Character build advice to support new players

[BurgerBeast]

I just got invited to play with a group of new players and an experienced DM.

The party consists of: Dragonborn Ranger, Human Druid, Elven Sorcerer.

They are not optimized. The DM is slowly introducing the game as they play, however they are also starting at level 5ish (levels are varied).

My first thought was to play a rogue, which would fit nicely. However, my preferred mode of play is buffs/controls, and my favourite class is cleric. I think it would be a good opportunity to sit back and let others shine. Despite the fact that I hate bards, it occurs to me that a Lore Board might be a good fit, letting me get buffs/support out of my casting and taking roguish skills.

I'm probably going to go light on splat books and stick relatively close to core options, but my questions are:

1. Should I play a rogue, a cleric, or a bard?
2. If I play a bard, how would you build a level 5 bard to make others shine?

I'm open to multi-class builds but generally don't prefer it.

[Teaguethebean]

A big question is how do the druid and ranger fight? Is the druid a moon druid or something else, does the ranger use a bow or do they fight in melee.
Because if they are lacking in front line power than an oath of the crown paladin or any of the clerics with heavy armor would fit well. Though if one of them already cover your melee power than I would say a bard works great. Perhaps a midline valor bard who picks up spells like hypnotic pattern, or a lore bard if they are both melee so you can just hold back and use buff spells like haste, and greater invisibility.

[jaappleton]

They need a tank, if the Druid isn’t Moon and depending on the Ranger.

Nobody ever complains about having a Life or Grave Cleric. Going Grave would make the others do more damage, via Grave’s Channel Divinity. Everyone always appreciates that.

Diviner Wizard is also a decent bet here, using your Portend to ensure enemies fail and allies succeed.

Bard would also be great, especially Lore, but don’t force yourself to play a class you hate. You need to have fun, too!

My vote goes to Grave Cleric.

[BurgerBeast]

I’m not working with too much information because I was trying to ask these types of questions without making them feel like newbs. For example one of the players didn’t know what “race” is and gave me her subclass instead. The Druid apparently selected Circle of the Moon but sits back and casts in combat so far. But it’s early and they will likely learn and switch tactics.

I don’t know if that helps at all, but it’s where I’m at.

[jaappleton]

I’m not working with too much information because I was trying to ask these types of questions without making them feel like newbs. For example one of the players didn’t know what “race” is and gave me her subclass instead. The Druid apparently selected Circle of the Moon but sits back and casts in combat so far. But it’s early and they will likely learn and switch tactics.

I don’t know if that helps at all, but it’s where I’m at.

Oh.

Oh, it’s this style. I got it.

In that case, I’d work with the DM to try to set up scenarios in which the players archetypes become more defined. Where the new players can realize where their archetypes and roles can truly shine.

Now, I understand you can lead a horse to water but can’t make it drink. So ultimately you might have to kinda spell it out. But be careful not to tell them how to play, y’know?

For example, the party comes to a locked door. The Moon Druid could turn into a house spider and crawl through the keyhole.

You and the DM should work together on this in an effort to get the newer players minds opened up the what they can really do.

And also, even in Adventurer’s League, you can respec your PC up until level 5. So if they’re unhappy with their archetype, race, etc, encourage them to explore other options.

Ultimately, above all else, be supportive! We were all pretty green once, after all.

[CheddarChampion]

Life/Grave Cleric will let the others do their thing(s) in combat. If you can get enemies to focus on you, your allies can focus on offense.
Hill Dwarf 14/10/16/10/16/10 (taken resilient: constitution)
Plenty of healing and buff spells to cast on allies.
Just don't cast Spirit Guardians, as such a spell can outshine unoptimized builds.

Lore Bard will help the others do their thing(s) in combat. Bardic Inspiration + Cutting Words helps them achieve more often.
Lightfoot Halfling 8/16/14/10/10/16 (with bountiful luck for more support)
You can have a buff for every situation. I'm guessing faerie fire will be a crowd favorite.

Finally, it seems like you have the mentor thing down, but I'll still recommend offering general help (rather than specific suggestions) and pointing out things that would be good if the newbies ask.

[BurgerBeast]

The advice about general help only and letting them explore is well-received. I will be trying very hard to do just that (and I do some experience at doing so).

