What Archetypes would you like to see in the future?

[DragonSorcererX]

I'm curious to what the community wants to see from archetypes. For me, I just wanna a Divine Bard archetype called Evangelist or Preacher.

[Misterwhisper]

Still waiting on any rogue subclass with extra attack.

Duelist Fighter, with options for a single weapon and no shield

Elemental focus wild shape druid. Like Moon but all elemental related.

Zen Archer Monk

Unarmed Barbarian subclass

Weave Patron Warlock.

Bard of Lies specializing in deception and insight

Spellslinger wizard specializing in empowered wands as "guns"

[Man_Over_Game]

Mutator Wizard
An option that lets Barbarian and Monk multiclass better, whether that's a Strength Monk or a Zen Barbarian.
A complex and supportive melee character.


Most of the other stuff I want is generally covered in the Artificer concepts. Although I would have liked if the Artificer had a mech suit instead of something like a pet.

[No brains]

Something based around using hp as a resource for more than taking hits. I want a character who walks on the razor's edge like they took the devil deals in Binding of Isaac.

[DragonSorcererX]

Unarmed Barbarian subclass


Strength Monk
Yeah, I would love a strenght-based unarmed combatant like a Brawler.

[Daphne]

I want to see more non-magical Barbarian paths, although I think this is unlikely. Also, more simple options like the Champion for the Fighter, which is also unlikely...

From a mechanical perspective though, I'd want to see more subclasses that give flat bonuses to saving throws for martials other than the Paladin.

I also find really strange how there still no Roguish Archetype that expands the list of Sneak Attack-able weapons.

[da newt]

I'm curious to what the community wants to see from archetypes. For me, I just wanna a Divine Bard archetype called Evangelist or Preacher.

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[ZorroGames]

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None. Happy with status quo.

[DragonSorcererX]

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I'm not liking the lack of blue color on your post sir.

[ZorroGames]

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[FilthyLucre]

I'm curious to what the community wants to see from archetypes. For me, I just wanna a Divine Bard archetype called Evangelist or Preacher.

Alienist wizard conjurer.

[solidork]

Feywild Sorcerer that gets the Druid list.

[DragonSorcererX]

Alienist wizard conjurer.

Maybe in 5e this one would not suck like I heard it did in 3.5.

[Azuresun]

I'd like to see the Sacred Fist from 3e reappear as a Cleric or Monk subclass.

Also from 3e, the Spellthief. Stealing actual spells or abilities could get wonky, but something like a selection of specific effects that you can use after sneak attacking a target with a similar ability (ie, hit someone with a teleport ability, and you can teleport a short distance).

[Anderlith]

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[Peelee]

The Mod on the Silver Mountain: Thread re-opened. Let's keep discussion firmly rooted in the gaming realm, please.

[Undyne]

I'm curious to what the community wants to see from archetypes. For me, I just wanna a Divine Bard archetype called Evangelist or Preacher.

Fiendblood and Feyshine Sorcerer. One is a Fiend based sorcerer and the other is a Fey based one.

[Anymage]

Alienist wizard conjurer.

Getting cozy with the far realm is pretty heavily the shtick of GOOlocks at this point, and I wonder what would make a far realm conjurer wizard meaningfully and mechanically different from just slapping a few cosmetic tentacles on an existing conjurer wizard and calling it a day. I'm not saying that a far realm wizard subclass isn't viable, just that it'd be tricky to do right.

Edit to add: What I'd personally like to see is more builds that encourage different stats, or even allow a class to run off of a stat that would seem non-core. Possibly even to the level of changing save proficiencies. In particular, I'd like to see enough Int/Cha maneuvers that the 4e warlord can be reborn from the battlemaster.

[Aett_Thorn]

Thug Rogue - medium armor prod and ability to use club and mace for sneak attack damage. Plus other thug-like things.

Fey-based Sorc specializing in Enchantment effects

“Evil” subclasses for most of the classes we have like we do for the Cleric and Paladin. Not to play, but to give DMs some options as well.

[Teaguethebean]

Still waiting on any rogue subclass with extra attack.

Duelist Fighter, with options for a single weapon and no shield

Elemental focus wild shape druid. Like Moon but all elemental related.

Zen Archer Monk

Unarmed Barbarian subclass

Weave Patron Warlock.

Bard of Lies specializing in deception and insight

Spellslinger wizard specializing in empowered wands as "guns"

A phew of these can be done with existing stuff a Duelist fighter is just a swashbuckler, a lies bard could be an inquisitive rogue mixed with whispers bard and the final one could be done with artificer artillerist

[Misterwhisper]

A phew of these can be done with existing stuff a Duelist fighter is just a swashbuckler, a lies bard could be an inquisitive rogue mixed with whispers bard and the final one could be done with artificer artillerist

There is a rather large difference between a swashbuckler rogue and a single weapon fighter.

[DragonSorcererX]

A phew of these can be done with existing stuff a Duelist fighter is just a swashbuckler, a lies bard could be an inquisitive rogue mixed with whispers bard and the final one could be done with artificer artillerist

I think he meant an archetype based around a feature like Arcane Firearm from the Artillerist but without all the cannon stuff.

[Misterwhisper]

I think he meant an archetype based around a feature like Arcane Firearm from the Artillerist but without all the cannon stuff.

Kind of like having the ability to turn any damaging spell with a range more than touch into a ray or line spell.

Adding int to damage of it later

Fireball can become fire ray, cone of cold becomes line of cold etc.

A ray and beam based class that focuses it through a wand or something, kind of like the spellslinger subclass in pathfinder.

Kind of sucks at subtle spells but protection and damaging spells work amazingly well.

