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FabulousFizban
2019-08-27, 09:38 PM
what should the breakup of infantry to archers to cavalry be?

EDIT: the castle itself is fairly large, 4 stories & i want to say 60’ to a side... maybe a bit more. It is a time of peace, but the castle town (a large town) is on the frontier at a strategically important location; basically it’s a border fortress. lots of frontier traffic coming and going between neighboring kingdoms, primarily elves (trade goes up and down a nearby river). finally, yes, the garrison acts as a police force for the town itself.

as to the terrain. the castle town sits in between a river on the west, and the foothills of a mountain range on the east. south lies a part of the kingdom in between the mountains and river. due west (across the river) is a large forrest that is the domain of elves. northwest is a lake that is the source of the river - home to a different group of elves. northeast - east of the lake, is a wasteland - home to monsters and other things.

Pauly
2019-08-27, 09:48 PM
How big is the castle?
Is it a time of war or a time of peace?
How big is the town?
Are the soldiers expected to act as a quasi police force (the ubiquitous generic town guard in most fantasy settings) or are they purely the defenders of the castle?

Historically castles usually only had very few defenders. Most smaller castles had garrisons in the range of 20 to 30 men. Even with small garrisons castles could withstand extended sieges

Inchhighguy
2019-08-27, 09:52 PM
The most generic arrison would be half(two fourths) infantry, a fourth archers and a fourth cavalry.

Though this would also be diffrent for each place. A Lot of places, for example might not even have any cavalry. Some places might be all infantry.

TheYell
2019-08-27, 11:00 PM
Well the good news is that by Western standards you have a lot of freedom of action to plan it how you like.

The bad news, is, our sources at any given place or time vary, so there's not one right answer to your question.

Late Western medieval battles tended to be organized into lances, with each lord bringing so many lances to the war with him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lances_fournies

you could plausibly say that a baron was gifted the duty of garrisoning the town, so he showed up with his field force of five or ten lances, being so many knights, with say 3 archers to a knight, and maybe 5 infantry per knight, and then he figured he had to hire locals out of the town as infantry for town patrols.

but I doubt anybody could prove you do it wrong however you like to do it, unless you ascribe it to a particular historical lord.

denthor
2019-08-27, 11:00 PM
60 foot wall man every 10 feet should man them 24 in total. Archers

Water should have 5 men per shift 4 shifts 20 more.

1st 2nd level men should be the majority 2 each

5th man should 3rd or 4th

44 men 8 men 3rd or 4th leaving 35 1st or 2nd

1 captain 6th fighter

Clerics 6. 1man 7th level 2 men 5th 3 1st level

Mages all independent 8 total 1 5th 3 3rd 4 2nd

At least 1 bard

So I have 59 total.

Plus party.

Incorrect
2019-08-28, 07:32 AM
As a trade town, I would argument that it would be on the wealthy side. Therefore I would give all soldiers horses, and weapons for both melee and ranged. (also give them a way to communicate, maybe color-coded fireworks)
Half would be primarily ranged, and half primarily melee.

They would patrol around the countryside to keep the traders safe. The objective is to crush all bandits, and scout for enemy advances.
In the city, they would also patrol on horseback. Giving them an advantage in visibility and speed. But be ready to quickly dismount if needed.

In the event of an attack the role of the soldiers would be constant hit and run tactics outside the city to delay the enemy. Meanwhile, riders are sent to all allies for help.
If an attack is at the front door, they can fight from the castle, but in that case the city is already lost.

How many?
We dedicate 1 floor of the castle to sleeping quarters.
20x20meters=400
Each bed+personal belongings+space to move=4 -> 100
bunkbeds to duble that=200 beds
account for Misc = 150 common soldiers

Example breakdown of shifts
5 patrols of 10 soldiers guarding the countryside in the daytime
20 soldiers guarding the castle daytime
15 patrols of 2 soldiers in the town in daytime
=100

20 soldiers guarding the castle at night
10 patrols of 3 soldiers in the town at night.
=50

A more precise way of calculating would be to look a the tasks that needed to be done, but there is no way for us to know about that.

