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Raven T.
2007-10-15, 05:47 PM
All right, my search has not found what exactially I'm looking for, so here goes:

After reading a thread from a few months ago on optimizing a ranged Scout/Ranger, I'm going to have a go at it myself. However, I have some questions about feat selection and how it affects the Ranger's Combat Style. Namely, if I take Manyshot as early as I can (Sct4/Rgr5,) how does this affect it when Improved Combat Style is gained the next level? Would Greater Manyshot pop out? Is Improved Precise Shot bumped up?

And what about the other feats. Swift Hunter is, of course, going to be taken. Is Shot on the Run worth it? Precise Shot? Improved Skirmish?

Saph
2007-10-15, 05:51 PM
Ranger is an older class, so it doesn't have the "If you have this feat already, you get another feat instead" clause. At level six, an archery ranger gets Manyshot. If you have it already, too bad.

Precise Shot is essential. Improved Skirmish is worth taking too if you can reliably move 20 feet (Tumble will help). Shot on the Run is pointless, don't take it.

- Saph

Reel On, Love
2007-10-15, 05:54 PM
Ranger is an older class, so it doesn't have the "If you have this feat already, you get another feat instead" clause. At level six, an archery ranger gets Manyshot. If you have it already, too bad.

Precise Shot is essential. Improved Skirmish is worth taking too if you can reliably move 20 feet (Tumble will help). Shot on the Run is pointless, don't take it.

- Saph

Precisely. You could ask your DM to house rule that the ranger gets another feat if he already has one of his bonus feats, though. It's reasonable.

cupkeyk
2007-10-15, 06:02 PM
1 Sct1 +0 Skirmish (1+1d6), Trapfinding, Point Blank Shot

2 Rgr1 +1 1st favored enemy(undead), Track, Spiritual Connection

3 Sct2 +2 Battle fortitude +1, uncanny dodge, Weapon Focus (Longbow)

4 Rgr2 +4 Combat style (Rapid Shot)

5 Sct3 +3 Fast movement +10 ft., Skirmish (1+1d6, +1 AC), trackless step

6 Rgr3 +6 Endurance, Swift Hunter, 2nd Favored Enemy(Constructs), skirmish (1+2d6, +1 AC)

7 Sct4 +5 Improved Skirmish, skirmish (1+4d6, +4 AC)

8 Rgr4 +7 Spiritual Companion, Precise Shot

9 Sct5 +7 Evasion, Skirmish (Dex+1+5d6, +4 AC), Skill Trick: Acrobatic Backstab Dead Eye

10 Rgr5 +8 3rd favored enemy (Elementals)

11 Sct6 +9 Flawless Stride, skirmish (Dex+1+5d6, +5AC)

12 Rgr6 +10 Improved combat style(ManyShot), Greater Manyshot

13 Sct7 +11 (Dex+1+5d6, +6AC)

14 Rgr7 +12 Woodland stride, Expiditious Dodge

15 Sct8 +12 Camouflage Sct9 +12 Woodland Archer, skirmish (+6d6, +8 AC), 4th Favored Enemy(Oozes)

16 Rgr8 +13 Swift tracker

17 Rgr9 +14 Spell Reflection, skirmish (+7d6, +9 AC)

18 Sct9 +15 Mobility, Shot on the Run

19 Sct10 +16 Blindsense 30 ft., skirmish (+7d6, +9 AC)

20 Sct11 +17 Battle fortitude +2, fast movement +20 ft., 5t Favored Enemy(Plants)

This is my current character too! Just sharing my build. I am a Whispergnome btw.

Raven T.
2007-10-15, 06:12 PM
Is it worth not burning a feat on Manyshot if you're going to pick it up in one more level anyway?

Any other feat suggestions out there...that means at 1st level I grab PBS/Precise Shot, third is open, Scout Bonus is open, sixth is Swift Hunter, ninth is Improved Skirmish, twelfth brings Greater Manyshot (seems like a long time to wait for it, but whatcha gonna do?) and the last two are open, as well.

I'm thinking about using the PHB II variant to swap out the animal companion.