[DragonSorcererX]

Kind of like having the ability to turn any damaging spell with a range more than touch into a ray or line spell.

Adding int to damage of it later

Fireball can become fire ray, cone of cold becomes line of cold etc.

A ray and beam based class that focuses it through a wand or something, kind of like the spellslinger subclass in pathfinder.

Kind of sucks at subtle spells but protection and damaging spells work amazingly well.

From what you described it sounds like a less powerful Evoker, because "Ball" Spells with the ability to exclude people from the blast > Turning a ball or cone into a line and hitting less people.

But if it's not for the optimization it would be cool.

[Misterwhisper]

From what you described it sounds like a less powerful Evoker, because "Ball" Spells with the ability to exclude people from the blast > Turning a ball or cone into a line and hitting less people.

But if it's not for the optimization it would be cool.

Maybe more like the old school arcane archers who fired spells in arrows but with rays.

Ex. Instead of a normal fireball, make a ranger attack with a fire bolt type damage and when it hits the fire ball goes off.

I also miss the good version of arcane archer, make that a wizard subclass and I am good to go too.

[Millstone85]

Cleric:

Travel Domain

Paladin:

Oath of Balance
Oath of Freedom

Sorcerer:

Sea Sorcery
Stone Sorcery
Sun Sorcery

Warlock:

The Genie
The Inevitable
The Vestige

[Dienekes]

If warlord never becomes a class:

Tactician Fighter
Inspirational Fighter
Recon Leader Ranger
Noble Rogue
Warchief Barbarian
Grand Master of the Order Paladin

Getting away from that, what I really want to see are more types of mundane warriors.

Formation Fighter
Swashbuckler Fighter
Grappler Fighter/Barbarian
Raider Barbarian
Strength based Thug Rogue

That sort of thing.

[DragonSorcererX]

If warlord never becomes a class:

Tactician Fighter
Inspirational Fighter
Recon Leader Ranger
Noble Rogue
Warchief Barbarian
Grand Master of the Order Paladin

Getting away from that, what I really want to see are more types of mundane warriors.

Formation Fighter
Swashbuckler Fighter
Grappler Fighter/Barbarian
Raider Barbarian

That sort of thing.

For a quick and dirty solution on the Warlord, you could take Valor Bard and refluff all the spells as being non-magical inspirational stuff and only select the appropriate spells.

[Dienekes]

For a quick and dirty solution on the Warlord, you could take Valor Bard and refluff all the spells as being non-magical inspirational stuff and only select the appropriate spells.

I’ve tried it. Doesn’t really work well if you actually follow the spell component rules and restrictions and ends up in the weird spot where anti magic means your tactician can’t be tactical. It also doesn’t really feel right, at least to me.

Honestly I’ve never really felt like spell slots have the gameplay feel of being magical. But they certainly don’t feel mechanically like a commander.

Though again, I have used it. And it worked okish. I just want something that works great.

[RSP]

Wouldn’t mind a melee Sorcerer option.

[DragonSorcererX]

I’ve tried it. Doesn’t really work well if you actually follow the spell component rules and restrictions and ends up in the weird spot where anti magic means your tactician can’t be tactical. It also doesn’t really feel right, at least to me.

Honestly I’ve never really felt like spell slots have the gameplay feel of being magical. But they certainly don’t feel mechanically like a commander.

Though again, I have used it. And it worked okish. I just want something that works great.

Yeah, it would have to be a new class with something like the Tome of Battle maneuvers, except that it would only have access to buffing and control ones.

[Anderlith]

Eberron Bone Knight would be nice

[Sigreid]

Master of many forms. While some on this board hate wildshape on their druid, I think it is the coolest feature and would happily give up all casting to turn into whatever suits the task.

[DragonSorcererX]

Eberron Bone Knight would be nice

In the other Keith Baker 5e book, Morgrave Miscellany, there is a Bone Knight and it is a Fighter archetype kinda like a Divine Eldritch Knight, it's not official though.

[T.G. Oskar]

First, my suggestions.

Barbarian
Path of the Bear Warrior. Originally appearing on Oriental Adventures for the 3.5 version, it basically allowed you to turn your uses of Rage into a physical transformation to a Bear. Furthermore, as you gain levels, your transformation becomes more serious. You can also combine your transformation with Rage. So, in essence, the Path would allow you to turn into the simplest bear (Black) at 3rd level, eventually allowing you to turn into Brown and eventually Polar Bear at higher levels.

Bard
College of Inspiration. Who misses Inspire Courage? The main trait of this college is to get the Bless spell for free, spend uses of Bardic Inspiration to allow all those affected by Bless to add the d4 to damage rolls, increase the size of the die for the round if you spend your Bardic Inspiration, and eventually be able to use Bardic Inspiration as a reaction to deny the need to make a concentration save when having a concentration spell. The fluff would easily be justified as a Bard that merges its music with its magic as a form of inspiring allies.

Fighter
Knight Phantom Martial Archetype. Essentially a variant of the Eldritch Knight for Eberron (specifically for Aundairian characters), this could be a setting subclass variant that allows you to exchange some things from the Eldritch Knight. For example, the Knight Phantom could replace Abjuration or Evocation spells for Illusion spells to determine the spells you can cast, and exchange Eldritch Strike for the ability to cast Phantom Steed as a ritual, plus gaining the spell for free.

Monk
Way of the Wrestler. While some have been done, this way focuses on grappling opponents. Partly a rehash of the Reaping Mauler, but adding the fluff of wrestling; either as a brave masked wrestler, or an evil heel. Moves would allow their grapples to be more devastating, sorta like the moves of the Open Hand, plus a sweet Counter Throw ability.

