Swashbuckler's Panache as a per encounter resource and other musing

[Aotrs Commander]

What would be the ramifications of making the Swashbuckler's Panache become a per-encounter resource, rather than the up-and-down one that it is?

(Mechanically, vanilla panache seems a bit... Reliant on luck, and while it might seem like good flavour, I'm not really convinced on that front, either, especially as it appears to hdedge the Swashbuckler into a narrow range of plausible builds.)

In this theorhetical instance, it would thus not regenerate from crits (you might keep getting panache on a kill, maybe).

One of the obvious results is it might mean the Swashbuckler is not entirely dependant on crit-heavy focus, maybe?

I'm doing a pass on the Swashbuckler and it seems generally ill-favoured from looking around and I'm looking at basically a bit of a blend between the PF Swashbuckler and pasting on some of the abilities from my version of the 3.5 Swashbuckler.

(Bonus skill tricks, for one!)

Not sure what to do with Insightful Strike (argueably the only reason fo the vanilla 3.5 Swash to exist; I might care a little less, save we actually HAVE swashbucker character so I don't want to screw hi over too much, obviously! Just adding it on top of Precise Strike might be a bit much (maybe instead of Str, though...?).

One thought I had while ruminating on this, then, was to basically take the Inspired Blade as inspiration (ha!) and make Panache be per-encounter, but based on Cha plus Int. (Might be a bit much, though...)

Or maybe keep it dynamic, but start from Cha + Int...? (With ACF for something else for Swashbucklers who don't have high Int?)

Figured it might be worth running past the forums for a sanity check.



Another option might be to do something like I did with the Paladin. I was loathe to drop the +D6 smites from Seerow's Rebalanced Paladin (that I'd basically unilaterally replace all Smites across the rules), but PF's was also good, so I split the difference. I gave Paladins basically a resource pool from which they draw both smites and lay on hands. This pool (Faith) s a per-day resource which powers the PF-Smites and Lay On Hands, but at the start of each encounter, the paladin gets a number of Fervour points equal to their current Faith and can use them to make their D6 smites. (So, in the end, you have no more numbers to track, but there is some opportunity costs involved.)

So maybe this could be used for something like the Swashbuckler? A per-encounter resource that you could use on some deeds and a per day one you could choose to burn on the some the better ones?



(Also, Stunning Stab should NOT be 19th level, one feels they put that in there to fill it out. As the guides pointed out, the Monk has been basically doing this since level 1. The fact the Swashbuckler can decide on a hit whether to use it (costly too) does not make it 18 level's worth better! I could see maybe 10th-ish, but maybe down to 7th even (might be a bit much for 3rd, but you could make an arguement...!))




I also see a few things that might make extra deeds - the Swashbuckler seems a bit light on them, and one of the complaints is that the Swadsbuckler is pretty much has nowhere really to go. I think I'd rather give the Swashbuckler a set of choices to pick from for deeds, rather than just basically a set list. (Heck, looking at the Panache feats, one can't help but feel they would be better integrated into the Swashbuckler).

What do you reckon ought to be a good number of deeds per level? Stick with three (and move something out of 3rd as a striaght class feature, maybe Swashbuckler's initative)? I'm considering whether they maybe should have Quick Draw automatically anyway.



Edit: also, what about chanign Swashbuckler's Finesse from light/one-handed piercing to simply Light and Heavy Blades (alal fighter weapon group). Because I just don't think that Picks or Morning Stars (and definitely not spiekd shields!) thematically fit with "finesse," myself, where swords do, even if they are more slashy-ones. (And the build guides often suggest slashing grace to use scimitars anyway, so why not simply remove the feat tax?)

[Dr_Dinosaur]

The closest equivalents would be the 3pp Mystic (Path of War) or Striker (Spheres of Might) classes, and both Anima and Tension work well as resource system, starting with a small scaling amount and trickling more in as the fight goes on or certain conditions are met.

[exelsisxax]

Sure. Swashbuckler is bad, so a small buff like this can't make them too good. It won't make them good period.

[liquidformat]

So to start with I would unmarry a lot of the class features evasion, uncanny dodge and the rest of those class features that rely on having a Panache reserve. Also you could move all of the current Deeds down a 3-5 levels and they still wouldn't be overly powerful.

You could also add in Arcane stunts from 3.5 and expand the list of available swift action stunts by level to the list of deeds. You could do the same with some cherry picked Maneuvers.

I think the per encounter abilities could work alright it is just a matter of deciding if you want to have more of a maneuvers based system or pool based and what mechanics should be available to refresh the system.

[Aotrs Commander]

So to start with I would unmarry a lot of the class features evasion, uncanny dodge and the rest of those class features that rely on having a Panache reserve. Also you could move all of the current Deeds down a 3-5 levels and they still wouldn't be overly powerful.

You could also add in Arcane stunts from 3.5 and expand the list of available swift action stunts by level to the list of deeds. You could do the same with some cherry picked Maneuvers.

I think the per encounter abilities could work alright it is just a matter of deciding if you want to have more of a maneuvers based system or pool based and what mechanics should be available to refresh the system.

On looking it up, I had already tweaked Arcane Stunt as an ACF that replaced (some of) the bonus skill tricks I'd given my modification - not need to change that, I think.




Okay, then. Possible modifications to PF Swashbuckler as follows, how does this sound?