Jay R
2019-08-28, 07:57 AM
Enough to defeat the average raid or assault, but not enough to beat the enemies coming when the PCs are there.

So the question has to do with the size of nearby rivals, the prevalence of nearby monsters, and the ability of the land to support them.

The number will be far less than most modern people suppose.

Berenger
2019-08-28, 08:10 AM
As a rule of thumb: in a medieval setting, you can have approximately between 0.5 and 1 % of the total population as professional full-time warriors (soldiers, knights, paladins etc.). This may increase to 2 % if you make military strength a top priority of that society, but it will hurt prosperity unless made up by unusually high revenues, for example by taxing that trade route. These men will be split between the castle, watchtowers in strategic locations and (if applicable) the fortified manors of individual knights.

Additionally, you can have between 10% and 30% of the total population as militia. In a town, these would mostly be the members of craftsman guilds, equipped with crossbows, pikes and armor. In the countryside, these would mostly be archers. Obviously, this only works if the lord of the castle can trust his subjects and vice versa, otherwise this is a recipe for disaster and rebellion. A certain amount of poaching is to be expected.

Additionally, there can be mercenaries from abroad. Their numbers will vary heavily depending on military needs and the available wealth that can be spent on them.

I don't think that you want that many heavy cavalry or horses in general. You mentioned a river, foothills, forests and a large lake as prominent terrain features, none of them lend themselves well to cavalry tactics. If the lake and river are navigable, a lot of the trade will be going by boat, which in turn means that your soldiers may need boats for combat, mobility and to act as escorts against river pirates. On land, the terrain is well suited to guerilla warfare. If the enemy comes in force, a mix of delaying and harassment in the woods and along the river crossings or in the mountains combined with a retreat to the walled town and the castle (combined with sorties by boat, the enemy will have trouble bringing enough boats to control the lake) sounds like a good tactic to hold out until reinforcements from the heartlands arrive. In short, I'd expect a lot of infantry and an unusually high percentage of archers and crossbowmen.

redwizard007
2019-08-28, 08:19 AM
what should the breakup of infantry to archers to cavalry be?

EDIT: the castle itself is fairly large, 4 stories & i want to say 60’ to a side... maybe a bit more. It is a time of peace, but the castle town (a large town) is on the frontier at a strategically important location; basically it’s a border fortress. lots of frontier traffic coming and going between neighboring kingdoms, primarily elves (trade goes up and down a nearby river). finally, yes, the garrison acts as a police force for the town itself.

as to the terrain. the castle town sits in between a river on the west, and the foothills of a mountain range on the east. south lies a part of the kingdom in between the mountains and river. due east is a large forrest that is the domain of elves. northwest is a lake the is the source of the river - home to a different group of elves. northeast - east of the lake, is a wasteland - home to monsters and other things.

It seems that the town is a trading hub on a well traveled border region. That means it is probably the home of an earl or marquis, or would if this was late medieval europe. As such, there will be a small number of knights with their full retinue as well as a number of full time men at arms.

In peace time the garrison would be kept as small as possible. So what is the garrison required to do? Probably a handful of riders watching over the trade routes each day that may ride in to town at night or be quartered with outlying farmers. Two patrols of 2 men each would probably be stationed around the gate, and possibly market. A mounted "quick response unit" of 4-8 men at arms would probably be available, but would be stationed in the castle courtyard until needed. They would double as reinforcements for the town patrols and watchmen. Four to 6 men on the castle wall including the gate. Thats about 20. In addition, the earl is a knight and may have adult sons who are also knights, as well as noble teens who are squiring in his service. Visiting nobles with retinue of their own can boost that number higher, as can a town militia (in times of war.)

All men at arms would be armed with a melee option and might carry a ranged option as well. Dedicated archers would be more likely drawn from the militia. All the men at arms would be able to fight as infantry, dragoons, or cavalry. You wouldn't have dedicated soldiers for each role.

