An ideal for a hopefully different Rogue

[Darththiek]

I recently found the rules for Teamwork Benefits and was thinking that a rogue with the Martial Rogue variant might be a fun build when you add leadership feat. I picture the rogue stepping back when combat starts the starts giving guidance to the party letting his cohort step up and assist the party. He could grant some bonuses to his teammates. I'm trying to do this without magic other than from UMD. Any good ideas out there. I have been looking but no luck.

Thanks.

[Darththiek]

I guess I should be a little more specific. I'm playing in a game starting at 3rd level with an unknown level cap by the end. I like to at least plan my characters out to 20th level to make sure I get at least the things I need for a concept. Of course no amount of planning covers it all. I know i want leadership along with the legendary commander, imp. Cohort and the like. I seen the "Practiced Cohort Feat" I cant tell if this and "Teamwork Benefits" are worth it or not. I don't really think they are. What would you all do with this Idea?

[NNescio]

First you need to take 5 ranks in Profession: Aesthetician so you can swap out SA in favor of Concealer Attack. Next remember to take the appropriate ACFs to swap out Rogue class features for Mascara Sense and Improved Eyeliner. If you really want, you can take the Dark Eyeshadow template so you can Hide Your Blemishes in Plain Sight.

[Ashtagon]

First you need to take 5 ranks in Profession: Aesthetician so you can swap out SA in favor of Concealer Attack. Next remember to take the appropriate ACFs to swap out Rogue class features for Mascara Sense and Improved Eyeliner. If you really want, you can take the Dark Eyeshadow template so you can Hide Your Blemishes in Plain Sight.

Is the clown prestige class any good? I've seen some with really powerful fear-based attacks.

[Zaq]

First you need to take 5 ranks in Profession: Aesthetician so you can swap out SA in favor of Concealer Attack. Next remember to take the appropriate ACFs to swap out Rogue class features for Mascara Sense and Improved Eyeliner. If you really want, you can take the Dark Eyeshadow template so you can Hide Your Blemishes in Plain Sight.

Be sure to check your group’s preferred op level first. A lot of folks say rouges are overpowdered.

[Albions_Angel]

Please dont hate me guys, but I am a sucker for a sob story.

Darththiek - just in case you are wondering what the hell is going on, you have consistently typed the class as "R-O-U-G-E", which is a type of makeup. Its easy to do, and you may well be dyslexic, or not have English as a first language, or be tripping over your own fingers, but the traditionally stabby-sneaky-stealy class is the "R-O-G-U-E", meaning an outlaw or someone who doesnt follow rules. So people are making makeup jokes and not helping you out.

I am not helping you out either. But thats another matter. Sorry.

[Darththiek]

No I figured it out. I'm one of the worlds worst at spelling. I'm not bothered by it. Now that being said can anyone actually give any good ideas.

[satorian]

You'll get a lot more help if you edit the spelling in the title. The "rouge" misspelling is a pet peeve for a lot of people. It's really hard to get past, like misspelling "infraction" with a dirty word in the middle instead of "frac": all you can see is the error.

With that said, have you looked at the Marshal class? You don't seem to actually want to do anything with your rogue abilities, so rogue seems like a waste. Marshal synergizes with what you want, and actually provides leadership-style benefits. Also, its auras are (Ex), so it avoids magic.

[nedz]

Martial Rogue only gets you Fighter feats — which are good for melle or archery mainly.

Marshal is OK but Bard seems a better fit. You can do this with Perform(Oratory) or even Perform(Comedy) rather than music. You do get a few spells, but you can choose buffs etc.

Also, Disguise Self is good for adding Rouge — if that's your thing :)

[DeTess]

I you're willing to be a bit more hands-on while still playing a mechanical leadership role you could look at the crusader or warblade from Tome of Battle. Both get access to the white raven school of maneuvers which does stuff like granting your allies bonuses to hit your target, or granting free movement, or giving someone 1 extra turn or similar things.

[Particle_Man]

I recently found the rules for Teamwork Benefits and was thinking that a rouge with the Martial Rouge variant might be a fun build when you add leadership feat. I picture the rouge stepping back when combat starts the starts giving guidance to the party letting his cohort step up and assist the party. He could grant some bonuses to his teammates. I'm trying to do this without magic other than from UMD. Any good ideas out there. I have been looking but no luck.

Thanks.

Why not just use a Bard with Leadership and teamwork feats? You don't actually have to cast your bard spells in combat (just, you know, Perform (Oratory) and inspire the troops).

Just saw the above post and wanted to note that there is a great feat for multiclass bard/crusaders or bard/warblades that lets you stack those classes for bardic inspiration and also lets you set it up more quickly.

[ExLibrisMortis]

There's a build in my signature that's pretty support-heavy, you could have a look there for some ideas.


The basic idea of "stand back and lead the troops" works well on a dragonblooded bard (silverbrow human is nice), using Dragonfire Inspiration, Inspire Courage, a draconic aura, and a marshal minor aura (one level in marshal). If you add levels in crusader, you get more of a "lead from the front" kind of build (a lot of crusader buffs involve striking a target), which can be a bit more powerful.

[pabelfly]

Is everyone at the table okay with you having the Leadership feat? You're going to be running a lot of extra characters with it and that means you're taking up extra time in and out of combat compared to everyone else playing. Could lead to frustrated people at the table. Something to think about.

Separate to that, martial rogue simply doesn't have the capabilities to do what you're after. Rogues are good at sneaking and picking locks, and you've got feats to fight, but standing at the rear giving orders is neither of those things. If you want to play the support role, I'd pick something like Sorcerer, Wizard, Cleric, Bard, Marshall, and so forth, depending on what sort of flavour and power level you're after at the table. Characters that have spells or abilities to buff allies.

[Darththiek]

Really the biggest reason for the class choice was for the skill points in meeting requirements for the Teamwork Benefits. I figured if I took educated and able learner feats at first, race human I could have all but a few skills and the ranks to put onto them. Then with the Bonus feats be able to take any feat a fighter can since it says you get bonus feats as a fighter when using Martial Rogue variant.

That being said I am going to have to look more at the crusader.

[GrayDeath]

Seconding changing the SPelling in Rouge, firsting changing Ideal to Idea (unless you are looking for an ideal for the Rogue to worship^^).

To the question: You dont need to be a Rogue to do that, as others have mentioned there are quite a few better classes for it.

What feel do you want? Is using Magic to improve your Allies/Cohorts a thing you want, or should it all be "mundane"?

How much of your own Power are you willing to allot to "steps back and buffs others"?