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View Full Version : D&D 3.x Other Reducing Half-Vampire from LA +2 to LA +1



Jeivar
2019-09-28, 09:21 AM
I'm interested in the Half-Vampire template from Libris Mortis, but would like to bring the level adjustment down to one. As written the HV has the following:

*Bonus to Armour Class.
*Slam Attack
*Can pick between blood drain for minor temporary HP, Charm gaze or commanding rats, bats or wolves. Picking blood drain comes with blood dependency.
*Damage reduction 5/magic or silver
*Fast Healing - 1 point per round, until it's back to half max HP
*Resistance to cold and electricity
*+2 to Strength, Dexterity and Charisma
*+2 to Bluff, Hide, Listen, Move Silently and Spot.
*The Improved Initiative feat

Here's what I'm thinking:

Take out the extra feat, the resistances and the Slam Attack, reduce the skill bonuses to three, make the blood dependency mandatory but take out the temporary HP and the other two options.

We're left with:

*+2 Bonus to Armour Class
*Blood dependency
*Damage reduction 5/magic or silver
*Fast healing
*+2 to Strength, Dexterity and Charisma
*+2 to Hide and Move Silently

Do you think this might qualify for a +1 LA?

Jeivar
2019-09-30, 07:04 AM
Ahhh, anyone? Any thoughts?

paddyfool
2019-09-30, 12:04 PM
What's your benchmark for a fair +1 LA race? Aasimar, Tiefling, or Goliath maybe? If so, overall, this seems a tiny bit strong (within the usual caveats for the drawbacks of having any LA).

Also, I'd suggest keeping all of this ability, as it seems the most interesting and iconic bit:
*Can pick between blood drain for minor temporary HP, Charm gaze or commanding rats, bats or wolves. Picking blood drain comes with blood dependency.

I'd also suggest maybe get rid of the damage reduction and reduce its AC bonus to +1 - both as a nerf, and because three different ways to demonstrate added resilience seems a bit redundant.

Getting a bonus to three different stats seems a bit much for LA +1 as well. Maybe the player would have to pick two out of those three stats for their +1 bonus?

Overall that would look like:

*Can pick between blood drain for minor temporary HP, Charm gaze or commanding rats, bats or wolves. Picking blood drain comes with blood dependency.
*+1 Bonus to Armour Class
*Fast healing
*+2 to two out of the following three stats (player's choice): Strength, Dexterity and Charisma
*+2 to Hide and Move Silently

Jeivar
2019-09-30, 04:15 PM
What's your benchmark for a fair +1 LA race? Aasimar, Tiefling, or Goliath maybe? If so, overall, this seems a tiny bit strong (within the usual caveats for the drawbacks of having any LA).


Ahhhh, I can't really answer that. If I had a better grasp of 3.5 I wouldn't be asking for opinions.

DeTess
2019-09-30, 04:29 PM
Ahhhh, I can't really answer that. If I had a better grasp of 3.5 I wouldn't be asking for opinions.

One possible bench-mark that is often used in the LA reassignment thread is to simply compare two almost identical builds, one with and one without the template. For example, to reach a valid +1 LA balance point, compare a crusader* 4 to a crusader 3 with the template. If both seem about balanced with eachother, you're probably at the right point.

*I picked the Crusader because it's a solid middle-of-the-road class that happens to play well with the strengths of the template (ability score bonuses, tankyness, etc.)

Silva Stormrage
2019-10-06, 02:09 AM
I would probably say a bit too strong at low levels.

Draconic is a decent +1 LA template. Not great not bad.
It has
+2 Str, Con and Cha
+1 NA
Claw Attacks
+4 Saves on Sleep/Paralysis
+2 on Intimidate and Spot checks.


So frankly your vampire template seems pretty close to the Draconic template. The one thing that is an issue is the DR and fast healing at low levels. At level 3 or so before enemies have magic weapons 5 reduction is a big deal. It isn't such a big deal that I would say your version breaks the game or anything (Mineral Warrior gives DR 8/Adamantine at LA +1....) but it is something that might be obnoxious at low levels. I would swap the DR to DR 5/Silver but only grant the DR at HD 5+. That makes the DR more relevant at high levels where 5 DR isn't really a big deal and not super powerful at low levels where that kind of damage matters.

But still even without the above tweak I think its fine for most groups. Level adjustment is pretty harsh, especially with no LA buyoff. Tiefling and a lot of the standard +1 LA races are pretty far on the weak side so I wouldn't use them as a balance point.