In short, call it 25-30 combatants, but spread over a significant area. Arm them as necessary for their assigned tasks. Now call it a day.

a_flemish_guy
2019-08-28, 09:58 AM
also the traders and craftsmen themselves wouldn't likely to be helpless civilians

they likely form militias which would vastly outnumber the regular soldiers, if this is a wealthy town then they're likely nearly or just as well armed and armored as soldiers

Beleriphon
2019-08-28, 04:58 PM
I really like the suggestion of organizing the soldiers into lances. If we assume a lance is a mounted knight, a mounted retainer, a few foot soldiers or archers and an armed squire. So maybe ten men total per lance, and a we'd reasonably end up with the say 10 lances in the city and surrounding area for 10 knights, 10 retainers, 10 squires, and the rest are around seventy to eighty other men armed as either infantry or archers. I'd assume 2:3 ratio archer to infantry, so around 30 archers and around 40 infantry.

Pauly
2019-08-28, 07:43 PM
what should the breakup of infantry to archers to cavalry be?

EDIT: the castle itself is fairly large, 4 stories & i want to say 60’ to a side... maybe a bit more. It is a time of peace, but the castle town (a large town) is on the frontier at a strategically important location; basically it’s a border fortress. lots of frontier traffic coming and going between neighboring kingdoms, primarily elves (trade goes up and down a nearby river). finally, yes, the garrison acts as a police force for the town itself.

as to the terrain. the castle town sits in between a river on the west, and the foothills of a mountain range on the east. south lies a part of the kingdom in between the mountains and river. due west (across the river) is a large forrest that is the domain of elves. northwest is a lake that is the source of the river - home to a different group of elves. northeast - east of the lake, is a wasteland - home to monsters and other things.

The castle is, by European standards, fairly small. Equivalent local castle of a minor noble. We’re not talking about a major royal castle or the castle of a significant lord. The permanent garrison would only be 25 to 30 men or so. As professional garrison soldiers they would be trained as both archers and infantry. There would be small handful of cavalry. The lord, a knight, maybe the lord’s son and the knight’s squire. So 1 or 2 fully trained and equipped knights and 2 or 3 trainees with lesser equipment.
Their main role will be to deal with bandits and maybe an occasional wandering monster.

As others have discussed there would be a militia that holds regular training which will supplement the garrison in times of war. As a border town the militia will be treated more seriously than usual. So you would expect all the able bodied male citizens in the town to have at least nominal military training and at least 10% to be trained to adequate soldier level.


That takes care of the military requirements.

For policing and the town guard.
Modern US cities average roughly 15-20 police officers for every 10,000 inhabitants. Some cities with mire enthusiastic local criminals like New York, Miami, Baltimore and Chicago have 40-50 officers for every 10,000 inhabitants.

The town you describe seems fairly peaceful, but because of the large number of traders the police element would probably be about average. If there was a sudden spike of criminal activity a posse of deputies can be organized from the militia. If there was ongoing violent criminal activity in the town then a higher number of officers per 10,000 inhabitants would be justified.

Taking into account the fantasy trope of a patrol of guards being at least 4 or 5 strong rather than the single officers (this is despite historically police patrols usually being single officers or at most a pair of officers) you could multiply the number of guardsmen per 10,000 inhabitants by 4 to get to a “fantasy reasonable” as opposed to “historically accurate” number of guardsmen.

The policing requirements are in addition to the military requirements. The military requirement needs to be able to respond instantaneously, which can’t be done if they’re wandering around somewhere inside the town.

Berenger
2019-08-29, 03:16 AM
That is, if you want a profession police force. There actually was no such institution until the early modern age, the "city watch" including nightwatchmen, guards at the city gate etc. consists of members of the militia which act as such on a rotating monthly schedule and criminals are apprehended by all able-bodied citizens after the hue and cry is sounded.

Misereor
2019-08-29, 06:00 AM
what should the breakup of infantry to archers to cavalry be?

EDIT: the castle itself is fairly large, 4 stories & i want to say 60’ to a side... maybe a bit more. It is a time of peace, but the castle town (a large town) is on the frontier at a strategically important location; basically it’s a border fortress. lots of frontier traffic coming and going between neighboring kingdoms, primarily elves (trade goes up and down a nearby river). finally, yes, the garrison acts as a police force for the town itself.

as to the terrain. the castle town sits in between a river on the west, and the foothills of a mountain range on the east. south lies a part of the kingdom in between the mountains and river. due west (across the river) is a large forrest that is the domain of elves. northwest is a lake that is the source of the river - home to a different group of elves. northeast - east of the lake, is a wasteland - home to monsters and other things.