So I think I will take the offered advice and play either the grave cleric (to provide overarching general support) or a lore bard (to help them shine).

Does anyone feel strongly that one is better than the other? In some ways I’m inclined to think that watching what the other players do or try to do, and trying to find the right spell to support it, would be a good way of staying entertained while letting them shine. This is my main reason for thinking bard... but as mentioned grave cleric seems like a low maintenance way to offer general support.

[Teaguethebean]

The advice about general help only and letting them explore is well-received. I will be trying very hard to do just that (and I do some experience at doing so).

So I think I will take the offered advice and play either the grave cleric (to provide overarching general support) or a lore bard (to help them shine).

Does anyone feel strongly that one is better than the other? In some ways I’m inclined to think that watching what the other players do or try to do, and trying to find the right spell to support it, would be a good way of staying entertained while letting them shine. This is my main reason for thinking bard... but as mentioned grave cleric seems like a low maintenance way to offer general support.

I grave cleric would fit very well as grave cleric will allow them to explore their characters without much risk as if they fall you can heal them up and if they get into sticky situations you can pull them out with clutch spells like death ward and freedom of movement. But as stated above avoid spirit guardians as it's damage can out do characters trying to do a lot of damage if they aren't well optimized.

[MarkVIIIMarc]

I just got invited to play with a group of new players and an experienced DM.

The party consists of: Dragonborn Ranger, Human Druid, Elven Sorcerer.

They are not optimized. The DM is slowly introducing the game as they play, however they are also starting at level 5ish (levels are varied).

My first thought was to play a rogue, which would fit nicely. However, my preferred mode of play is buffs/controls, and my favourite class is cleric. I think it would be a good opportunity to sit back and let others shine. Despite the fact that I hate bards, it occurs to me that a Lore Board might be a good fit, letting me get buffs/support out of my casting and taking roguish skills.

I'm probably going to go light on splat books and stick relatively close to core options, but my questions are:

1. Should I play a rogue, a cleric, or a bard?
2. If I play a bard, how would you build a level 5 bard to make others shine?

I'm open to multi-class builds but generally don't prefer it.


Man, Bard is probably the most optimized choice, especially Lore Bard but you'll have to be careful not to be better at everything than new folks. You'll probably get a level in before the Additional Magical Secrets choice let's you specialize for the party's needs too darn it.

What is it, 3 Cantrips and 8 spells @ Level 5

Vicious Mockery
Friends
Minor Illusion

Dissonant Whispers (for use when it gets party members Opportunity Attacks)
Healing Word (try not to spam the pop a mole too bad but you'll keep them from dying.)
Faerie Fire (make the target softer)

Silence (best anti-mage thing before counterspell which you'll get at 6)
Heat Metal (for them AC24 humanoid opponents)
Hold Person (Let your party do some crit damage)

Fear (make them RUN w/o doing tons of damage)
Stinking Cloud (No damage but I almost TPK'd a party on an easy encounter as DM thanks to this lol)

[Garresh]

Surprised no one has said Paladin yet. It fits the tank bill well, and has enough support to keep things going smoothly. You can grab shield fighting style and pick up sentinel to act as a wall of righteousness to hold them back. My concern with going cleric is that intentionally or otherwise you may clash with the druid and outdo them. You can if you play cautiously, but I feel given their inexperience you should avoid that. You guys REALLY need some kind of frontline though. Normally, a party doesn't need a tank imho. They can make it up via tactics. But these guys are very new, so a more conventional strategy is needed.

As weird as it sounds, Oath of Redemption might be a good fit. They get counterspell at level 9, can redirect damage, channel Divinity to boost persuasion if the sorc isn't built that way. You can hold back on smites so not to overshadow, but have some fuel in the tank for when you really need to step up.

Really, paladin is your go to imho. I think bard is a terrible choice because it's going to be fairly squishy and not good at protection. And it's utility will likely threaten the pure casters imho.

