Lorac, Lord of Secrets... sounds cool, righ? but how do I make it work?

[dehro]

I'm thinking I want to create a BBEG that is, as per the title, the ultimate manipulator and collector of secrets. He knows the most intimate desires and fears of your soul, and will use that knowledge to scheme, torture, tempt, hurt you.

that's the general idea. I'm not even sure if this should be an actual god, an extremely potent npc, something in between the two, a demon or what else. (I'm leaning towards a god or at least a lesser god)... who might also keep his godhood as a secret until the time for a drammatic reveal is ripe.

thing is, I don't know how that could work meccanically. I dislike psionics, and don't want to just handwave how the villain gets his info, how he knows the secrets that characters don't even bring at the table.
I've thought of making it dream based, or spell based.. but if so.. what spells? what feats and magical abilities allow a creature to peer into the minds of others and/or to manipulate their dreams and fears?
Finally, how would you characterise this NPC/Deity?

[Kane0]

Detect Thoughts and Dream jump out as obvious starting points.

Are you thinking class levels? Because a Wizard can pick that as a signature spell being 2nd level, and a Sorcerer can Subtle cast. There are a couple of magic items too.

If you're not modeling it after PC building (which is the usual way) then there's no real limit, set it up however you like. Perhaps he can Detect Thoughts via Scrying and prefers to store away the memories in specially prepared gems, a handy way to file it all away for later use.

[dehro]

Detect Thoughts and Dream jump out as obvious starting points.

Are you thinking class levels? Because a Wizard can pick that as a signature spell being 2nd level, and a Sorcerer can Subtle cast. There are a couple of magic items too.

If you're not modeling it after PC building (which is the usual way) then there's no real limit, set it up however you like. Perhaps he can Detect Thoughts via Scrying and prefers to store away the memories in specially prepared gems, a handy way to file it all away for later use.

he'd be either a full build, as in level 20, or beyond that...so, yes.. unlimited, but still rooted in a somewhat comprehensible reality. Kind of like you can understand how a world class pool player is doing the same things you are doing, except every ball he hits goes at a speed that is 10 times your speed... plus there are trick shots that you simply can't do because you simply don't understand the mechanics, and even if you did, you lack the means to reproduce them. That said, the things he does should at least be somewhat traceable to abilities and spells that are in the books.
I probably am not making a whole lot of sense.

[Kane0]

Yeah that's possible. He doesn't have to be a level 20 Diviner Wizard with Spell Mastery: Detect Thoughts, he just needs to be able to use magic the PCs can identify as Divination magic and with effects similar to Detect Thoughts. Remember that the PCs don't see the statblock, they experience only what you as the DM describe. You aren't shackled to the PC building rules for your NPCs, those rules exist for PCs to be vaguely balanced against on another and to inform you of their capabilities. Your NPCs don't need that sort of thing, they need to fulfil a role in your world and your story. You make them to be what you need, not to what the handbook needs.

The easiest way to do it is with the monster building rules in the MM. That can help frame the rough power level (CR) you want them to be at, with the necessary numbers to match. Then you add the flavor, like At-Will Detect Thoughts and Suggestion or Command as a legendary action.

[HappyDaze]

I'd start with an Arcanaloth and build up from there.

[JellyPooga]

Ok, first up; If your players are anything like mine, you really want to rethink that name. "Lord of Secrets" is cool, but it only takes one 'genius' to notice that "Lorac" is "Carol" backwards and all of a sudden your BBEG will lose all gravitas as your players start referring to him as Carol (it's even worse if there's a Bard in the party...there's at least one song with a Carol in, let alone starting in on "Christmas Carol" jokes). Seriously, I mean no insult by saying this, but when it comes to the BBEG, you need zero chinks in the armour if you're playing anything but a comedic game and that goes as much for roleplaying elements (including names) as it does mechanical ones.

Second; telepathy. You want it.

Thirdly; think about Lair Actions and Regional Effects.

Fourthly; Allies. Before getting into the nitty gritty of your bad guy himself, the players will know who/what to expect by the allies they fight getting to him. Does he have a tribe of sneaky kobolds as lackies to set the traps and gather information? Does he use summoned demons to do the menial work? Is there a lieutenant (or several) he employs to gather secrets from further afield or manage his various lairs? Are his hands in the activities of the Thieves Guild? How about the Merchants Guild instead, or even the Nobility? How will the players recognise his handiwork so that they decide to track him down? The answers to all of these questions and more should be reflected in the final encounter and the stats of your Lord of Secrets, in the same way that adventurers might recognise they're about to fight a medusa because of the large number of lifelike statues, grecian architecture and snakes leading up to the encounter. Your BBEG is only as memorable as the adventure he's tied to and typically only features for a fraction of it; make the adventure good before trying to get his stats nailed down.

[KorvinStarmast]

I'm thinking I want to create a BBEG that is, as per the title, the ultimate manipulator and collector of secrets. He knows the most intimate desires and fears of your soul, and will use that knowledge to scheme, torture, tempt, hurt you.
An aboleth and a nothic seem to be a good start for your template.

Probing Telepathy. If a creature communicates telepathically with the aboleth, the aboleth lear s the creature’s greatest desires if the aboleth can see the creature. Give the aboleth a means of casting invisibility now, maybe 1/day, or given them a scrying crystal.

One of the things a lot of stories have is a magical pool that allows a priest or wizard to scry through it. It isn't portable, but is rather fixed in place in the lair of this powerful personage.

An aboleth with a scrying pool ... and IMO aboleth's make for some creepy BBEG's.

[Feddlefew]

I'm seconding the aboleth angle- but I would also give your BBEG an army of rats, birds, and other critters that they can use to collect info. Scrying and detect thoughts are good, but what a master of secrets and manipulation needs is a plausible way to constantly keep an eyes and ears on their entire domain. If you also equip them with Geas to supplement their natural thrall abilities you could add weaker NPCs- including quest givers and merchants- into the mix.

[dehro]

great ideas all around...
and I'm going to name him Carol, now

[iTreeby]

Priest of a secret God with a withered mummified hand and/or dead eye?

[Wizard_Lizard]

either a divination wizard, or he has a pet mindwitness, OR he has spies, lots of gnomish gninja spies, who hide evrrywhere, from trees to vases. My favourite is the las tone.

[Temperjoke]

Some things you might want to think about:

Why? What is this BBEG's plan? Why is he obsessed with possessing secrets, to the extent that he gets known for collecting secrets? I mean, on it's own, collecting secrets is something that makes for a good side NPC that players need to get information from that is a crucial piece of the plotline, not necessarily a bad guy on it's own.

Also, secrets only stay secret when a minimal amount of people know them, and can share them. So if this BBEG has informants feeding them information, then those informants likely end up dead on a semi-regular basis, once they've learned too much. This could also open up a way for the party to discover his existence, a bunch of people have been discovered to have been killed in the same manner.

If the BBEG is a mortal, then I would give him some sort of artifact that contains his information, like a throne he sits in, cause that's potentially a lot more information than a mortal mind could handle.

[Beleriphon]

Depending on how you want to roll you can make this guy like Hermaeus Mora.