PDA

View Full Version : Eternal Wands, why arcane only?



Biggus
2019-09-13, 04:24 AM
And would anything break if they weren't?

Quertus
2019-09-13, 11:34 AM
Arcane Spellcaster already gets you most Divine spells as Arcane, and UMD lets anyone attempt to wield them.

So… it's an aesthetics thing?

Biggus
2019-09-13, 01:26 PM
What's Arcane Spellcaster? A feat?

DEMON
2019-09-13, 01:54 PM
What's Arcane Spellcaster? A feat?

I *guess* he means the Generic Spellcaster class from UA - arcane version.
That class can learn spells from the Sorcerer/Wizard, Druid and Cleric lists.

Ramza00
2019-09-13, 02:11 PM
And would anything break if they weren't?

Eternal Wands are literally the formula of Craft Wondrous Item. This is why they require Craft Wondrous Item feat instead of Craft Wand feat. The formula for Craft Wondrous Item is

Spell Level * Caster Level * 1800 gp * Uses per day as a percent. If only 2 uses per day instead of 1800 gp it is 720 gp a day for 2/5ths of 1800, 40% of 1800 is 720 gp. 1 use per day is 360, 5 uses per day is 1800

Plus 100 GP for the Rod the Eternal Wand is based around just like Weapons have a masterwork weapon cost before the 8000 gp as a +2 weapon is applied.


-----

So why is Eternal Wands it is own thing and also a different thing than Craft Wondrous Item. The answer is flavor and specifically setting flavor.

Eternal Wands first came to Eberron setting for they are a Keith Baker invention. He wanted a realm where magic is everywhere, magic is tech, arcane magic makes trains possible. While simultaneously the highest level NPC divine caster is something medium levels like casting 6th level spells max. This is the setting Keith Baker envision, magic everywhere, but low level magic, and rarely 7th, 8th, or 9th level effects. A more "heroic" e6, e8, e10, and e12 feel.

And part of this flavor for Keith Baker's setting is if its going to be tech it has to be Arcane Powered and not Divine Powered for he wanted doubt whether the gods exist, there may be divine energy, but he wanted a gritty horror / film noir / etc setting whether you should be doubtful of authority and not just take the divine as given. Sure the divine may have magical power to perform miracles but arcane stuff can do miracles, miracles are mundane, and even if you can do miracles that does not mean you are right on an intellectual level. A loyal skeptic type of argument is a key aspect of Eberron Flavor to my understanding.

Eventually Eternal Wands appear in other places like the Magic Item Compendium. Even though they are using the SRD formula plus 100 gp, and the SRD allows craft wondrous items to apply to non spellcasters, and can be crafted by divine spellcasters some DMs are more comfortable with these specific items instead of a general pricing guidelines the SRD offered. Remember in 2000 to 2004 Wizards of the Coast expected people to create custom magic items and custom prestige classes all the time as the DM. They did not understand this is more work for the DM but also they can sell lots of books if you come up with new prestige classes, new magic items, etc.

-----


And would anything break if they weren't?


So no there is nothing broken with Divine Eternal Wands for the crafter, and allowing the Eternal Wand to be used by any class regardless if they are arcane, divine, or no spellcaster at all. This applies with two cavets.

1) We assume a Cleric or Druid is doing the crafting and not something obscure like an Artificer picking from any classes, Divine Crusader, etc.
2) We assume the spells you are using to make the Eternal Wand is properly listed as a proper 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th level spell and it is not under or overpriced.

Tiktakkat
2019-09-13, 02:16 PM
By background, eternal wands were intended to allow magewrights to use functional combat magic in a huge war. Magewrights are sort of an arcane casting equivalent of adepts. Because adepts have a few functional combat spells, they do not really need the equivalent of eternal wands to access the entire cleric (or druid) spell list for spells to blow stuff up.
So that is "why".

As for breaking things:
Wizards and sorcerers do not particularly need eternal wands, as they can already access their entire spell list without a fancy wand-wondrous item hybrid. They can just use regular wands or scrolls.
The "real" bonus of an eternal wand is thus casting those spells 2/day "forever".

The costs break down as follows:
A regular wand is 15 gp/charge for a 1st level spell.
An eternal wand of a 1st level spell is 820 gp.
You would need to use the eternal wand 54-2/3rds times, or 2/day for 28 days, to break even.
Going by total RAW recommendation of 4 encounters/day, 3 such days/level, you would be a minimum of 9th level before your 1st level eternal wand was cost effective.
Overall, there are not that many 1st level arcane spells at CL 1 that are going to be useful at 9th level. Or at 5th level for that matter.
Non-combat spells like endure elements and identify will be more useful, and depending on the campaign more likely to be used for more days and so reach the cost-effectiveness point at a lower level.

Now go to divine spells, and start immediately with Happy Sticks.
Sure, cure light wounds 2/day is not that impressive, but with decent rest between encounters lesser vigor 2/day certainly is. And then both for full recovery after a day of adventuring.
And as wimpy as they are, as long as those rests between encounters remain at the 5 minute level, they are still going to be worthwhile at and even past 9th level.

Overall, that is the balance question to ask:
How useful is it to cast any particular 1st level spell at CL 1 2/day past 10th level?
As with other wands, the value breaks down rapidly for 2nd and 3rd level spells.

Of course you could just get a lesser schema, which effectively does the same thing but only 1/day. Buying 2 with a 1st level spell is actually 20 gp cheaper than an eternal wand, and has the added bonus of being usable by anyone with the spell on their spell list allowing other party members to use "dual class" spells.