Best class for giants belt

[Scarytincan]

So let's say you have a big party with one of each class and a belt of fire giant strength drops. Typically the go to assumption is one of the stereotypically strength primary classes (fighter barb pally).

I posit that a monk would actually be the best contender, at least most of the time. At level 20 sure a fighter will catch up in number of attacks, but one of the biggest complaints /homebrew item fixes for monks from what I see tends to be lack of ways to empower unarmed attacks, no handwraps or brass knuckles etc. But functionally that's exactly what a giant belt works as for a monk, as long as it's above 21 str, compared to maxed dex. Additionally it would generally result in a HUGE jump in the monks ability to grapple compared to typical starting strength, on a class that typically would otherwise synergize well with grappling and thematically wants to be a great grappler. And lastly and probably least important tho still relevant, increase a monk's jumping ability which for most classes is already much more gated due to only so much available movement, and monks thrive on mobility.

Thoughts/considerations I am missing?

Edit to add: with these in mind, how would you rank a giants belt compared to other monk item options?

[Reevh]

I think the increase in hit chance afforded by the strength would synergize well with great weapon master, making it much more universally usable. So you'd get the benefit of both consistent GWM attacks and the extra damage from the STR. I'd be more likely to want to give it to a character that makes use of GWM.

[Nidgit]

Personally I think the best class for a belt of strength is the Paladin, as it frees them up to focus more on Cha investment and feats. It's good for a Barbarian too, of course, but loses some shine if you go all the way to the Barbarian capstone. Despite the extra attacks, I think it's a bit less valuable for Fighters since they're so much less MAD.

You definitely make a good point for Monks, though! A belt of strength also gives them more opportunity to benefit from a 1 level dip in Barbarian for the Rage bonus too. It would also work well for a melee Rogue, especially a grappling one.

[Scarytincan]

I think the increase in hit chance afforded by the strength would synergize well with great weapon master, making it much more universally usable. So you'd get the benefit of both consistent GWM attacks and the extra damage from the STR. I'd be more likely to want to give it to a character that makes use of GWM.

Valid.


Personally I think the best class for a belt of strength is the Paladin, as it frees them up to focus more on Cha investment and feats. It's good for a Barbarian too, of course, but loses some shine if you go all the way to the Barbarian capstone. Despite the extra attacks, I think it's a bit less valuable for Fighters since they're so much less MAD.

You definitely make a good point for Monks, though! A belt of strength also gives them more opportunity to benefit from a 1 level dip in Barbarian for the Rage bonus too. It would also work well for a melee Rogue, especially a grappling one.

Ya, I see a lot of pallys max cha first anyway. I think it certainly makes that choice easier for sure. On the other hand, losing items is a thing in some games, and anti magic areas /beholders, so doesn't ALWAYS free up feats. Ymmv on this one I suppose.

OK so how about how you all think a giants belt compares to other monk item options with these considerations in mind?

[rlc]

I could see an argument for a monk, or even a rogue.
I could also see it as an epic boon for a barbarian, if it upgrades to the next giant automatically, buy you might need to remove the attunement requirement.
Edit: probably better for a barbarian that multiclassed.

[jas61292]

I think the biggest question with something like this is "do you know you are getting it in advance?"

Obviously a strength based fighter or paladin will always love it, but if their Strength is already at 18 or 20, they are certainly not getting as much benefit out of it as the Monk, as the power and accuracy boost will be the same or similar for both, but the Monk is also getting a far greater increase in everything else strength related. That said, if you somehow know in advance that the item is going to drop, you could easily build a Fighter or Paladin or whatnot that makes far better use of it by putting all their stat points in secondary or tertiary abilities.

[Blood of Gaea]

Samurai Fighter can toss out a stupid amount of attacks at higher levels, and with Great Weapon Master they'll be absolutely devastating.

Other builds really like them due to being gishes who can't easily focus on their attack stat, like Arcana Cleric tanks and Conquest Paladins.

