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Voltage89
2019-12-04, 09:50 AM
Hey everyone! I'm starting a new campaign in about a month or so, and I was curious if anyone had any ideas for how to make it even cooler! I know people on here can be really creative!

Two of my characters backstories will surely tie directly into the main story. Tiamat's presence is becoming greater, and a cult is wishing to summon her. I have already looked at Rise of Tiamat and such and I will be using pieces from that that I like. So, my one character was a blue dragonborn who's tribe worshiped Bahamut. However, 5 years ago a new dragonborn came to their tribe, and my player noticed that they seemed to be worshiping Tiamat more and more, instead of Bahamut. From this, my player left and is now looking to figure out what happened.

My other player is a shadow monk who's parents disappeared around the same time the new dragonborn came to the tribe. He assumes his parents are dead, however they are actually in the Shadowfell serving the Raven Queen. She has called them there as her champions because she sensed a great presence of life that she had not sensed in a long while. An ancient dragon (older than normal ancient dragons) who was wounded long ago was in a dormant state, basically dead. But he has finally healed from his wounds, and The Raven Queen feels this could be catastrophic to the material plane, which for some reason, she cares about.

Does anyone have anything that they see in this they really like/dislike and any new ideas for me? Anything is welcome. Thanks!

Sir Brett Nortj
2019-12-04, 11:43 AM
Hey everyone! I'm starting a new campaign in about a month or so, and I was curious if anyone had any ideas for how to make it even cooler! I know people on here can be really creative!

Two of my characters backstories will surely tie directly into the main story. Tiamat's presence is becoming greater, and a cult is wishing to summon her. I have already looked at Rise of Tiamat and such and I will be using pieces from that that I like. So, my one character was a blue dragonborn who's tribe worshiped Bahamut. However, 5 years ago a new dragonborn came to their tribe, and my player noticed that they seemed to be worshiping Tiamat more and more, instead of Bahamut. From this, my player left and is now looking to figure out what happened.

My other player is a shadow monk who's parents disappeared around the same time the new dragonborn came to the tribe. He assumes his parents are dead, however they are actually in the Shadowfell serving the Raven Queen. She has called them there as her champions because she sensed a great presence of life that she had not sensed in a long while. An ancient dragon (older than normal ancient dragons) who was wounded long ago was in a dormant state, basically dead. But he has finally healed from his wounds, and The Raven Queen feels this could be catastrophic to the material plane, which for some reason, she cares about.

Does anyone have anything that they see in this they really like/dislike and any new ideas for me? Anything is welcome. Thanks!

Terrible. Can't you have fun on a smaller scale? This should be something they earn. That you throw them into the deep end, they lose sight of what is in front of them, they lose interest due to your adventure being thrust onto them, and, they find they re not really playing, but merely choosing what to do next from you telling them what to do. It would be better to have them start at the end of this and simply move on, that they get the power, get bored of it, and, simply amuse you with their efforts in your world, that they can do anything, the they start trying those things that are getting dusty because nobody does them, you don't know why they are there and there is no harm in trying them out, hey?

How is this for an example? The write up, make the adventure progress from their back story, only. Then, you make way points, lots of them, and, see where they end up? Then, no narration, only interactive cooperative fantasy dream sharing exploration. This way you the game master gets to play too! You need to adjust, making it thrilling for you, they are filling you, you are reacting, like the world is supposed to and then the mood lifts, catches fire and there is no frustration, okay? Well, that is what I try to do, not that good at it, but it is communal enjoyment. This is a game you do not need to win, after all!

Voltage89
2019-12-04, 12:40 PM
Terrible. Can't you have fun on a smaller scale? This should be something they earn. That you throw them into the deep end, they lose sight of what is in front of them, they lose interest due to your adventure being thrust onto them, and, they find they re not really playing, but merely choosing what to do next from you telling them what to do. It would be better to have them start at the end of this and simply move on, that they get the power, get bored of it, and, simply amuse you with their efforts in your world, that they can do anything, the they start trying those things that are getting dusty because nobody does them, you don't know why they are there and there is no harm in trying them out, hey?

