spectral hand for attack of opportunity

[Alexandesh]

Hi, guys!
We have a discussion with my GM on how actually a spectral hand works regarding attacks of opportunity (PF, dnd 3.5). My point is if it is considered as a melee touch attack, it can be used within its range for delivering AoOs (also touch attacks), however GM says that it is not possible, since it does not have reach. I do not understand what is the crucial difference between any kind of usual attack, which CAN be delivered by spectral hand to 100 and more feet (the amount of times you can attack per round) and AoO, which can not. It is not ranged attack, it does not require recharging etc, so the point is only the absence of the word “reach” in the description of the spell (I actually not sure that there are any spells with this word).
Thus I think that, since it is melee touch attack delivered at a distance within range of the spectral hand, it can be used in the same manner for AoOs.
Could you please share your opinion and ideas? All the rules from PF and 3.5 are in play.

[Diarmuid]

What AoO scenario are you thinking you could use a Spectral Hand for? AoO are only provoked when you are Threatening, so that's a first determination for when you can make an AoO:



You threaten all squares into which you can make a melee attack, even when it is not your turn. Generally, that means everything in all squares adjacent to your space (including diagonally). An enemy that takes certain actions while in a threatened square provokes an attack of opportunity from you. If you’re unarmed, you don’t normally threaten any squares and thus can’t make attacks of opportunity.


Then we have to think about what an AoO is and whether it could be replaced with using a Spectral Hand,



An attack of opportunity is a single melee attack, and most characters can only make one per round. You don’t have to make an attack of opportunity if you don’t want to. You make your attack of opportunity at your normal attack bonus, even if you’ve already attacked in the round.


Now lets look at what the Spectral Hand actually lets you do,



For as long as the spell lasts, any touch range spell of 4th level or lower that you cast can be delivered by the spectral hand. The spell gives you a +2 bonus on your melee touch attack roll, and attacking with the hand counts normally as an attack. The hand always strikes from your direction. The hand cannot flank targets like a creature can.


So if you had a scenario where you had a spell you were holding as a charge and someone provoked an AoO from you, I would think you could deliver that AoO as an attack from the Spectral Hand spell. This doesnt increase your threat range at all or make you threaten when you normally wouldnt.

[Alexandesh]

Thank you. However, I still worried by the following wording: "You threaten all squares into which you can make a melee attack". And, actually, the spectral hand makes MY melee touch attack. It looks like some kind of very long-reach weapon.
Once we go beyond the wording, we can imagine such a situation: my character sees, e.g., caster reading a spell, and usually he can interfere only if the caster is near him. But the spectral hand has infinite speed (or very very high, because it can deliver as much melee touch attacks as a character can make even 100 per 6 seconds) and obeying the will of the character attacks that caster, realizing extra long-reach AOO. Similar situation takes place, e.g., for kusari-gama or different throwing chains which are still melee weapons.

[Diarmuid]

The spell does not give you the inherent ability to make a melee attack into any square within range. The spell very specifically allows you to deliver any touch spell 4th level or lower within the range of the spell and includes a small bonus when doing so.

Your base ability to threaten and take AoO's has not changed in any way. Having the Spectral Hand out does not qualify you as being "armed". I'm not 100% clear on whether Holding a Charge makes you threaten. Attacking (via Touch) with a touch spell is considered "armed" and does not provoke AoO's, but the holding the charge section was not explicit either way on whether you threaten.

Even assuming it does, you're still only threatening the squares into which you can normally make a melee attack. Since you cannot simply use the Spectral Hand to make a melee attack by itself, it does not change your threat range beyond your normal limits.

[Alexandesh]

Ok, I understand your point. But what about the situation I‘ve described?

[16bearswutIdo]

The hand can only be used to deliver touch spells anyway, so unless you can cast a spell as an AoO it can't do anything in your scenario.

[Alexandesh]

I can cast chill touch and have 1/ cl touch attacks charged with negative energy without additional casting or concentration.

[Diarmuid]

You cannot cast a spell as an AoO. I described in my first response the only time when you could utilize the SH as part of an AoO.

1) If you have a touch spell cast and are holding the charge
and
2) You are holding a weapon or are otherwise considered "armed"
and
3) Someone in your threatened area were to provoke an AoO from you
then
You could use the SH to deliver the touch spell as an AoO on them

Technically, if you somehow were to achieve the ability to threaten more squares via a reach weapon/spell/other shenanigans then I could see an edge case allowing you do instead utilize the SH to replace the AoO from the reach weapon. I dont think I'd let it fly at my table as RaI, but I'm sure someone could argue better than I that it's RaW.

At no point would you be able to utilize the SH to make an AoO further than your threatened range.

[16bearswutIdo]

Even if you cast the spell on your turn and let the charge sit in your hand, it does not work.


Your hand does not have the ability to deliver AoOs because spectral hand doesn't specify that it threatens that square. It allows you to cast a spell into it and make an attack into a square. That does not mean YOU threaten that area with a melee attack, the hand can simply hit into the square. The same way that if a character is holding a spear, and someone casts a spell 15 feet away from him, he doesn't get an AoO because he could throw the spear and hit him.