Consider the relevant factors:

Size of population.
If by large town you mean something between 1000-3000 people, you can get by with as little as a dozen full time peace keepers, depending on how stable the area is, and if there is a militia that can be called up. Add another dozen for the small castle. Equipped mostly with light armor and polearms, and a few missile weapons kept in the castle. No professional archers though, and the rest are probably not all that skilled. A garrison of this size depends on being able to call on assistance from elsewhere.

Strategically important location.
Important to whom? The local Baron? The King? The Emperor? You can add a hundred professional soldiers, or you can add entire legions. They are here to protect the strategic location and project force if necessary. A strong scout contingent, likely mounted, is also mandatory. Trade centres often grow up around these locations, as they are safe to operate in and have good transportation networks.

On a trade route.
Add road wardens. 10-50 light-medium cavalry, depending on what threat they supposed to counter and with what frequency. The scouts mentioned above may already cover this variable.

Near the border.
Minimum requirements just went up. If it is a quiet border, you could add another dozen full time soldiers. If it is a hostile border, a few hundred. Again, if there is already a sizable garrison because of the strategic location, they may already cover this variable. There may also be some kind of military police to keep the troops in order. Depending on how fantastic your campaign is, these may vary from regular troopers with colored armbands, to groups of Centaur archers specifically hired for this purpose. When on campaign these may act as an elite strike force, or they may be completely useless due to systemic incompetence.


Force composition.
If I had to contend with Elves, I would choose equipment that offered protection from arrows. If mobility was required, I might go with light armor and Pavise shields with slits for missile weapons. This force would be reasonably cheap and easily replenished, which would be of considerable advantage, as an even loss ratio against Elves might not be likely. Purely as a GM, I would also use crossbows instead of bows, to create more of a contrast with the Elves.

If the main threat was from big, stupid monsters, I would attack from a distance with missile weapons and have something to finish them off with. E.g. light cavalry with bows and lances. Infantry could use long polearms to lessen the impact of reach, and whatever missile weapons are good for penetrating thick hides in your rule system. If this rather than Elves was the main threat, I would as a GM add flavor in how the Elves taught them to use these tactics, instead of the "crossbows for contrast" thing.

The general idea being that tradition is real. Equipment and force composition is never chosen randomly, and if you end up with something that is completely mismatched with the threat encountered, it is likely because of tradition (fighting the last war).

jjordan
2019-08-29, 07:43 AM
Lots of good advice on this thread. Historically you kept as few military forces on hand as you could get away with. This was largely a logistical consideration, soldiers earned as much as master craftsmen and didn't directly contribute to the economy. They were expensive. Historically, however, they didn't have to deal with marauding bands of goblins, orcs, gnolls, and other fantasy creatures. Fantasy settings also tend to have a lot more available coin in circulation.

In one of my settings I've got the town of Nordbourg. It's on the northern border of the Eisenreich. It borders a lush forest that has a lot of active creatures and the logging activities of the town put them into conflict with the forest and its denizens. To the North of the forest are orcs in an enormous range of volcanic mountains and beyond that are elves. To the East is a rival kingdom that was once part of the Empire. But there are a few towns and a lot of territory in between them and the rival Kingdom is expanding through population migration, not military efforts.

This town is owned and ruled by a Lord (a member of the nearly vestigial nobility of the Empire). He maintains a force of 10 sergeants (professional infantrymen) each of whom has one or two pages (the equivalent of a squire) learning the trade. He rents legislative rights to the town and requires them to pay for the sergeants. He also requires some of the guilds to maintain a militia. These units have required drill periods and they provide men to act as gate guards and night watch under the leadership of the sergeants. Most of what they do is assist the clerks who tally the timber loads being sent South to the Capital. The Lord pays for an additional militia force of 40 men (and women) who are tasked with defending the keep. They are a little more professional and don't do general gate and watch duties. The roads (and river) South is patrolled by the Carters as a matter of self-interest. The Empire runs a twenty man mounted patrol up and down the road once a week. This force is tasked with keeping an eye on the troublemaker Lord of Nordbourg as much as anything else and he is required to provide them with quarters and support in the keep.