Paladin
Oath of the Cavalry. Essentially a rehash of the Cavalier kit, it grants Find Steed and Find Greater Steed for free, the ability to use your CD to duplicate the effect of Heal to the mount, the ability to improve any mount you ride (including your bound mount), and a capstone power that makes them and their mounts the most dangerous opponents.
Oath of the Shining Blade. Essentially a rehash of the Shining Blade of Heironeous, this oath would grant Paladins a measure of access to thunder and lightning spells and abilities. It's main ability, accessible through its Channel Divinity, is the ability to temporarily enchant your sword with the ability to deal lightning damage and treat it as a magical weapon.

Warlock
The Great Wyrm Patron. If you recall the Dragonfire Adept, it was essentially a warlock that gained its powers from dragons. Rather than have Eldritch Blast, they had the ability to use a breath weapon at will; it started as either a cone or line of fire damage, but you could use invocations to change the damage. Although it steps on the toes of a Draconic Sorcerer, the Great Wyrm patron would instead allow them to use a small "gout" of a specific element, which improves as if it were a cantrip. This could come with new dragon-flavored invocations, such as the ability to develop dragon wings that allow flight.

Wizard
School of Geometry. Another old kit, the Geometer Wizard focuses mostly on trap spells and the ability to alter a modicum of their spellcasting through gestures, rather than words (opposite of the Onomancer, the new "truenamer"). Geometers could be capable of casting spells without a verbal component, but they MUST make a somatic component, by spending their bonus action to add a special geometric sigil, and make spells such as Glyph of Warding and Symbol harder to resist, and so forth.

Multiple choice
Dervish/Tempest. Namely, a subclass that excels in using two weapons. A Barbarian, a Bard, a Fighter, a Ranger or a Rogue could easily get this option, though being a more technique-inclined subclass, it'd most likely be related to a class without spells (hence, no Ranger). You'd essentially gain proficiency in Performance, probable Expertise, the ability to treat certain martial slashing weapons (longsword, battleaxe) as finesse weapons, and maybe the ability to make an extra attack when using the Attack action, provided you have a weapon in each hand.

As for the mentioned options...


Alienist wizard conjurer.

Second this. The Alienist was a cool idea, and could exist beyond the GOOlock; while the latter makes contact with a powerful alien entity and serves it, the Alienist actually wants to bring those aliens to this world, therefore gaining the ability to alter the creatures they can summon into pseudonatural versions, and a smattering of psionic abilities in exchange for slowly growing madder.


Also from 3e, the Spellthief. Stealing actual spells or abilities could get wonky, but something like a selection of specific effects that you can use after sneak attacking a target with a similar ability (ie, hit someone with a teleport ability, and you can teleport a short distance).

Well, the Arcane Trickster's "capstone" ability IS Spellthief. You steal knowledge of one spell, provided you could cast it with your own spells. I can't see an actual Spellthief because of this.


Kind of like having the ability to turn any damaging spell with a range more than touch into a ray or line spell.

Adding int to damage of it later

Fireball can become fire ray, cone of cold becomes line of cold etc.

A ray and beam based class that focuses it through a wand or something, kind of like the spellslinger subclass in pathfinder.

Kind of sucks at subtle spells but protection and damaging spells work amazingly well.

Spellwarp Sniper?


Eberron Bone Knight would be nice

I was pretty happy to see the Bone Knight as an NPC in the most recent Eberron splat. They could make a decent Fighter subclass, yeah, but personally they're essentially Oathbreakers with a handful of abilities replaced.

[Dr. Cliché]

Master of many forms. While some on this board hate wildshape on their druid, I think it is the coolest feature and would happily give up all casting to turn into whatever suits the task.

This.

I also think it could be fun to have some shapeshifting abilities on non-Druid classes.

e.g. a Ranger with Wild Shape, a Warlock Skinchanger etc.

[Grey Watcher]

I've always thought Sorcerer needed a Just Generically Magical Bloodline. The Bloodlines available all hook into some fairly specific gimmick, either mechanically or lore-wise (or both), which is a good thing, don't get me wrong, but if you're looking to play "just has magic powers" without necessarily tying it to a theme of "difficult to control" or "aligned with a specific element" or "reminiscent of a particular type of creature," you're more-or-less out of luck. To a lesser extent this is also true of Clerics, Warlocks, and Wizards, but they get enough flexibility and/or customization options that the subclass doesn't feel quite so confining.

I'm not sure what it would look like, but I'm thinking something analogous to the Champion for Fighters: you don't get much beyond what the base class gives you, but you do those basic functions better. Maybe you can take more Metamagics or have extra Sorcery Points or something. I'm not sure the best way to work out the details, but I'd really like to see a Vanilla Sorcerer option.


Master of many forms. While some on this board hate wildshape on their druid, I think it is the coolest feature and would happily give up all casting to turn into whatever suits the task.


This.

I also think it could be fun to have some shapeshifting abilities on non-Druid classes.

e.g. a Ranger with Wild Shape, a Warlock Skinchanger etc.

I think even stuff like Fighter, Rogue, and Barbarian should have sub-classes that use shapeshifting. It seems a common enough fantasy/sci-fi trope for someone whose power is shapechanging without it being a subset of some broader magical ability that it seems like it should be reflected in the available mechanics.

[Spacehamster]

Demonicly corrupted Barbarian more offensively focused, using HP to get combat bonuses perhaps.