How is this for an example? The write up, make the adventure progress from their back story, only. Then, you make way points, lots of them, and, see where they end up? Then, no narration, only interactive cooperative fantasy dream sharing exploration. This way you the game master gets to play too! You need to adjust, making it thrilling for you, they are filling you, you are reacting, like the world is supposed to and then the mood lifts, catches fire and there is no frustration, okay? Well, that is what I try to do, not that good at it, but it is communal enjoyment. This is a game you do not need to win, after all!

I dont understand what you are trying to say? Are you saying the world should have no backstory, because that is really all this is. Most of this they wouldn't even learn until later in the campaign. I didnt even mention once what would actually happen during the campaign. All I mentioned was what happened to the one players tribe (which he gave me) and where the one players parents have disappeared too.

aimlessPolymath
2019-12-04, 12:48 PM
Hey everyone! I'm starting a new campaign in about a month or so, and I was curious if anyone had any ideas for how to make it even cooler! I know people on here can be really creative!

Two of my characters backstories will surely tie directly into the main story. Tiamat's presence is becoming greater, and a cult is wishing to summon her. I have already looked at Rise of Tiamat and such and I will be using pieces from that that I like. So, my one character was a blue dragonborn who's tribe worshiped Bahamut. However, 5 years ago a new dragonborn came to their tribe, and my player noticed that they seemed to be worshiping Tiamat more and more, instead of Bahamut. From this, my player left and is now looking to figure out what happened.

My other player is a shadow monk who's parents disappeared around the same time the new dragonborn came to the tribe. He assumes his parents are dead, however they are actually in the Shadowfell serving the Raven Queen. She has called them there as her champions because she sensed a great presence of life that she had not sensed in a long while. An ancient dragon (older than normal ancient dragons) who was wounded long ago was in a dormant state, basically dead. But he has finally healed from his wounds, and The Raven Queen feels this could be catastrophic to the material plane, which for some reason, she cares about.

Does anyone have anything that they see in this they really like/dislike and any new ideas for me? Anything is welcome. Thanks!

Broadly, this looks like part of hook for a campaign and some player backstory, not necessarily the campaign itself- there's a lot of space to fill in in terms of "how are the players introduced to each other and the main plot, what is the main plot, etc.".
Some questions that I think could have interesting answers:
-What is the "what happened" that the first player is investigating, and how does he investigate? Why his tribe is worshipping Tiamat? This seems to have a rather straightforwards answer- the new dragonborn is recruiting them into the cult of Tiamat. I'd expect a curious dragonborn to investigate his own tribe, not travel elsewhere for answers. If he wanted to investigate the cult as a whole, one strategy would be to backtrack along the path the stranger took, trying to find where he came from (perhaps the stranger has a map in his belongings?). Another would be to research the cult of Tiamat as a whole.
-I assume that the second character is also a dragonborn and part of the same tribe? This wasn't apparent upon first reading. Either way, I note that most of his described backstory is about his parents, not himself. Where/how does he start the game? His parents should come in eventually as champions of the Raven Queen, but what about right now?
-How does the cult intend to summon Tiamat (e.g what are the MacGuffins)? Why do they want to summon Tiamat, and what do they expect to get out of it? Are they just rando extremists doing it for purely ideological reasons, or might they expect some kind of reward (maybe Tiamat smashes their enemies)? Do they have allies? It would be interesting, for example, if a third party wished to weaken Tiamat and/or Bahamut for political reasons (maybe they hate dragons), and funneled resources to both the party and the cult, trying to set up a confrontation.

JNAProductions
2019-12-04, 12:49 PM
It's not a bad idea (getting PC investment is a good thing), but I will say it seems to be an unimportant idea. If it's really that far out, just focus on the more immediate future-who knows what shenanigans the PCs are gonna get up to that might throw a wrench in your plans?

My general advice would be, then, focus on what you should be doing NOW in your campaign, and worry a little less about the endgame.