So, a town of about 1,800 adults (add twice that number for children under the age of 15). 10 full time sergeants. ~15 apprentice sergeants. Militia units ranging in size from 10-20 men with a total muster of ~130 men. Plus the Imperial Cavalry patrol of 20 mounted men that may or may not be in town at the time. There are a few foresters/rangers who pick up extra coin for reporting goings on in the forest and the loggers are expected to defend themselves on the job. The loggers hire extra muscle as needed to deal with threats and the carters hire security to patrol the cart park outside the walls at night and some of the drinking establishments hire bouncers.

This is a lot of force when compared to a historical model, but makes sense in the fantasy circumstances.

TheYell
2019-08-31, 12:53 PM
If you add in a militia, I'd point out that historically, places that weren't wrung to the last penny to support knights (looking at you, France) could develop highly competent and specialized militias, like Swiss pikemen, Genoese crossbowmen, or English yeoman. But it's realistically incompatible with a knight-heavy force.

Your town sounds like it could have some fun with irregular forces. You're on a river and lake, so you could have longboats of marines fighting like Vikings. You could have rangers going into the wasteland and the Elf forest.

If I were to make one change to your plan, your majesty...have a big wall around the town. Now it threatens the river with archers, and is a hard nut to crack. The castle you mention becomes just a keep of a fortification of the whole town, with a large bare field next to it, within the town, for camping more forces and drills.

sktarq
2019-08-31, 06:47 PM
One of the questions that springs to my mind:

How much force needs to be projected from this location?

The above have the defensive/town guard stuff well in hand and won't repeat

But while the castle is obviously responsible for the town and backing the town guard, how many villages, homesteads, market thorps etc surround this area that need patrols or call ins? If it undeveloped how does the town import food and who guards/escorts this key weakness?

How much of the trade route is the castle responsible for? And how under threat is it?
Basically how many patrols to hold the route need to be sent out from here? And if quite a few are needed in the whole area this castle would likely be a key support/training/reinforcement centre.

How much force needs to be projected at that boarder? A few customs officers? That and few watchtowers/patrols? Because they will likely use the casle as an HQ, equipment depot, etc for such things if you need significant numbers. Customs & watchtowers & patrols & counter raiders/raiders? Now quite significant numbers are being added-prolly double. Now are drawing military support/demographic numbers from elsewhere in the political territory most likely.


And in general...how bad are the issues of local bandits/orcs/etc...boarder tensions? Boarder raids?...trade route theft (since some goods pull more attacks figuring out what they are carrying may be helpful) etc? If it mostly peaceful it is far less than if the region is boiling with orcs and the threat of war

AMFV
2019-08-31, 06:59 PM
250,000 at a minimum.

Joking aside, the biggest factor in how many soldiers a particular area is going to have is really government. If the government needs a lot of soldiers to maintain order and control, they'll make more soldiers even if the population is starving. If the government is relatively isolated during peacetime, they'll have less, even if that means they might have to mobilize quite rapidly in a time of war. The number of soldiers that you can effectively lead and logistically manage is going to be your controlling factor. In a typical medieval feudal system that might be one percent of the population, but there are other places where that's been much higher, or cultural places where that was drastically higher because of culture and government. Also if you have your soldiers doing other things you can have more of them. The Romans used early soldiers as farmers (until they were supplanted by slaves) and later on used them for construction purposes. This allowed them to have a bigger army because they weren't pulling the men away from that part of society (at least not till much later). In World War 2, Germany, they would call up reserves and then return them to their factory jobs when Blitzkrieg was done (that's a modern example, but it's telling), being able to use your soldiers in less of a military capacity allows for a larger army.

Tvtyrant
2019-08-31, 10:34 PM
what should the breakup of infantry to archers to cavalry be?