[Speely]

A 1/3 spellcaster Monk. Every other "martial" class has a spellcasting subclass or has spells as part of their base class, excepting Barbarians, of course. I want an Arcane Trickster/Eldritch Knight equivalent for Monks. 4e monks don't cut it for me.

I homebrewed a Druid-like Monk, "The Way of the Wild" to address this. Basically a 1/3 spellcaster with access to the Druid Spell list who can learn to use known Druid cantrips as bonus actions and stuff. It's fun, but an official spellcasting Monk would be cool.

[DragonSorcererX]

I was thinking about it and I would like to have a Healer archetype for Wizard that is basically a medieval medic kinda like a plague doctor.

Although as a DM I can simply take the Divine Wizard from Unearthed Arcana, limit it to the Life Domain and limit his cleric spell selection to Cure Wounds and Restoration kind of spells, I would like to have an official thing.

Edit: Maybe it could also be a Pacifist Wizard that gains bonuses if he doesn't attacks or casts offensive spells, this would help balance the power level of this character and make it less versatile.

[Sigreid]

I've always thought Sorcerer needed a Just Generically Magical Bloodline. The Bloodlines available all hook into some fairly specific gimmick, either mechanically or lore-wise (or both), which is a good thing, don't get me wrong, but if you're looking to play "just has magic powers" without necessarily tying it to a theme of "difficult to control" or "aligned with a specific element" or "reminiscent of a particular type of creature," you're more-or-less out of luck. To a lesser extent this is also true of Clerics, Warlocks, and Wizards, but they get enough flexibility and/or customization options that the subclass doesn't feel quite so confining.

I'm not sure what it would look like, but I'm thinking something analogous to the Champion for Fighters: you don't get much beyond what the base class gives you, but you do those basic functions better. Maybe you can take more Metamagics or have extra Sorcery Points or something. I'm not sure the best way to work out the details, but I'd really like to see a Vanilla Sorcerer option.





I think even stuff like Fighter, Rogue, and Barbarian should have sub-classes that use shapeshifting. It seems a common enough fantasy/sci-fi trope for someone whose power is shapechanging without it being a subset of some broader magical ability that it seems like it should be reflected in the available mechanics.

I would take my shape shifting on any base class. :)

[rickayelm]

I would like them to bring back incarnum, I think it was one of the cooler ideas from 3.5. I would also like a class that allows plane touched races to focus on maximizing their planar powers.

[Dr. Cliché]

I would like them to bring back incarnum, I think it was one of the cooler ideas from 3.5.

The issue with Incarnum was that it was like those really niche MTG cards that only really work against one specific deck in one specific set.

As in, it didn't really interact with anything beyond the tiny pool of monsters in that one book. Everything else had no Incarnum of their own, nor anything that specifically affected PCs who did.

It's not the worst thing but, unless you're specifically running an Incarnum campaign, it does make them feel very out of place in the world.

[stoutstien]

I was thinking about it and I would like to have a Healer archetype for Wizard that is basically a medieval medic kinda like a plague doctor.

Although as a DM I can simply take the Divine Wizard from Unearthed Arcana, limit it to the Life Domain and limit his cleric spell selection to Cure Wounds and Restoration kind of spells, I would like to have an official thing.

Edit: Maybe it could also be a Pacifist Wizard that gains bonuses if he doesn't attacks or casts offensive spells, this would help balance the power level of this character and make it less versatile.

Good news the mark of healing can turn any halfling wizard into a solid doctor.

[DragonSorcererX]

Good news the mark of healing can turn any halfling wizard into a solid doctor.

For me the real versions of the Dragonmarks are on the Wayfinder's Guide and Morgrave Miscellany, not in this WOTC corruption of Eberron.

Keith Baker > The whole of WOTC!

[Anderlith]

For me the real versions of the Dragonmarks are on the Wayfinder's Guide and Morgrave Miscellany, not in this WOTC corruption of Eberron.

Keith Baker > The whole of WOTC!

This is very true. I wish he could have led the team on the new boom

[rickayelm]

By incarnum I meant magic of incarrnum, it was a d&d 3.5 supplement.

[Talionis]

Master Thrower, Chameleon and Factotum from 3.5.

[Pufferwockey]

I want to see more non-magical Barbarian paths, although I think this is unlikely. Also, more simple options like the Champion for the Fighter, which is also unlikely...

From a mechanical perspective though, I'd want to see more subclasses that give flat bonuses to saving throws for martials other than the Paladin.

I also find really strange how there still no Roguish Archetype that expands the list of Sneak Attack-able weapons.

Seconded on more non-magical barbarian paths. More non-magical options in general. I like trying to make a gish, and I like a high(ish) magic setting. Even in high magic, though, it starts to feel less special to me when the whole party is tossing around magic effects, and it's downright ridiculous in low magic. That might be on the dm but it'd be easier to ask players not to play Path of Spirits Help me Please, or Path of Plus I Have Lightning Powers, or Arcane Archer(couldn't think of something silly) etc if there were more options for non magical characters.

More superhuman-yet-mundane abilities, like the more insanely athletic less overtly magical ki abilities, or the crazy resilience of raging barbarians, would be good. More abilities reflecting extreme levels of competence at various things would be better. I think Barbarians get shafted the worst when it comes to a lack of non magical options. Unless you count Rangers, which I do, or Paladins, which... i don't know. Are people asking for a non magical paladin that's not a just a fighter who owns a horse RPed as a Paladin?