[Scarytincan]

Ya I guess even tho there's times you might not benefit from the belt or it could get stolen, having that option to open up builds can add a lot of benefit to the usual suspects

[Kane0]

Barbarian isn't a primary candidate as they only use STR and will be bumping it regardless, plus their capstone doesn't play well with the item.
Fighter isn't a primary candidate as they are also mostly SAD and get extra ASIs
Ranger and Rogue won't typically be using STR so they aren't the best pick either
Bards, Clerics, Druids, Sorcerers, Wizards won't be using STR as their primary function so they wouldn't be first pick.
Warlocks that would be using it to attack would probably be Hexblade and thus using CHA, so they're out too.

That leaves Monks and Paladins, both of which are MAD and don't get extra ASIs. Of the two I would pick the Paladin as they are more likely to prioritize STR over DEX unlike your average Monk.

[GlenSmash!]

Barbarian isn't a primary candidate as they only use STR and will be bumping it regardless, plus their capstone doesn't play well with the item.

I play a lot of Barbarians and on any one of them I would love to have a Belt of Giant Strength because then I could focus on Con first.

Then I could actually play an Unarmored Barbarian instead of feeling like that is just a trap option while wearing Medium Armor forever and ever. This is especially true as I tend to have only 16 Strength until level 8 on account of taking GWM at level 4. Sure theoretically I will max strength eventually, but from level 4-18 I could make great use of a belt of Giant Strength.

Now I'm not saying Barbs get the most out of it, but I sure would want one. And while we're at it Gauntlets of Ogre Power, and a Hammer of Thunderbolts please.

The OP is right about monks though.

[Scarytincan]

So between a belt and a good weapon like staff of striking or something like that, which would ppl choose if they were able?

[Aett_Thorn]

I’m also going to throw out Bladesinger Wizard as well. They get proficiency in any one single martial weapon, but since they need Dex for AC anyways, it makes little sense for them to pick a non-Finesse weapon. Having a belt like this just opens up some fun RP options.

[Lunali]

Had a cleric in our party that relied primarily on spells for damage until we picked up the similar gauntlets of ogre power, turned him into something of a beast in melee as he went from a penalty to a +4.

I think the real answer is that it depends greatly on the party, increasing a bonus by one point on a character that will use it frequently might be better than increasing it by a large amount on a character that won't. On the other hand, giving it to a character that doesn't have much strength might make a significant difference in the available tactics the group can use.

[Misterwhisper]

A grappling monk.

[Nhorianscum]

So between a belt and a good weapon like staff of striking or something like that, which would ppl choose if they were able?

Belts are sorta the best item in the game by a mile for anyone who uses a weapon.

-Dex advantage with Str damage output and grapples and up to a +9 attack stat.
-Effectively eliminates MADness as a concept.
-Trading 1 atunement slot for 2+ feats is never not worth it.
-No delay on multi/dip.

[Quoz]

This one will depend on your table, but if a druid keeps the bonus in wild shape it would be absolutely bonkers. Turn into a flying creature one size smaller than the target, then grab and dash. Turn into a housefly and careen through making shove attacks and atomic wedgies. Become a housecat that even 5th level commoners will fear!

[KorvinStarmast]

I posit that a monk would actually be the best contender, at least most of the time. Monk's Jumping with step of the wind and a giant's belt would be pretty good. Not flying, but covering a lot of ground.

Grappling Rogue.

Grappling Monk.

[ThatoneGuy84]

Lots of good options.
My blade singer Wizard uses one right now, since he only have 16dex (maxed int first)
If gives him a huge net increase to his to hit/damage.

[Misterwhisper]

Monk's Jumping with step of the wind and a giant's belt would be pretty good. Not flying, but covering a lot of ground.

Grappling Rogue.

Grappling Monk.

I was thinking a grappling rogue but they would need more attacks to make it work.

[loki_ragnarock]

Valor Bards.

Fullcaster Fury? Check.
Skill Savant? Check.
Battlefield Badass? Check.

Post belt, anyway. Before they were merely "battlefield participant." But now they really can have it all!

[CheddarChampion]

If the belt magically resizes on its own to fit the weather, maybe druids can benefit?

"You choose whether your Equipment falls to the ground in your space, merges into your new form, or is worn by it. Worn Equipment functions as normal, but the DM decides whether it is practical for the new form to wear a piece of Equipment, based on the creature's shape and size. Your Equipment doesn't change size or shape to match the new form, and any Equipment that the new form can't wear must either fall to the ground or merge with it. Equipment that merges with the form has no effect until you leave the form."