EDIT: the castle itself is fairly large, 4 stories & i want to say 60’ to a side... maybe a bit more. It is a time of peace, but the castle town (a large town) is on the frontier at a strategically important location; basically it’s a border fortress. lots of frontier traffic coming and going between neighboring kingdoms, primarily elves (trade goes up and down a nearby river). finally, yes, the garrison acts as a police force for the town itself.

as to the terrain. the castle town sits in between a river on the west, and the foothills of a mountain range on the east. south lies a part of the kingdom in between the mountains and river. due west (across the river) is a large forrest that is the domain of elves. northwest is a lake that is the source of the river - home to a different group of elves. northeast - east of the lake, is a wasteland - home to monsters and other things.

I would probably do it like this:
1 Lord
5 housecarls (or whatever your era's version of bodyguards/the lords gang), they have horses and armor.
10-15 guardsmen for the castle, no horses but they all have some form of metal armor, crossbow, shield and arming sword.

The two has a watch and a militia as well. These answer to the town's mayor, who answers to the Lord. The watch guards the town walls and enforces some basic order in the town. There are 20 of them, they have crossbows and pikes/halberds with leather jerkins and a helmet.

The militia are made up of the town men who are property owners. They have a halberd and a leather helmet each. There are 50 militiamen on the books, but only 20 in good enough shape to be worth anything.

That brings the forces up to close to sixty, with 20 in the castle itself. Another 20 have night jobs as well as their dayjobs as guards, and another 20 have day jobs with obligations to show up when called.

Quarian Rex
2019-09-01, 03:43 AM
When looking at this kind of thing in a D&D context you really have to throw real world comparisons out the window. Comparisons to medieval standards (or worse, modern ones) are useless when you have a world filled with magic and monsters. In our world the main threat is ourselves (animals are usually scared off relatively easily) and we needed a lot of us to be any real threat. Armies and the like had a hard time sneaking up on anyone, could be seen coming, needed time to set up, etc., giving time to let a smaller defense force call on allies and such.

In D&D random encounters don't spend days setting up siege towers (hells, ogres are siege engines). They can show up out of nowhere and reduce the peasantry to a blood smeared puddle before the end of the surprise round. A community without proper defenses would not be there for long. To that end I would have to say that most communities would be walled and have a disproportionately large defense force, regardless of what you might think the economic disadvantages might be. Patrols should be based on what the nastiest thing coming out of the local woods has been. If it takes 10 guardsmen to reliably take down a dire wolf then sending out less than that on patrol would be suicidal, and a wise commander would send out double to ensure success and minimize casualties.

This might mean that the standing army might all be part-time craftsmen (something that can keep them close to the castle/ready for action) to provide some productivity as well as time to recover from injuries and such. Note that this would be quite different from conscription (commoners/experts with some weapon/armor proficiencies) in that they would be soldiers first and foremost (warrior/fighter with some points in craft). Remember too that the normal requirements for manpower to sustain a community may not hold up in D&D-land. When more wheat is only a successful Profession (Farmer) check away you may not need 80-90% of your population in the field. A magical world has effects after all.

GloatingSwine
2019-09-01, 05:06 AM
For policing and the town guard.

...

The policing requirements are in addition to the military requirements. The military requirement needs to be able to respond instantaneously, which can’t be done if they’re wandering around somewhere inside the town.

The thing to realise is that there would likely not be any formally instituted policing/town guard.

What there would probably be is an informal volunteer organisation of concerned individuals who regarded it as their role to "keep the peace" (and probably quite a lot of that is just making sure outsiders don't cause trouble).

Most "law" would be a strictly local affair handled internally within given communities, probably with a lot of overlapping sets of rules and responsibilities between stuff handled by family and community, stuff handled by guilds and professions, and very occasionally something the Reeve has to be bothered with because it's starting to affect tax revenue now.

Pauly
2019-09-01, 09:43 PM
The thing to realise is that there would likely not be any formally instituted policing/town guard.

What there would probably be is an informal volunteer organisation of concerned individuals who regarded it as their role to "keep the peace" (and probably quite a lot of that is just making sure outsiders don't cause trouble).

