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Nonah_Me
2007-10-18, 03:41 PM
I have a question and a request.

Question: In the DMG, (I haven't looked, so I don't know if this has been errata or not) the prestige class Lorekeeper or master or whatever says the +1 caster level to the class you had before taking Loremaster. So if I was a cleric 3/wizard3/Mystic Theurge 10 and I began taking levels in Loremaster, would it mean I would still be getting the +1 CL in both my divine and arcane classes?

If so, It would be cheesy.

Request: I'm going to be play the before mentioned cleric3/conjurer3 in a Ravenloft campaign. I'm not too worried about the lack of turning ability, simply because alot of the undead are going to be too powerful for me to turn alot of the time anyway. I'd like to go Mystic Theurge, and I'd like to keep it core + complete divine/arcane/warrior/adventurer + Player Handbook II. What spells do you think would be good?

Edit: Duh, Feats: Spell Focus (conj) Greater Spell Focus (conj) and +1 to wis at 4th level.

I used the elite array to make this character, and he's a halfling. So it's Str 8 Dex 10 Con 13 Int 14 Wis 16 (+1 4th level) Cha 12. Max Ranks in Knowledge (arcana) Knowledge (religion), a few in spellcraft and a few in Concentration. My domains are Magic and Knowledge, and I follow Boccob. His name is Thymas Greyhand.

Aquillion
2007-10-18, 03:59 PM
No. This is the oldest trick in the book as far as Mystic Theurges are concerned. If it worked, you could do this:

Take one level in Mystic Theurge.
Take a level in some other dual-progression class (there are several); name MT as one of the two classes to advance. For the other, name one of the two classes you took within MT. Now, every time you advance this class, you gain two levels of that base class: One from MT, and one from the prestige class on the second tier.

Repeat a few times, for as many dual-progression classes as you can get into. You are now gaining multiple spellcasting levels from multiple base classes with each level you take in the 'top' prestige class. You could easily get above CL-20 spellcasting in multiple spell classes using this trick.

It doesn't work, because +1 spell progression classes like the MT are not "spellcasting" classes and have no spell progression of their own; they cannot themselves be chosen as the subject of an ability that advances spell progression in that fashion.

UglyPanda
2007-10-18, 04:11 PM
Is your DM forcing you to use the elite array for stats? If so, then you should be aware that it's meant for NPCs, not PCs. The elite array creates weak characters and if you decide to play a Mystic Theurge, you need high stats to help endure your MAD.

Nonah_Me
2007-10-18, 11:34 PM
He's not, it was late however and I didn't have any dice or a handy point buy system nearby.

In my games (my players suffer from chronic bad rolls) I use a 5d6 drop lowest two system. I hope my DM extends the courtesy.

kamikasei
2007-10-19, 04:08 AM
Is your DM forcing you to use the elite array for stats? If so, then you should be aware that it's meant for NPCs, not PCs. The elite array creates weak characters and if you decide to play a Mystic Theurge, you need high stats to help endure your MAD.

The Elite Array is the level of point-buy, distributed in the way, that the books are balanced against. It doesn't create weak characters, it makes the challenges as tough as the designers expected them to be.

SpikeFightwicky
2007-10-19, 07:00 AM
Is your DM forcing you to use the elite array for stats? If so, then you should be aware that it's meant for NPCs, not PCs. The elite array creates weak characters and if you decide to play a Mystic Theurge, you need high stats to help endure your MAD.

As Kamikasei said, plus, Elite Array is 25 point buy, which is the supposed to be the 'regular powere campaign difficulty setting'. That is why it's RPGA standard to use 25 point in character creation. Anything higher than 25 will make more powerful than average characters.

Further indications:

The elite array is most appropriate for monsters who add levels in a player character class.

Player character class, not NPC class. NPC classes are to use the non-elite array (equivalent to 15 point buy).

Aquillion
2007-10-19, 12:44 PM
And, anyway, the name should make it obvious. It's the "elite" array, not the "generic weak NPC array".

It's not the poor Elite Array's fault that everyone likes using more powerful systems now!