I'm not sure which would be considered more specific: druid's equipment not resizing or the belt magically resizing. Hmm...

[CheddarChampion]

Unless a monk already took athletics proficiency they wouldn't be great at grappling: +5/6/whatever vs a fighter's +5 to +11 (depending on level). Most monks I've seen only take acrobatics.
I suppose the high speed of a monk would boost the usefulness of moving enemies around though.

[Scarytincan]

Valor Bards.

Fullcaster Fury? Check.
Skill Savant? Check.
Battlefield Badass? Check.

Post belt, anyway. Before they were merely "battlefield participant." But now they really can have it all!

On their own it would be cool. I'd still give it to the monk easily tho if it were between the two, as the bard will still likely be casting more often than melee, and monk gets 4 attacks.


Unless a monk already took athletics proficiency they wouldn't be great at grappling: +5/6/whatever vs a fighter's +5 to +11 (depending on level). Most monks I've seen only take acrobatics.
I suppose the high speed of a monk would boost the usefulness of moving enemies around though.

Granted. On mine I took both cuz I wanted to still have grappling as at least an option when my ki is out / make it harder to break my grapple when the stun wore off. Had an extra skill to work with due to perception from shadar kai...

[Scarytincan]

Monk's Jumping with step of the wind and a giant's belt would be pretty good. Not flying, but covering a lot of ground.

Grappling Rogue.

Grappling Monk.

My thoughts exactly hehe. Super hero jump. Also grapple and jump.


This one will depend on your table, but if a druid keeps the bonus in wild shape it would be absolutely bonkers. Turn into a flying creature one size smaller than the target, then grab and dash. Turn into a housefly and careen through making shove attacks and atomic wedgies. Become a housecat that even 5th level commoners will fear!

Hehe fun imagery, but I think most tales stick to the lose benefits ruling on that imo. Rip ant man. Might be some forms that could pull off fun shenanigans still tho...

[Scarytincan]

Open hand grapple, jump, then flurry kick straight up could be fun too hehe. Might need an extra grapple action to lift them above you first or something tho.

[Crgaston]

Unless a monk already took athletics proficiency they wouldn't be great at grappling: +5/6/whatever vs a fighter's +5 to +11 (depending on level). Most monks I've seen only take acrobatics.
I suppose the high speed of a monk would boost the usefulness of moving enemies around though.

Not doubting your experience, but for me and the tables I play at, Athletics is often the higher-priority skill, especially on Dex characters.

You're right about the Monk's mobility being an advantage. By the end of Tier 2, Monks can move enemies up walls or out onto bodies of water, drop them, and return to safety.

[Nhorianscum]

Unless a monk already took athletics proficiency they wouldn't be great at grappling: +5/6/whatever vs a fighter's +5 to +11 (depending on level). Most monks I've seen only take acrobatics.
I suppose the high speed of a monk would boost the usefulness of moving enemies around though.

I've never not taken athletics over acrobatics since athletics is actually useful. Admitedly this is because I've always banked on snagging a str booster before tier 3. (Or just in tier one when I swap from moon druid/cleric to my real char in AL)

It's never failed.

[Sigreid]

I'd give it to the fighter. First, it's a force multiplier for what he does best, which is fight. At the highest level a fighter gets the most out of any combat bonus as he gets the extra attacks (IME). Second, peeps always seem to be complaining about all the crap fighters can't do, and this would open some options ranging from super leaps to ground and pound combat maneuvers, to feats of strength that usually you'd have to get the wizard to do with spells.

[CTurbo]

I'm gonna say a grappling Lore BARD would be the best thing ever and truly unstoppable!

Belt of Giant Str + expertise in Athletics = hold enemies down and scream insults at them and using Cutting Words if they happen to pass the impossible check to break grapple.

[Derpldorf]

I've always wanted to try playing a Paladin that gets overexcited and applies their Lay on Hands with a Grapple check. The whole world shall fear when Russel Mania runs wild, even the party.

[Misterwhisper]

I've always wanted to try playing a Paladin that gets overexcited and applies their Lay on Hands with a Grapple check. The whole world shall fear when Russel Mania runs wild, even the party.

On of my friends played a rather grumpy dwarf cleric who healed people by slapping them and telling them to toughen up.