Bit of an aside but I was really excited when I first got in to 5e and saw something called Path of the Berserker. My head nearly exploded when I got around to learning the turn economy and realized that Path of the Berserker not only didn't synergize with two weapon fighting (which would have been fine) but actively conflicted with it. I thought everyone (who bothered to care about this type of thing) agreed that The Berserker as an archetype or trope or w/e was either a Viking in light armor or a Celt wearing nothing but the color blue, or similar, either one probably nuts on some shaman or druidic "potion," coming at you with dual wielded axes. I thought I must have been mistaken about that archetype's popularity, and I still might be. I felt pretty vindicated in my indignation, though, when the fighting game For Honor came out and one of the playable characters was a Viking hero called The Berserker who dual wields axes. Clearly it's not just me.

So hey maybe a non-magical barbarian path that leans in to dual wielding a bit? I reckon having it geared more to damage output than damage soaking would be prohibitively redundant, which is a shame because that's what it should be. It should also have Mindless Rage. It's such a cool ability. An effective mechanic having loads of potential to turn around what might otherwise have been catastrophic situations for a party without being OP that also perfectly fit's the flavour of the subclass. It's a shame it's shackled to that TWO HANDED WEAPON EXCLUSIVE ABBERATION. Wow, sorry, I didn't realise how angry I still was about the Path of the Berserker.

How about an officially sanctioned non-magical Ranger. The scout subclass for the rogue isn't martial enough. There's a scout archetype for the fighter floating around the internet, apparently originally UA but who knows, and it's pretty meh. Looks underpowered in combat but it bizzarely ends up with like 5 skill proficiencies.

I'm looking for The Master Hunter here. Preternaturaly alert to changes in the sounds the birds and small animals make when Something Is Wrong In These Woods. Knows the outlands and the laws of the jungle in a way that may be impossible by real life standads but isn't literally magic in the context of DnD. Maybe something like a sneak attack feature that differs from the rogues a bit. Maybe you can use it twice in one turn but you only get another die every third level(or whatever someone actually good at balance thinks) or it's a different size of die or you can only use it on the first round of combat. Maybe just play with the conditions under which it can be used so if you charge out hiding in bush 30 feet and attack in melee you can still use it even though you're not unseen but merely having another ally within 5 feet of the target wouldn't be good enough to keep triggering it the rest of combat. Some love for archery that doesn't rely on spells would be good but maybe the aforementioned sneak attack thing would do the job. While I'm wishing upon a star a Natural Explorer type feature that doesn't feel like it's mechanically punishing you for venturing forth from your homeland (you know, like an adventurer might) would be nice.*

I'd like to see some kind of potion brewing class, maybe a subclass for the druid? What I have in mind certainly has a sort of druid-y vibe. could balance heal availability with more total available heals but less facility to administer them in combat... Dunno what you'd throw in there to make it fun to play in combat situations, maybe some thrown potions as grenade type weapons that could be more oriented to area denial or weird hallucinatory effects than dealing damage. Maybe they can distribute limited antidotes to their damaging concoctions to some party members, maybe only at later levels. And they'd be THE GUY for poisons and diseases and effects that might be a little beyond Lay on Hands.

I'd also get behind a rogue archetype that could sneak attack with more weapons, maybe, strength weapons. I mean, heck, if you managed to build a strength rogue I'd say go nut's with it if I was in charge. On the other hand I feel like the rogue already gets a lot of love. Remember that time they seriously considered a subclass that could sneak attack every turn, with no conditions? Glad they backed off to only usually sneak attacking.



*Those recent UA alternative class features were alright but I liked the one from Revised Ranger a lot better. Tracking and stealthing at normal speed feels right. Doubling foraged food is a great mechanic that allows them to contribute significantly to desperate survival situations without just hand waving them away, and as I recall the only thing that contributed to combat mechanics directly was always having advantage on initiative and advantage on attacks against creatures that haven't acted yet. I don't think that's too crazy. For one thing, going first in initiative isn't universally better, only usually. The way turn mechanics shake out it can be a problem. More importantly it's a mechanic that perfectly fit's the nature of the rangers special brand of badassery. They don't drill and hone fighting systems to perfection like a fighter or monk. They aren't unstoppable juggernauts like the barbarian. They're alert and quick on the draw. They aren't just alert, they are the most alert.

[T.G. Oskar]

A 1/3 spellcaster Monk. Every other "martial" class has a spellcasting subclass or has spells as part of their base class, excepting Barbarians, of course. I want an Arcane Trickster/Eldritch Knight equivalent for Monks. 4e monks don't cut it for me.

Well, Four Elements' Monks has issues, yeah, but giving it a separate resource completely invalidates that subclass, and as you can see, that's something the devs aren't keen on. (The Revised Ranger was shelved because they wanted the PHB Ranger to remain, and on closer examination, you'll notice the issues are mostly the class features themselves.) I'd expect them to do a fix to the 4Elements Monks, and I feel odd that they didn't do that kind of pass (they added content to the Battlemaster Fighter, after all).

That said, I would love WotC to set their focus on the Psion/previous Mystic, so that Psionics can actually exist. In that regard, a Monk subclass related to Psionics (Way of the Mind) could be developed, which grants the Monk a measure of psionic potential. Maybe that could give them some clues on how to fix 4Elements' Monks so that they can be useful.


Master Thrower, Chameleon and Factotum from 3.5.

I can easily see Master Thrower as a Rogue archetype, maybe as part of what was meant to be its original incarnation (IIRC, the Master Thrower was meant to be actually the throwing mastery portion of the Invisible Blade, but WotC at the time decided to split it into two different PrCs). Take some cues from the College of Blades Bard, by giving them a fighting style (either Two-Weapon Fighting or Thrown Weapon Fighting), give them a feint ability that works at a distance, the ability to shove an opponent at a distance (thus allowing you to move an opponent tactically, or knock them prone), and so on. It actually has a good amount of abilities between the two PrCs that could make for a pretty devastating Roguish Archetype.