Voltage89
2019-12-04, 01:03 PM
Broadly, this looks like part of hook for a campaign and some player backstory, not necessarily the campaign itself- there's a lot of space to fill in in terms of "how are the players introduced to each other and the main plot, what is the main plot, etc.".
Some questions that I think could have interesting answers:
-What is the "what happened" that the first player is investigating, and how does he investigate? Why his tribe is worshipping Tiamat? This seems to have a rather straightforwards answer- the new dragonborn is recruiting them into the cult of Tiamat. I'd expect a curious dragonborn to investigate his own tribe, not travel elsewhere for answers. If he wanted to investigate the cult as a whole, one strategy would be to backtrack along the path the stranger took, trying to find where he came from (perhaps the stranger has a map in his belongings?). Another would be to research the cult of Tiamat as a whole.
-I assume that the second character is also a dragonborn and part of the same tribe? This wasn't apparent upon first reading. Either way, I note that most of his described backstory is about his parents, not himself. Where/how does he start the game? His parents should come in eventually as champions of the Raven Queen, but what about right now?
-How does the cult intend to summon Tiamat (e.g what are the MacGuffins)? Why do they want to summon Tiamat, and what do they expect to get out of it? Are they just rando extremists doing it for purely ideological reasons, or might they expect some kind of reward (maybe Tiamat smashes their enemies)? Do they have allies? It would be interesting, for example, if a third party wished to weaken Tiamat and/or Bahamut for political reasons (maybe they hate dragons), and funneled resources to both the party and the cult, trying to set up a confrontation.

I generally disagree with Brett's argument's relevance to this thread, as it looks like he has a specific philosophy about the game that he's trying to present, rather than specific comments about your scenario.

I have some of the answers to those questions, but I did not want to make the post too long originally. I will have to figure out the real reason the player simply left the tribe, as I agree it would make sense for him to investigate where they are of course. I believe he might have said he wants to travel to the capital to get help, but I will have to double check on that. The second player is not a dragonborn and is not related to the other player at all. They have met recently in a small town, but thats really it. Nearing the beginning of the campaign, the first time this player goes unconscious he is going to have a vision. This vision will be him as a raven traveling towards the capital, and once he arrives, seeing his parents there. I have not fleshed out a ton of what the cults actual goals are and how they are going to achieve their feat as I do still have a month or two to plan. Some of your tips will certainly help though!

Voltage89
2019-12-04, 01:08 PM
It's not a bad idea (getting PC investment is a good thing), but I will say it seems to be an unimportant idea. If it's really that far out, just focus on the more immediate future-who knows what shenanigans the PCs are gonna get up to that might throw a wrench in your plans?

My general advice would be, then, focus on what you should be doing NOW in your campaign, and worry a little less about the endgame.

Most of this "endgame" stuff I generally just like to have a brief idea of before I start fleshing out the short term stuff. I like to leave little hints here and there, so that when the players finally do figure it all out, they can look back and notice they theoretically have known some of it all along.

JNAProductions
2019-12-04, 01:10 PM
Most of this "endgame" stuff I generally just like to have a brief idea of before I start fleshing out the short term stuff. I like to leave little hints here and there, so that when the players finally do figure it all out, they can look back and notice they theoretically have known some of it all along.

That's fair. It is good to have an idea of the endgame-apologies if I mistyped there-I'd just say it's less important to focus on than the immediate goals.

Not to mention, there's no guarantee that you'll hit the endgame. Groups fall apart or get bored-though I do sincerely hope you have a long and awesome campaign!

Breccia
2019-12-04, 03:54 PM
At first glance, it seems to me the main plot will be "Tiamat cult wants to wake ancient dragon so it follows THEM home and they keep him, thereby tipping the balance". Which sounds pretty classic D&D to me. I mean, it's nearly half the name of the game.

If you're looking for things like subplots, I would imagine that waking a dragon THAT old is not an easy task. If it was as simple as *poke poke poke* it'd have been done long before. The Tiamat cult probably has specific items, spells, rituals or people they need involved in this, and the PCs could get tasked with finding them first -- with mixed results. Or, additionally/alternatively, they could be tasked to find items, spells, rituals or people to keep the dragon dormant. For added fun (well, depending on the players, hopefully fun) the PCs could also encounter clues for more of the bits they're supposed to find that they aren't directly told about, making it less of "Person A tells you go to spot B" and more "Master of my own destiny" which is important at higher levels. It should be obvious to the PCs that this is a competition, but not necessarily "winner takes all". Perhaps if the cult only gets three of the five things they need, the ancient dragon awakes...angry, and attacks them first. Still a threat that should be resolved, of course, but it prevents "Oh, the bad guys got the third item, well I guess we better start casting plane shift".