[BurgerBeast]

Surprised no one has said Paladin yet. It fits the tank bill well, and has enough support to keep things going smoothly. You can grab shield fighting style and pick up sentinel to act as a wall of righteousness to hold them back. My concern with going cleric is that intentionally or otherwise you may clash with the druid and outdo them. You can if you play cautiously, but I feel given their inexperience you should avoid that. You guys REALLY need some kind of frontline though. Normally, a party doesn't need a tank imho. They can make it up via tactics. But these guys are very new, so a more conventional strategy is needed.

As weird as it sounds, Oath of Redemption might be a good fit. They get counterspell at level 9, can redirect damage, channel Divinity to boost persuasion if the sorc isn't built that way. You can hold back on smites so not to overshadow, but have some fuel in the tank for when you really need to step up.

Really, paladin is your go to imho. I think bard is a terrible choice because it's going to be fairly squishy and not good at protection. And it's utility will likely threaten the pure casters imho.

Yeah, it’s a weird one because the moon Druid ought to be a front-liner but may never, and I’m not to push her either way. And the ranger, being Dragonborn, May also be a front-liner.

I’ll ask the DM about those two. I’ll also ask the sorcerer whether she is a blaster (which I suspect but you never know), because she seemed to be worried that a wizard would be redundant.

My rolled stats are 15, 15, 14, 13, 11, 9 to be assigned, if that makes a difference.

[Biggstick]

A Half Elf Oath of the Ancients Paladin will give you a character that can relate to any other member of the party.

Go 16 Strength so that you have the ability to stand in the front. Misty Step from OotA level 5 will make it so that you maintain mobility should the party not join you in the front line.

Pick up 16 Charisma as well as proficiency in Persuasion. This isn't so that you are the de facto face; it's so you can use your prior knowledge to guide the party in acting as a face. By being capable of it as a PC in regards to your supporting stats, you will better be able to show these inexperienced Players how to be a face in the future. Additionally, you can simply act as support for any of them should they decide to speak up, as your character can easily connect with any of them.

As a Paladin, you'll also have a few buff spells (Bless) and features (LoH) that can allow you to show the party how working together benefits the party as a whole.

In an effort to keep the spotlight off of yourself, you can create a story in which your Paladin is searching for someone or something. You either need someone in the party to help you find it, or they are someone you believe can help you find it. By heavily attaching yourself to a party member, you can push the focus away from yourself and on to them, creating an opportunity for them to pursue their own goals with someone (yourself) to gently guide them along the way.

[Nidgit]

Paladin could work well, but it's generally a "stalwart defender" type of support more than a "make everyone better" support. If the Sorcerer isn't buffing much, Cleric is almost certainly a better option to help lift everyone up. Unless you're specifically playing to avoid it, you'll definitely steal the show sometimes as a Paladin.

[Biggstick]

Paladin could work well, but it's generally a "stalwart defender" type of support more than a "make everyone better" support. If the Sorcerer isn't buffing much, Cleric is almost certainly a better option to help lift everyone up. Unless you're specifically playing to avoid it, you'll definitely steal the show sometimes as a Paladin.

Standing in front and taking the Dodge Action can most certainly make everyone better in regards to combat. By being the person to stand in front, you give them the opportunity to "do their thing" if they aren't ones to stand in front.

A Cleric is likely to step on the toes of a Druid in regard to how they act outside of combat in multiple ways.
1. Healing (Prayer of Healing versus Healing Spirit)
2. Guidance (both classes have it)
3. Ritual spells (both classes have them)
4. Wisdom based spellcaster (both represent as such)

Playing a Paladin, especially one that isn't afraid to make it about supporting a party member, can very much so be in line with a fun and flavorful Paladin. By having a 16 Charisma and proficiency in Persuasion (as well as personal experience), you'll be able to take the reigns in one of the arguably most difficult parts of a campaign in being able to act as a face. What you will have to know how to do is though is to properly give away the spot light to your allies. This in-of-itself can make you the most valuable member of the party, as knowing how to properly step to the side can set your party up for situations that would have never been present had you been a 10 Charisma Cleric.

[tKUUNK]

Once, back in 3.5 days, I LOVED playing as druid when we had a cleric in the party. Drooling just thinking about it. It allowed me to focus on control / combat knowing there was another "main healer" in the group. So if you enjoy playing cleric, maybe don't worry about stepping on the druid's toes. It can actually be an awesome combo.