As for Factotum/Chameleon...I feel it's unnecessary, since the Bard's already that. Think about it - Bardic Inspiration IS the Factotum's Inspiration, it can cast spells from nearly every class, it has solid fighting capabilities...sure, it misses on Turn Und...I mean, Channel Divinity, and it's more Charisma-focused than Intelligence-focused, but for the most part it's very solid nonetheless. A Rogue could have a similar subclass, where it'd get the Bardic Inspiration class feature but only usable on itself, but it wouldn't feel like the Factotum (and the 15th level ability it had, where you could use the class features of other classes up to 3 times, but only once each, as a 15th level character was pretty dope, but also a bit too strong IMO). I mean...sure, you could get a number of Inspiration points equal to your Intelligence modifier, rechargeable every short rest (remember that Inspiration recharged after every battle, so...), the ability to cast a few spells much like the Four Elements monk (and you can see how that turned out...), steal the Thief's Use Magic Device ability (oddly ironic), and maybe have Cunning Brilliance as that capstone...but it wouldn't feel as well as the old Factotum.

And that's for the Factotum. The Chameleon is mostly irrelevant with the Bard existing, and the multiclassing itself. College of Blades and College of War already grant Extra Attack, they get 9th level spells, and Magical Secrets to snatch spells from other places. If you really need Sneak Attack, or more arcane or divine spells, you can multiclass and snatch those, and provided you know what you're doing, you can actually get a solid class itself. So, as it stands, while the Factotum is doable but the Bard is already just as good (if not better), the Chameleon is pretty much redundant.

Regarding Incarnum:
Do you know that Incarnum is actually doable in 5e? I mean, one of the main aspects of it (chakra binds) already exists in 5e to some amount (basically, it's attunement). The other aspects (soulmelds) are basically magic items, and the format used in 5e for magic items already leads to some impressive ways to work with soulmelds. Finally, the last bit (Essentia) can be worked out decently, if you use the rules for the Mystic (in fact, the way the Mystic works, it does resemble Incarnum a bit. You could say the Mystic worked better as an Incarnum user than as a psychic). What you DO need, though, is a way to work that as a class, and also to work subclasses that could benefit from it. Thing is, Incarnum only had three classes to work with, a handful of PrCs (of which one was a way to work with Incarnum in a different way, another was a racial class, and a few others were mostly "theurge" classes, such as the Soulcaster and the Sapphire Hierarch), and essentially no other content (pun not intended). As someone else mentioned, it was a self-contained book, much like ToB, and received no support. Now, I would love to see that system resurface (it was a concept you either loved or hated, and that gave a strong first impression; either you hated it because of how complicated it seemed, or you loved it because it was a unique concept.

[DragonSorcererX]

Well, Four Elements' Monks has issues, yeah, but giving it a separate resource completely invalidates that subclass, and as you can see, that's something the devs aren't keen on. (The Revised Ranger was shelved because they wanted the PHB Ranger to remain, and on closer examination, you'll notice the issues are mostly the class features themselves.) I'd expect them to do a fix to the 4Elements Monks, and I feel odd that they didn't do that kind of pass (they added content to the Battlemaster Fighter, after all).

Yeah, when he said he wants a 1/3 caster monk I also thought that if WOTC were to do it they would do something underwhelming like the 4e monk, maybe we will have a proper caster monk in 5.5 or 6e.

[iTreeby]

One of my favorite multiclasses conceptually is sorcerer /ranger. Mechanically, it just does not work, so I'd like to see that as an archetype for sorcerers. I want metamagic on wierd nature spells dang it.


I'd also like to have incarnum ported to 5th, it was cool to have a character who could rebuild themselves every day to suite the situations they anticipate or to be able to rebuild around magic items the DM dropped.

[Nikushimi]

Personally I'd like to see a bit more martial magic classes. Something I'd call a "Spellblade".

Similar to the Eldritch Knight, but more imbuing their attacks with magical properties of sorts.

We have Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade, but Booming Blades usefulness is in the hands of the DM. The DM doesn't like you using that spell? Well, they just won't have the creature willing move. So it never takes effect. A bit petty, but I've known DM's to do that. As for Green Flame Blade it just falls off pretty quickly imo. The plus side is their both cantrips, but limited to the types of damage and what they can do.

So while the Eldritch Knight definitely has that magical and martial thing going for it, but to me it just falls short of feeling like an actual arcane martial fighter. It feels more like a fighter who just happened to pick up a few spells. Doesn't have the oomph to me.

So for me a class that grants you magical abilities with your martial weapons would be cool.

Hence why I called it Spellblade.

An example of what this class would do.

1. Imbue their weapons with different sources of energy. Acid, Fire, Cold, Lightning, Sonic, Force, Radiant, Necrotic, etc. As part of their attack.
2. Able to use their weapon as a focus to send a wave of this energy at enemies. Like a Sonic Slash, Radiant Slash, Fire Slash, etc. that grants you some range with the attack and the potential to hit multiple enemies.
3. An innate Shield and Absorb Elements ability that can later on also be used to help allies or encompass everyone.
4. A teleport and attack ability or something (which I know technically Eldritch Knights get when using Action surge later on in levels)
5. And a bit of magic for more utility stuff than combat.

Basically, they would be able to imbue their weapons with magical properties as well as help protect allies magically.

So something like that I feel would be cool. I know we have some magical martial classes like Eldritch Knight and to an extent the Archer and Arcane Trickster as well as Pact of the Blade Warlock, but still.