It should be noted that Tiamat is a lot of things, but one of them is rich. I would expect this cult to start hiring goons to go after the PCs once the PCs have made their meddling obvious. Masks and mangy dogs optional. This will allow you to throw things at the PCs that aren't all dragons and dragonborn.

Any campaign setting needs things to do unrelated to the main plot, or at least I think so. Call them "sidequests" or "factions" or "rats in a cellar" all you want, the fact is, Evil Is Not Monolithic and not every problem the PCs encounter should be cult-based. Doing these, however, should not only allow the PCs to stumble across useful main quest info, but also gather other items and allies that will be useful in the struggle.

At some point, you'll have to decide the scope of your adventure. "Ancient dragon" to me screams "continent-level threat" at the minimum, so the PCs should be expected to travel. High-level PCs can travel quickly, so that's not the problem, but so can dragons, so the enemies can follow or possibly pass them. In this case, travel could mean drastically changed geography, ideal for someone who likes mountains, swamps, forests, deserts, and mountains -- in that order. Throw in some mysteries in ancient ruins and treacherous agents in cities and you have pretty much any environment your encounter requires. Just make sure you have places for them to go fleshed out, pre-purchased or handmade.

And finally, while not every single adventure should tie in to every single PC, it sounds like you're allowing or even encouraging that. A wider scope of the campaign makes this even easier. Even if, say, the party's druid isn't directly tied into the dragon issue, he might have a forest he likes that's being threatened by a green dragon, so you could force the issue if you prefer. Or, failing that, the PC could still reasonably say "well, my druid circle would want to help" and you could have them threatened by some other, unrelated force that must be dealt with. I mean, you could just say "the circle agrees and joins without incident" and depending on the player might even be the way to go (not every player wants to be the center of the story). The blue dragonborn in particular is practically begging to be part of the story. Their former home sounds like they're joining the Tiamat side. Maybe they can be split, separating the redeemable from the villains. Maybe they can all be saved, made to stand down, or quarantined. Maybe they can't, and the dragonborn PC has to say a tearful farewell before an intense battle. Regardless, no one PC's involvement should be the core of the adventure. That's just not fair to the other players. "Chosen one" stories make lousy multiplayer games. But having each PC with a bonus to add/penalty to remove to the overall main quest? That could be good for everyone, especially RP-heavy games.

There's nothing about this I hate, unless the PCs are low-level and you have gods talking directly to low-level PCs.

If this goes as I imagine it will, you're going to need to plan this out. At the very least, you should have the major locations, the major players of the locations, and the major main plot points of the major locations all written out so you can refer to them specifically when called for. "Maybe you can find someone in Southbergia" is okay, but "there's a famous draconic history scholar in Southbergia University, a dwarf by the name of Brillobeard, perhaps he has the information you seek" is better. This goes double for villains -- a cult's members probably know each other and communicate, especially when they're trying to shift the balance of power of an entire game world.

Good luck! Let us know what you decide to go with!

Voltage89
2019-12-05, 08:51 AM
At first glance, it seems to me the main plot will be "Tiamat cult wants to wake ancient dragon so it follows THEM home and they keep him, thereby tipping the balance". Which sounds pretty classic D&D to me. I mean, it's nearly half the name of the game.

If you're looking for things like subplots, I would imagine that waking a dragon THAT old is not an easy task. If it was as simple as *poke poke poke* it'd have been done long before. The Tiamat cult probably has specific items, spells, rituals or people they need involved in this, and the PCs could get tasked with finding them first -- with mixed results. Or, additionally/alternatively, they could be tasked to find items, spells, rituals or people to keep the dragon dormant. For added fun (well, depending on the players, hopefully fun) the PCs could also encounter clues for more of the bits they're supposed to find that they aren't directly told about, making it less of "Person A tells you go to spot B" and more "Master of my own destiny" which is important at higher levels. It should be obvious to the PCs that this is a competition, but not necessarily "winner takes all". Perhaps if the cult only gets three of the five things they need, the ancient dragon awakes...angry, and attacks them first. Still a threat that should be resolved, of course, but it prevents "Oh, the bad guys got the third item, well I guess we better start casting plane shift".

