scimitar. One of which is the hex warrior weapon. Basically a double scimitar is my hexweapon. He also approved


I had wanted swashbuckler but found myself stretched thin so i ignored it. I guess i could go 4 fighter, 4 ranger, 4 rogue, 2 warlock, 6 bard. I lose 1 maneuver, proficiency in wisdom saves and greater favored enemy gain all the rogue goodies. Might be worth it. The core of the concept is 2 warlock 3 fighter 4 ranger. The other 11 levels can be played with.

[Great Dragon]

I had wanted swashbuckler but found myself stretched thin so i ignored it. I guess i could go 4 fighter, 4 ranger, 4 rogue, 2 warlock, 6 bard. I lose 1 maneuver, proficiency in wisdom saves and greater favored enemy gain all the rogue goodies. Might be worth it.

5 MH fighter (for Extra Attack), 4 Hunter ranger, 4 Swashbuckler rogue, 2 Hexblade warlock, and 5 Swords bard looks pretty good to me, if a bit MAD.

Since your not worried too much about spells, 5 Rogue (Uncanny Dodge and 3d6 SA) and 4 Bard might be ok.


The core of the concept is 2 warlock 3 fighter 4 ranger. The other 11 levels can be played with.


Maybe?
5 Hex warlock (Third level spells, 3 Invocations, and Pact) 6 MH fighter (Fighting Style, Extra attack, +2 ASI/Feats) 4 Hunter ranger (Class kick*** -ery and Feat), 5 Swords Bard (More coolness, 3rd level spells and Feat)

For less spells, trade Bard for Swb Rogue 5?
IDK, I'd have to read more on what Flourishes do.

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Please excuse my cluelessness, see "white room" in Signature.

[Khrysaes]

5 MH fighter (for Extra Attack), 4 Hunter ranger, 4 Swashbuckler rogue, 2 Hexblade warlock, and 5 Swords bard looks pretty good to me, if a bit MAD.


Maybe?
5 Hex warlock (Third level spells, 3 Invocations, and Pact) 6 MH fighter (Fighting Style, Extra attack, +2 ASI/Feats) 4 Hunter ranger (Class kick*** -ery and Feat), 5 Swords Bard (More coolness, 3rd level spells and Feat)
*********
Please excuse my cluelessness, see "white room" in Signature.

I basically decided on the first. Also it isnt mad, just Dex > Cha > Con. So, a normal bard. I also rolled stats per DM instruction, my starting stats are 11, 19, 16, 10, 14, 16.

I chose 6 Bard over 5 fighter/5 bard because sword bard 6 also gets extra attack, and a couple spell slots. I may take 5 ranger instead for 1 more maneuver known instead.

I considered 8 ranger more valuable than 6 fighter, as I am a gloom stalker, and at 7 ranger I would get wisdom save proficiency. Looking at rogue vs ranger 5-8, revised Ranger gets greater favored enemy, wisdom save proficiency, 1 maneuver known, 1 asi, and dash as a bonus action. Rogue gets +1 skill, thieves tools, expertise, sneak attack 2d6, charisma to initiative, 1 asi, almost free disengage, and dash, disengage, and hide as a bonus action.

The ASI is the same.
Rogues get more options as a bonus action than rangers.
Sneak attack is more versatile if less consistent damage than Revised Ranger favored enemy.
The skill, tool, and expertise is basically the prodigy feat. So just a different feat than Wis save proficiency.

I can take 5 ranger or 6 bard, both get me Extra attack, one will get a new maneuver, one gets 3rd level spells. Ill probably pick bard h
here.

This is basically what I do. Take a concept, then compare levels and gains to my priorities.

I mean, I could take 10 bard instead of 4 rogue, and get Magical Secrets. I would still have better casting than a 20th level ranger, and a lot more abilities.

I want a martial character, a master of battle, however the character is basically possessed by an elf's ghost who teaches him the ways of combat and the hunt. I want a small amount of spells to reflect the supernatural abilities granted by that ghost.

Well battlemaster and spell-less ranger grant maneuvers, however I liked the Monster Hunter more, and UA was approved so I took that for the fighter. Since I am not taking more than 4 fighter, I actually get more by having 4 maneuvers rather than 3. Ranger supplements this with 2-3 battlemaster maneuvers, and 4 more dice. Sword bard flourish, especially at level 5, are basically more maneuvers.