Something like this would be pretty cool.

[DragonSorcererX]

Personally I'd like to see a bit more martial magic classes. Something I'd call a "Spellblade".

Similar to the Eldritch Knight, but more imbuing their attacks with magical properties of sorts.

We have Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade, but Booming Blades usefulness is in the hands of the DM. The DM doesn't like you using that spell? Well, they just won't have the creature willing move. So it never takes effect. A bit petty, but I've known DM's to do that. As for Green Flame Blade it just falls off pretty quickly imo. The plus side is their both cantrips, but limited to the types of damage and what they can do.

So while the Eldritch Knight definitely has that magical and martial thing going for it, but to me it just falls short of feeling like an actual arcane martial fighter. It feels more like a fighter who just happened to pick up a few spells. Doesn't have the oomph to me.

So for me a class that grants you magical abilities with your martial weapons would be cool.

Hence why I called it Spellblade.

An example of what this class would do.

1. Imbue their weapons with different sources of energy. Acid, Fire, Cold, Lightning, Sonic, Force, Radiant, Necrotic, etc. As part of their attack.
2. Able to use their weapon as a focus to send a wave of this energy at enemies. Like a Sonic Slash, Radiant Slash, Fire Slash, etc. that grants you some range with the attack and the potential to hit multiple enemies.
3. An innate Shield and Absorb Elements ability that can later on also be used to help allies or encompass everyone.
4. A teleport and attack ability or something (which I know technically Eldritch Knights get when using Action surge later on in levels)
5. And a bit of magic for more utility stuff than combat.

Basically, they would be able to imbue their weapons with magical properties as well as help protect allies magically.

So something like that I feel would be cool. I know we have some magical martial classes like Eldritch Knight and to an extent the Archer and Arcane Trickster as well as Pact of the Blade Warlock, but still.

Something like this would be pretty cool.

What you described is basically the 4e Swordmage, which was one of the few cool things about 4e, and if it were to be done in 5e like the way you described it shouldn't be an archetype, it should be it's own class.

[rickayelm]

A couple other things I would like to see the celestial toymakerr for artisan, and either a Dragon warlock or the dragons breath adept class.

[djreynolds]

A fighter, barbarian, or monk who focuses on natural attacks of races like minotaurs etc

[DragonSorcererX]

A fighter, barbarian, or monk who focuses on natural attacks of races like minotaurs etc

This would be cool, a natural weapon fighter for races like minotaur, aarakocra, and tabaxi.

Also, it's not exactly what you want but an official lycanthrope archetype similar to the Order of the Lycan for Blood Hunters would be cool, specially now that we have official shifters.

[MustaKrakish]

For me it would be:

Barbarian Chieftain: when the rage is up you inspire others, maybe use physical attributes for social.

Bard College of Melody / Harmonics (something like that): Focused on music and performance, can affect crowds, and take the artistic part of the bard to the next level.

Cleric - Darkness / Void / Night domain.

Fighter - Jaggernaought, huge, heavy, massively armored wrecking ball.

Rogue - Church agent (Divine Seeker)

Paladin - Oath of Nobility, light armor, diplomat, fencing and dueling.

Monk - Not sure... maybe Zen Archer?

Ranger - tough, rough forester with great weapon and hounds.

Wizard - graft master, sawing different parts of creatures to himself to get some of their powers (it was a PRC long time ago).

Sorcerer - Fiendish blood.

Warlock - Dragon and Elemental pact.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

Support classes like the Warlord in 4E (not just healing, in other words, and able to do support stuff throughout the encounter/day unlike Battlemaster Fighter). A bunch of martial options got mentioned up-thread (and I heartily support those ideas), but I think that Warlock would also be an interesting destination for a support subclass, with at-will subclass specific invocations devoted to moving allies around, granting them bonuses, and generally filling the leader role from 4E.

[Luccan]

I know we're likely to never get Modern stuff in an actual book, but if another UA about it comes up I'd love to see subclasses for the remaining classes. Even those that wouldn't have a magical interaction with technology could stand to have subclasses focused around guns, hacking, cars, etc. Also seems like a good place to throw that unarmed Barb, street brawler type stuff (proficiency with improvised weapons as well, scaling its damage with unarmed strike?)

It's weird we don't have a real elementalist caster yet. 4e Monk wouldn't quite qualify even if it didn't have problems, but the closest thing is Dragon and Storm Sorc, both of which have fairly narrow focus on the kinds of element. I see this as probably a druid, with more focus on the classical four elements or "natural" damage types(without picking one) than plants and animals. Circle of the Primordial?

I really want a druid answer to Divine Soul. Feyborn Sorcerer? But like, the lesser fey that are about nature more than seducing random humans.

[T.G. Oskar]

For me it would be:

Barbarian Chieftain: when the rage is up you inspire others, maybe use physical attributes for social.

Bard College of Melody / Harmonics (something like that): Focused on music and performance, can affect crowds, and take the artistic part of the bard to the next level.

Cleric - Darkness / Void / Night domain.

Fighter - Jaggernaought, huge, heavy, massively armored wrecking ball.

Rogue - Church agent (Divine Seeker)

Paladin - Oath of Nobility, light armor, diplomat, fencing and dueling.

Monk - Not sure... maybe Zen Archer?

Ranger - tough, rough forester with great weapon and hounds.

Wizard - graft master, sawing different parts of creatures to himself to get some of their powers (it was a PRC long time ago).

Sorcerer - Fiendish blood.

Warlock - Dragon and Elemental pact.

