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View Full Version : What would you want from a Wizard gadgeteer/inventor subclass?



TyGuy
2019-09-14, 10:15 PM
Say there was a subclass like the dwarves' battlerager or the elves' bladesinger. A wizard subclass heavily themed for gnomes in which the features provide options for whimsical gadgets and clockwork creations.

What would you like to see? How would you like it to play?

Spectrulus
2019-09-15, 10:27 AM
If you wanted to use the school of invention Unearthed Arcana, I'd say you're there. It's not a bad wizard school at all mechanically.

moonfly7
2019-09-15, 10:58 AM
If you wanted to use the school of invention Unearthed Arcana, I'd say you're there. It's not a bad wizard school at all mechanically.

Iron. Man. Wizard.
I don't have to say anything else. Don't use the school of invention.

Past that, the problem with inventor classes is(speaking from experience) it puts way to much power in the players court when done RIGHT. When I play an inventor, I want to invent, make new stuff, mix science with me magic to make cool gadgets and stuff. But even if what I want is very much possible according to the rules of the class, and the game itself, I obviously need to abide by my DM for final say. The issue comes when the DM and player start to disagree. Say the player proposes something possible, but powerful mechanically, and, utilizing relatively simple spells and materials. Player presents idea, fully aware how strong it is, and proud of there real world engineering knowledge, and DND magic knowledge. They see a clever work around born from hours of research and careful testing and theorizing that is hilariously simple to them now that it's done.
But the DM, being the master of balance, sees, quite understandably, the utter power of the invention. And it's so cheap to make! So wisely, the DM tells the player "sorry but no" probably very politely.
Now the issue is, if this had just been something cool but broken from the internet, the player would be like "ok, that's fine" and go away. But no, this isn't some weord homebrew. This is an invention, you know, the thing their character is good at. And it's realistic and totally possible considerimg rulings the DM has made in the past.
So they explain it to the DM, show all the careful notes, they say "ok, but look, it actually works according to this, and this, and this from both the PHB, DMG, and nutons 3rd law."
Now, basically what will happen is a series of back and forths, in which the two will come to an enpass, where both realize what the issue was.
Only, the compromise they make will likely be very far from what the inventor actually made, and still to "broken" in the eyes of the DM. No-one is really happy.
Rinse and repeat for roughly 50-60% of ebery invention. DM and inventor will eventually just get pissed at each other. Ones constantly "minmaxing and introducing broken homebrew and stupid applications of science in a MAGIC world". And the other is being "an uncompremising jerk who doesn't understand/appreciate my hard work"
Neither person is write for wrong here, both just want a fun game. One guy wanted to make fun ideas. And that is amazing, let me tell you. But I've yet to see an inventor class that can fix the fact that the DM and inventor are very likely to but heads over inventions a lot.
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Take it from me, that ends up being a lot of stress. I've been the DM and player. And trust me when I say I understood both times where the other guy was coming from, and vice versa. But this type of concept always ends up pitting good people against each other.
So, I'd love to see a subclass that lets you invent your own things, in a balanced controlled way. Maybe a miracle worker will see this and do it. A thousand blessings upon you if you actually do it, I want a copy when your done, and your autograph.

TyGuy
2019-09-16, 12:55 AM
If you wanted to use the school of invention Unearthed Arcana, I'd say you're there. It's not a bad wizard school at all mechanically.
Closest thing to an invention is a studded leather that grants resistance to a rare damage type. Hard pass


Past that, the problem with inventor classes is(speaking from experience) it puts way to much power in the players court when done RIGHT...
So basically give an assortment of invention options to choose from like the second artificer artillerist UA.