Most "law" would be a strictly local affair handled internally within given communities, probably with a lot of overlapping sets of rules and responsibilities between stuff handled by family and community, stuff handled by guilds and professions, and very occasionally something the Reeve has to be bothered with because it's starting to affect tax revenue now.

That’s the correct historical answer. The OP states that this is trope fantasy town where the garrison acts as the police force.

Keltest
2019-09-01, 10:35 PM
That’s the correct historical answer. The OP states that this is trope fantasy town where the garrison acts as the police force.

This doesn't necessarily significantly change the answer. Medieval towns were significantly smaller both in area and population than modern towns of equivalent perceived proportions. For example, the population of London in the 12th century was less than half the population of the relatively small college town I live in today (not counting weekend visitors). Paris, the largest city in Christian Europe at the time, was only about twice as big as said college town. Adding in an extra dozen or so foot soldiers, perhaps less heavily armed for daily patrols, to be available should a crisis arise is not outlandishly low.

Incorrect
2019-09-02, 02:32 AM
High fantasy setting.
For defense, you need 2 guys.
One for nights, and one for days (or 1 who doesnt sleep)
Their job is to activate the magical beacon if the town is attacked.
Upon activation of the beacon, the High Wizard of the country is alerted and teleports himself or a number of his simulacrums to deal with the problem using overwhelming force.

Large band of ogres attacking the town?
Twelve seconds later, a handful of ancient dragons shows up and melts them.


Then you just need to solve town watch and road patrols.

PersonMan
2019-09-02, 04:46 AM
In D&D random encounters don't spend days setting up siege towers (hells, ogres are siege engines). They can show up out of nowhere and reduce the peasantry to a blood smeared puddle before the end of the surprise round.

I'd disagree here. Unless you assume that 'random encounters' just appear out of nowhere and immediately attack whatever's closest, they won't just suddenly appear at the gates. There'll be areas known for being dangerous, ones with groups that are less likely to be violent (say, ogres who are happy to sit where they are and occasionally trade because having properly-made swords and shields let them beat back any other ogres who would otherwise try to get their stuff) and both will be relatively known factors. If monsters just spawn in and kill people with no warning, then you don't get heavily fortified settlements, you don't get any settlements because there's no advantage to being settled when monsters appear out of nowhere all the time.

Quarian Rex
2019-09-02, 09:05 AM
I'd disagree here. Unless you assume that 'random encounters' just appear out of nowhere and immediately attack whatever's closest, they won't just suddenly appear at the gates. There'll be areas known for being dangerous, ones with groups that are less likely to be violent (say, ogres who are happy to sit where they are and occasionally trade because having properly-made swords and shields let them beat back any other ogres who would otherwise try to get their stuff) and both will be relatively known factors. If monsters just spawn in and kill people with no warning, then you don't get heavily fortified settlements, you don't get any settlements because there's no advantage to being settled when monsters appear out of nowhere all the time.


Yeah, you're taking that a little too literally, methinks. I'm thinking of random encounters as being shorthand for the world being full of horrible and violent things that want you and yours dead, insert motivations and backgrounds as needed (the way I assume they were intended). Default D&D kinda assumes a world full of immediate dangers in need of brave adventurers to save it, and I think that towns should reflect that.

Can your campaign take place within a pacified domain where the standard encounters of a random variety are things like a lone ogre looking to haggle, or a group of orcs looking to build latrines for a nearby peaceful village in a manner that has the least impact on the pristine natural environment? Well, yes, I suppose you could. Though I would argue that those would be odd plot hooks or campaign window dressing by the DM and not any kind of actual random encounter (no danger, no conflict, no chance for xp, etc.). I have played in campaigns like that and I did not enjoy it. There never seemed to be a need for the PCs, elements of conflict were either political (the standard for this type of setting) or seemed distractingly arbitrary.

Besides, OP did mention that there was a monster infested wasteland to the northeast. If that is to have any meaning then monsters are spewing out of it and probably looking to take the local weak link, the town in question. The minimum patrol should be based on what they have seen come out of those wastes (as I mentioned in my above post) and the size of the town guard should be based around that, with town defenses (walls, etc.) based on that as well. These are the sort of things that need to be taken into account when you care about having a setting that has internal consistency and shows why the local town hasn't fallen to the first random encounter that wandered too close.