Like the ideas for the most part. The Chieftain as a support Barbarian makes so much sense, it's weird why it's not existing (in fact, I could call it a Warlord, as long as the 4e Warlord reappears as a Marshal...), the College of Harmony/Melodics (aka, the Virtuoso :P) is an idea I suggested in one way or another, and the same with Warlocks and the Great Wyrm patron. Also dig the Fiendish Sorcerous Origin.

That said: I feel the Graft Master should be an Artificer thing (they can create the grafts, after all), and the Brute was an attempt to make a Juggernaut, but it didn't work. I could dig a Dreadnaught, though (like the advanced class from d20 Future, which had a sort of rage-like ability, wore very heavy armor (in fact, it was designed to wear powered armor), had the ability to knock opponents with physical attacks, specialized in bull rush, and generally was meant to be unstoppable. I could even see it as a path for the Barbarian.

Also: of course you have the Beastmaster Ranger, but are you suggesting the Houndmaster (from Darkest Dungeon) as a Roguish Archetype? Because you basically described the Houndmaster, except you veered too much into Ranger territory.


I really want a druid answer to Divine Soul. Feyborn Sorcerer? But like, the lesser fey that are about nature more than seducing random humans.

Wild Soul? It was a PrC in 3.5, allowed the Sorcerer to get some spells on their list that were of druidic origin, and gave you some fey-related powers.

[NOMster]

This would be cool, a natural weapon fighter for races like minotaur, aarakocra, and tabaxi.

Also, it's not exactly what you want but an official lycanthrope archetype similar to the Order of the Lycan for Blood Hunters would be cool, specially now that we have official shifters.

Weretouched Master please. I Homebrewed one but an official would be nice.

[NiklasWB]

One for most classes, in order of most wanted first:

1. Fighter - Warlord (uses commands to give attacks, movement, defense etc. INT or CHA based)
2. Barbarian - Juggernaut (non magical subclass focused on charging, breaking objects, pushing and being unstoppable)
3. Cleric - Technology/Crafting domain (more tinkerer than Forge domain and more focused on inventions)
4. Druid - Shapeshifter (druid that looses other wild shape forms and spellcasting in favor of an single form that increases in power as you level up)
5. Paladin - Oath of Vigilance (archery based oath that allows ranged smites but with less damage)
6. Monk - Mist Weaver (healing focused monk that can attack and heal at medium range)
7. Ranger - Warden Conclave (druid cantrip such as shillelagh, melee focused with unarmored feature)
8. Rogue - Acrobat (super mobile, long jumps, almost flight, freedom of movement etc)
9. Sorcerer - Geomancer (focused on moving the earth, knocking people prone etc)
10. Wizard - School of Librumancy (uses the actual books/pages of his spellbook to empower his spells. Uses the pages as a resource)

[Anderlith]

I’d like to see a Warlock Pact of the Dragon.

As well as a Dragon Shaman, though not sure which class would mantle it best

[Pufferwockey]

I suggested these before but I buried them in a largely off topic rant.

Non-magical barbarian path that leans in to, or doesn't actively interfere with two weapon fighting. Ideally leaning damage rather than even tankier. If I was getting everything I wanted it'd also get Mindless rage at some point because I love that feature. It's a wonderful example of a mechanic that is extremely useful without being overpowered that perfectly fits the class's flavour

A ranger variant that replaces spellcasting with just about anything really. Some ideas that I think fit well but could easily be unbalanced certainly not all of them:

-the 3.5 skirmish ability

-sneak attack starting at level 2 and advancing every 3rd level or w/e works balance wise

-something like sneak attack that could be used twice in one round but which carried less or smaller dice and maybe would be more difficult to trigger after the first round of combat. whatever the end result it shouldn't outshine the rogue

-limited superiority dice

-cold/poison resistance

-advantage on con saves or wisdom saves

-expertise but only for survival/nature/stealth


A potion brewing class with a druid-y vibe. maybe a subclass. more tottal potential hitpoints of healing available but less facility to administer in combat. offensive potions used as grenades with more area denial or halucinatory type effects rather than direct damage

[Vermithrax]

Paladin - Oath of Secrecy/Inquisition (deception and mind-control themed ambusher/lockdown specialist, secret police enforcer)

[DragonSorcererX]

Paladin - Oath of Secrecy/Inquisition (deception and mind-control themed ambusher/lockdown specialist, secret police enforcer)

Heaven yeah! I love inquisitions! I wish I could burn people in real life, but if I can't, why not do it in the game!

In Baldur's Gate there was an Inquisitor Paladin kit, it had Dispel Magic and True Sight instead of Lay on Hands and Turn Undead, and it couldn't cast cleric spells.

[Dr. Cliché]

4. Druid - Shapeshifter (druid that looses other wild shape forms and spellcasting in favor of an single form that increases in power as you level up)

I like the idea but it seems weird to base it on a Druid if you plan to remove all their spells.

Wouldn't it make more sense to just make a whole, new class?

[Anderlith]

Paladin - Oath of Secrecy/Inquisition (deception and mind-control themed ambusher/lockdown specialist, secret police enforcer)

I would love this for being a Paladin in a persecuted world. Like Midnight. To play a character where believing in a certain God like Pelor could get you killed, but you still want to be that faithful good guy would be awesome

[PoeticallyPsyco]

I’d like to see a Warlock Pact of the Dragon.

As well as a Dragon Shaman, though not sure which class would mantle it best

Dragon Shaman as a Paladin subclass, with the ability to switch between multiple auras, would be awesome.

[Warlush]

I'm curious to what the community wants to see from archetypes. For me, I just wanna a Divine Bard archetype called Evangelist or Preacher.

Any caster that can add it's ability modifier to psychic damage.