Saph
2007-10-15, 06:31 PM
Is it worth not burning a feat on Manyshot if you're going to pick it up in one more level anyway?

Definitely not worth it. Feats are very important for a fighter character, you don't want to waste them.


Any other feat suggestions out there...that means at 1st level I grab PBS/Precise Shot, third is open, Scout Bonus is open, sixth is Swift Hunter, ninth is Improved Skirmish, twelfth brings Greater Manyshot (seems like a long time to wait for it, but whatcha gonna do?) and the last two are open, as well.

Is there any reason your build has to be Scout 4/Ranger 5? If you take Scout 3/Ranger 6 you could get Manyshot and then Greater Manyshot at the same time at level 9. Then take the fourth Scout level at level 10 and get Improved Skirmish as well.

Or, as Reel said, you could just ask the DM if you could get Greater Manyshot in place of Manyshot. It's a very reasonable houserule - the newer classes like Warmage all have clauses like that for their bonus feats.

- Saph

Raven T.
2007-10-15, 06:45 PM
Is there any reason your build has to be Scout 4/Ranger 5? If you take Scout 3/Ranger 6 you could get Manyshot and then Greater Manyshot at the same time at level 9. Then take the fourth Scout level at level 10 and get Improved Skirmish as well.

*facepalm* Why didn't I think of that?! Where is my head some days...

There's still the question of what to use for other feats, though...

cupkeyk
2007-10-15, 07:07 PM
You can only sct3/ranger17 or the other way around if you are human or halfelf, or face xp penalties though. click on my spoiler, it has my entire feat selection for all twenty levels.

Raven T.
2007-10-15, 07:22 PM
I (almost) always play Human. That bonus feat is just too good to ignore.

I think I'm good to go for the low levels. Even with some "sub-optimal" selections, I can at least play him the way I feel he should be played. I picked up Quick Reconnoiter for the third level feat, mostly for flavor and the initiative bonus.

Curmudgeon
2007-10-15, 07:33 PM
You can only sct3/ranger17 or the other way around if you are human or halfelf, or face xp penalties though. ... or your race has either Scout or Ranger as the favored class. Don't forget about races like the Gnoll, Hound Archon, and Centaur (Ranger) and Varag (Scout).

Person_Man
2007-10-15, 09:15 PM
I suggest a Raptorian or Dragonborn. Take Flyby Attack and Greater Manyshot. You'll be pretty untouchable, and you'll be able to deal Skirmish damage every round.

The Spell Compendium is a Ranger's best friend. It opens up a lot of highly useful spells. If you don't use a non-caster variant, its a must have.

The Arcane Hunter variant from Complete Mage lets you take Favored Enemy (Arcanists). If you take a few levels of Stalker of Kharash from Book of Exalted Deeds, you can pick up Favored Enemy (Evil). These open up all sorts of interesting Favored Enemy feat combos, such as Nemesis, Bane Blind, Wise to Your Ways, and Favored Power Attack (if you wanted to do melee instead of ranged).

Draz74
2007-10-15, 10:35 PM
You can only sct3/ranger17 or the other way around if you are human or halfelf, or face xp penalties though. click on my spoiler, it has my entire feat selection for all twenty levels.

Or if your DM ignores XP penalties, as many do. Or if you're a Wood Elf. Or some other obscure race that has FC: Ranger. (I was going to say Gnoll, but then I guess you'd have racial HD too.)

Darrin
2007-10-16, 07:21 AM
You can only sct3/ranger17 or the other way around if you are human or halfelf, or face xp penalties though. click on my spoiler, it has my entire feat selection for all twenty levels.

If you're running into multiclass penalties as a ranger, there are two LA +0 templates in Dragon #306 that change your race's favored class to Ranger: the Desert template and the Wild template.

The Desert template leaves the original race largely intact, and just adds a few minor fluff bonuses. The Wild template basically turns the original race into a half-orc: +2 Str, -2 Int, -2 Cha. Speed +5 and +1 Skill Point/level is nice, though... I'm tempted to play a Wild Wild Elf, if only to annoy people.