Bard gives me my small smattering of spells. Warlock gives me the shield spell, booming blade, and eldritch blast, which can be themed to be Ghost elf blocking attacks, ghost elf attacking, ghost elf shooting bow, respectively. The bard spells will likely be support and mind effecting ones like charm person.

Rogue adds to the martial aspect by allowing me more and faster maneuverability in combat reflected in Swashbuckler and Dash/Disengage. I do wish I could have the Satire Bard's tumble, but this will do.

I then set my leveling plan up such that it can be comprable to a pure classes, and prioritizes the feature's I want and replicate similar scaling.

So 1 Fighter.
2 Ranger (advantage on initiative and first round attacks, slight damage increase to humanoids)
3 Ranger (Maneuvers, superiority dice, and another fighting style, easily as good as battlemaster at level 3.)
4 Warlock(1 warlock is like a suped up magic initiate)
5 Ranger (Booming blade and EB scales here, it can be compared to extra attack. Strictly not quite as good, but good enough for me)
6 Ranger (ASI, fighter also gets ASI at level 6)
7 Warlock (A second spell slot per short rest, increased dark vision range and cha to damage for eldritch blast.. Fighter and ranger get an archetype feature here, this is pretty good in comparison.)
8 Fighter (action surge. Not quite as good as an ASI this level)
9 Fighter (Monster hunter, which means 6 known maneuvers and 8 dice. A Battle master at this level has 5/5. I also get 2 skills, a language, and detect magic as a ritual, comprable to an ASI)
10 Fighter (ASI, bit late, but not the worse)
11 Bard (1 skill, spells, and bardic inspiration. Booming blade and EB scale to offset the loss of fighter's secnod extra attack).
12 Bard (Jack of all trades is just good)
13 Bard (3 more dice per long rest for basically 3 maneuvers known. Also second level spells. and, while almost useless, my 3rd fighting style)
14 Bard (Another ASI, bit later than the normal 12, but a fighter gets one here. I have many more features. )
15 Bard (Short rest bard dice. Brings them in line with my maneuver dice. Also D8, so Ill have 12d8 dice here. 4d8 for 3 flourishes/short rest, 8d8 for 9 maneuvers. 3rd level spells. A Battlemaster has 9 maneuvers and 6 dice, so comprable maneuvers and double the dice.)
16 Bard / ranger (extra attack, ranger would get me maneuver, bard gets me counter charm, 1 spell known, and 1 3rd level slot.)
17 Rogue (slight increase in damage with sneak attack, 1 skill, 1 tool, 2 expertise, basically the prodigy feat.)
18 Rogue (cunning action)
19 Rogue (+4 initiative, and a nice add on to my combat abilities, but nothing really special)
20 Rogue, (ASI) Pure characters get 5. I get 4 and some class features are as powerful as or more powerful than feats (rogue 1/warlock 1).

[KnotaGuru]

Highly doubt you'll make it to level 20. Building past level 12 is a waste in my experience. So I think you may be disappointed with multi-classing 4 classes to get all the features you want.

If you want maneuvers, just go with 1 class that gives them (like BM fighter) and take the martial adept feat. This gives you 5 maneuver dice/short rest. Just take lots of short rests (the party monk, bard and even the cleric will want lots of rest anyway). This gives you more ASIs to select fun feats as well.

[Great Dragon]

@Khrysaes. Looks like you got this covered.

I tend to agree with KnotaGuru, in that getting to 20th level might not be possible.

I think the shortest RL Time it took to get from 1st to 20th was 8 months, with mostly non-stop Hard to Deadly fights each weekly session.

[Khrysaes]

@Khrysaes. Looks like you got this covered.

I tend to agree with KnotaGuru, in that getting to 20th level might not be possible.

I think the shortest RL Time it took to get from 1st to 20th was 8 months, with mostly non-stop Hard to Deadly fights each weekly session.

Not that this is an AL session, but season 9 tules came out. Every adventure module you finish is a level up. So 19 three hour adventures should do it. Weekly that is... 5 months?

But yeah i got it covered. I start with what im considering my core mechanics and adding to them as it goes. I also purposefully dont optimize my character.