Base Fort save: Good (ala 3.5 SB)
Add whip proficiency ((ala previous version, also Zorro, seriously, if bards get it swashbucklers should...)
Bonus Skill Trick at 2nd, and every 3 levels (so 7 over 20 levels), can use panache point to activate a skill trick second or subsequent time. (Or can trade tricks at 2/11/20 for Arcane Stunt)
Moved precisie strike from deed to class feature (it IS pretty much mandatory, might as well make it so, givne the idea is now going to be selecting deeds).
Added Acrobatic Charge (can charge over difficult terrain etc, +2 to weapon damage if you make an Acrobatics check as part of a charge), gained at 2nd, increases by +2 at 9th and 16th.
Added In the Moment at 1st level (grab-bag of basically flavor-y stuff I gave the swash previously: reduced and later eliminated penalty for improvised weapons, ability to use piercing weapon to sunder objects of hardness 0 without AoO, quick draw if at least 1 panache).

Folded in all the panache feat deeds into the progression, as well as a couple of the deeds of renown (except for Vengenful Heart, which has become an ACF).

Dropped Stunning Stab to level 7.

Added as deed some prior class features. Deeds I reckon would be selected from the list (at time of writing, there is now a modified 6 x 1st, 8 x 3rd, 9 x 7th, 4 x 11th, 4 x 15th, 3 x 19th - to allow some variation, you want at least some choices between). I'm thinking either something like 4 each at 1st/3rd/7th at the appropriate level and 3 each at 11/15/19, or do like psionics and start with, say, four at 1st and then +1/level which you can pick of appropriate level?


Entangling Strike (Ex): At 3rd level, when the swashbuckler hits a living creature with a light or one-handed heavy blade attack, as a free action she can spend 1 panache point to Entangle the creature. The creature is Entangled for 1 round for every four swashbuckler levels. At the start of its turn, the creature can make a Reflex save (DC 10+ ½ Swashbuckler’s class level + her Intelligence modifier) as a free action to ened the effect.
A target can make a Full-Round action that provokes an Attack of Opportunity doing nothing else to free themselves automatically.

Insightful Strike (Ex): At 3rd level, while she has at least 1 panache point, a swashbuckler may add her Intelligence bonus to damage instead of her Strength modifier when she is using Precise Strike. In addition, when spending a panache point to use precise strike to dobule her precise strike bonus, the swashbuckler adds her Intelligence bonus to the attack roll.

(Adding +Int to damage on top of precise strike seemed a bit too much.)

Flourish (Ex): At 7th level, a Swashbuckler can intimidate her enemies and inspire her allies with but a cocky grin and a flourish of her weapon. By expending 1 panache point, the swashbuckler can take a Standard action to flourish her weapon attempt to demoralise all foes within 30 feet who can see her. If at least one foe fails the save, all allies in 30 feet who can see the Swashbuckler also gain a +1 morale bonus per five Swashbuckler levels to attack rolls for 1 round.

Astonishing Strike (Ex): At 15th level, a Swashbuckler can strike with such skill and agility that her opponent cannot follow her attack. When the swashbuckler hits a creature with a light or one-handed heavy blade , she can spend 1 panache point to Daze the creature for 1 round. The creature must succeed at a Will save (DC 10+ ½ Swashbuckler’s class level + her Charisma modifier) or be Dazed for 1 round.

(Was 19th on my modifed class. Left if fairly high after tweaking, since (by design) this ISN'T a mind-affecting ability, nor a Fort save, and thus you can actually Daze creatures that are immune to Stun (e.g. Undead).

Supreme Daring (Ex): At 19th level, a Swashbuckler can perform such feats that her foes are literally stunned with amazement. By expending 4 panache points, as a Swift action, she can move up to her speed and make a DC 40 Acronatics check or to make DC 40 Acrobatics or Bluff check after a successfully striking a creature with a light or one-handed heavy blade. If she succeeds, all enemies within 60 feet that can see the swashbuckler must make a Will save (DC 10+ ½ Swashbuckler class level + Charisma modifier) or be Stunned for 1 round. Mindless creatures are immune to this effect.

(Was old capstone, slightly modified; so-so on the numbers, but now at least stunning multiple things is actually something maybe WORTH being a 19th level ability...!)


So, current thought being Panache as a per-encounter resource, starting at Cha bonus plus Int bonus (maybe with an ACF for characters that want to replace Int with something?). So, in paradigm this is going down in, a character would start with 8 panache points. They'd regain 1 panache on a kill, but not a crit. (You might say get a bonus one if they kill with a crit, maybe, for style...)

Or, perhaps just leave Int off aside from Insightful Strike, and say 1+Cha, +1/round (or use the idea from the Striker and add an ability that grants you 1 panache at the start of your turn if you have 0) plus +1 on kill, (maybe +2 on kill with crit?) a bit like the afore-mentioned Mystic (I did have a good look at that and the Striker, thanks Dr_Dinosaur.) That may be the better option, actually, since it means Int is optional, but for your MAD it's a good one to have for Arcane Stunt and/or Insightful Strike, but as an optional extra.

There's maybe an arguement that I'm more inclined to make the more I think about it is that you could get Charmed Life to run off panache, rather than uses per day, as well; good Fort save slightly reduces the need for it, and it means you can afford to burn it more freely on a per encounter basis, maybe?