It should be noted that Tiamat is a lot of things, but one of them is rich. I would expect this cult to start hiring goons to go after the PCs once the PCs have made their meddling obvious. Masks and mangy dogs optional. This will allow you to throw things at the PCs that aren't all dragons and dragonborn.

Any campaign setting needs things to do unrelated to the main plot, or at least I think so. Call them "sidequests" or "factions" or "rats in a cellar" all you want, the fact is, Evil Is Not Monolithic and not every problem the PCs encounter should be cult-based. Doing these, however, should not only allow the PCs to stumble across useful main quest info, but also gather other items and allies that will be useful in the struggle.

At some point, you'll have to decide the scope of your adventure. "Ancient dragon" to me screams "continent-level threat" at the minimum, so the PCs should be expected to travel. High-level PCs can travel quickly, so that's not the problem, but so can dragons, so the enemies can follow or possibly pass them. In this case, travel could mean drastically changed geography, ideal for someone who likes mountains, swamps, forests, deserts, and mountains -- in that order. Throw in some mysteries in ancient ruins and treacherous agents in cities and you have pretty much any environment your encounter requires. Just make sure you have places for them to go fleshed out, pre-purchased or handmade.

And finally, while not every single adventure should tie in to every single PC, it sounds like you're allowing or even encouraging that. A wider scope of the campaign makes this even easier. Even if, say, the party's druid isn't directly tied into the dragon issue, he might have a forest he likes that's being threatened by a green dragon, so you could force the issue if you prefer. Or, failing that, the PC could still reasonably say "well, my druid circle would want to help" and you could have them threatened by some other, unrelated force that must be dealt with. I mean, you could just say "the circle agrees and joins without incident" and depending on the player might even be the way to go (not every player wants to be the center of the story). The blue dragonborn in particular is practically begging to be part of the story. Their former home sounds like they're joining the Tiamat side. Maybe they can be split, separating the redeemable from the villains. Maybe they can all be saved, made to stand down, or quarantined. Maybe they can't, and the dragonborn PC has to say a tearful farewell before an intense battle. Regardless, no one PC's involvement should be the core of the adventure. That's just not fair to the other players. "Chosen one" stories make lousy multiplayer games. But having each PC with a bonus to add/penalty to remove to the overall main quest? That could be good for everyone, especially RP-heavy games.

There's nothing about this I hate, unless the PCs are low-level and you have gods talking directly to low-level PCs.

If this goes as I imagine it will, you're going to need to plan this out. At the very least, you should have the major locations, the major players of the locations, and the major main plot points of the major locations all written out so you can refer to them specifically when called for. "Maybe you can find someone in Southbergia" is okay, but "there's a famous draconic history scholar in Southbergia University, a dwarf by the name of Brillobeard, perhaps he has the information you seek" is better. This goes double for villains -- a cult's members probably know each other and communicate, especially when they're trying to shift the balance of power of an entire game world.

Good luck! Let us know what you decide to go with!

Thanks a lot man! Lot of great tips in here! Almost everything you have said I fully agree with! I am a classic overplanner, not when it comes to story, but when it comes to world. I already have most of the major factions fleshed out but of course i'm willing to change them if needed. I think my main problem will be attempting to tie everyone into the story. I know from he past however that a lot of players find their own reasoning to go with the plot so sometimes I don't have to do much.

The only thing is that the ancient dragon that was woken is actually the start of everything, so that has already happened. Of course their were cults to Tiamat before his awakening, but his awakening actually occured in another campaign of mine on another continent that I ran last year. You see, he is Hallied, The Fate Mingler. He is dragon yes, but he actually used to serve Tiamat long ago, meaning she definitely knows how to make treacherous deals with people. So like I was saying, him waking is actually what got the cults to start trying to summon Tiamat!

I certainly agree that this is a sort of classic D&D story, but most of my players are new to the game so I thought it would be a great starting point. I mean, who doesn't love a good dragon story! Either way, I have some things I'll be doing to make it as original as I can! Thanks!