To be clear, no DM actually has to care about this kind of stuff, it is all a matter of DM preference. There are tables that lean hard on the tropes and don't care about the details and that is fine. The OP apparently cares about the details and I think additional details like this can bring a lot to the table.

Coidzor
2019-09-03, 06:34 PM
How much of a duty is it for the military force in the town to patrol the borders? If they patrol them, how actively do they patrol them and how hazardous is this for them to do in peacetime, given that there's a monster area nearby?

How are relations between the kingdom and the groups of elves they border?

It sounds like the town and its surrounding farmland are going to be particularly vulnerable to being cut off from the kingdom if the elves are capable of denying them access to the river, since the town is essentially, on a peninsula between the mountains and the river leaving a relatively narrow stretch of easily traversed land connecting them to the rest of the kingdom. That might factor into things to some extent.

a_flemish_guy
2019-09-05, 01:31 PM
also if the town is a trade post then there's very likely 2 outposts a day's march away in both directions with their own garrisons who can form a relief force when notified

FabulousFizban
2019-09-05, 02:51 PM
How much of a duty is it for the military force in the town to patrol the borders? If they patrol them, how actively do they patrol them and how hazardous is this for them to do in peacetime, given that there's a monster area nearby?

How are relations between the kingdom and the groups of elves they border?

monsters from the waste are generally unorganized and handled readily by patrols, the terrain gives the kingdom the advantage in repelling enemies. Larger threats from the region would constitute a session for the PCs.

Relations with the neighboring elf kingdoms in the north are generally good, though much better and more active with the lake elves who constitute the region's largest trading partner. The wood elves are far more reclusive, but friendly, with their capital being in the foothills far to the west in the deepest part of the forest, which is itself fairly wild.

Something I hadn't stated before that I guess I will now, is that the northern region was incorporated into the southern kingdom after losing a war about 150 years ago. Politically, consider the north like 18th century Scotland: a part of the larger nation, but resentful of the fact. The Duke of Castle Town's knights are a composite of his own northern nobles, and loyalist nobles from the capital in the south there to keep an eye on things.


also if the town is a trade post then there's very likely 2 outposts a day's march away in both directions with their own garrisons who can form a relief force when notified

this is a great idea and hadn't occurred to me. adding this to my game notes. "My Lord, we haven't received a response from the forward outpost!" "Send the PCs to investigate!"

TheYell
2019-09-05, 05:33 PM
Something I hadn't stated before that I guess I will now, is that the northern region was incorporated into the southern kingdom after losing a war about 150 years ago. Politically, consider the north like 18th century Scotland: a part of the larger nation, but resentful of the fact. The Duke of Castle Town's knights are a composite of his own nobles, and loyalist nobles from the capital in the south.


Then I'd put two contrary but plausible theories for a militia

1. Forbidden outright. All the arms-bearers in the town are castle garrison. Larger proportion of dismounted infantry to archers, because the main enemy of the garrison IS the town. Maybe 8 infantry :1 archer. The infantry are billeted in groups of 3 throughout the town, quartered with richer families or innkeepers. Archers and knights muster in the castle itself, to keep it secure from the rabble.

2. Crack infantry. THEY didn't resent the war, because they still fight abroad in their own colors. Yon Southron lords didn't bring any infantry with them, because they use local infantry (squads of 5 sword & board fighters with a corporal halberd-bearer and a bard piper, called "hands"..."a hand of lads") for the job. Castle garrison is all mounted knights, or mounted with support like archers and crossbowmen, maybe 8:1 knight.

Pauly
2019-09-06, 01:37 AM
There definitely would be large “national” castles with large garrisons of troops from the South in the area. Maybe not in a day or two’s march but definitely within one week’s march there would probably be 2 such castles. Ready to take charge if things got out of hand.

The national government, while respecting the need for local castles would definitely frown on them getting too large or taking on too many responsibilities. The national government wants the castle to be strong enough to handle local matters but not so formidable that it would be power center in the event of a revolt.