Ranged combat build help

[Aldo8880]

Hello all!

I’m new to 5e, having played a bastardized version of AD&D as a kid. I’m a chronic character creator for fun. I enjoy optimizing builds and looking for fun synergies.

As the title says, the next character I want to make is an “archer” build. My original thought was to make a Gloomstalker/Battlemaster mix. Shooting arrows to trip opponents or using the other maneuvers sounded like a good time. Then I happened upon the multiclassing guide and it gave me some more ideas to muddy the water. I’d be using the new UA rules for Ranger, they seem to be a big improvement.

I chose wood elf for the dex/wis bonus, and my rolled stats were 11/17+2/15/5/17+1/9. In planning out the character progression I wanted to start as a fighter for all the proficiencies and go to level 2 for action surge. Then jump into ranger to level 3 for the Gloomstalker archetype, then back to fighter for the remainder. I didn’t like that path because it delayed ASI/feat for so long and it felt like it would be a slow
progression.

My next path was to start ranger and go to level 4 for GS and to get the Elven Accuracy feat. That seemed like it would be a big boost to my attacking, and with all the extra dice that can be added on, the crit-fishing seems like it would be really valuable. I could use zephyr strike to give myself advantage and add more damage dice. Then I would bounce back to fighter and finish out in that class, for all the attacks and ASIs. Or should I stick to Ranger 5 for the extra attack and then go to Fighter?

Then I saw the suggestion in the multi-classing guide to also dip into Rogue 3 for assassination, for auto-crits on surprise attacks, near constant advantage, sneak attack, and cunning action aim if I need to. And then into fighter for all those attacks. This seemed like a really strong path, but it puts all the fighter goodies further out of reach.

Do y’all have any suggestions for the build that would boost the power more? Or am I going about this completely wrong and I need to rethink the whole thing?

[Sindal]

I'm no help to you here haha.

I'm just a pure gloomstalker ranger
So far my teammates are just familiar that I kick the stuffing out of on enemy on turn 1 and then follow up with constant damage the turns after that. I can say it's been pretty successful so far. Perhaps not the most damage optimised but often I dont need to be. Been working out for me as an archer though YMMV.

I like having ranger tools more than having high damage so we aren't aiming at the same bullseye

[CTurbo]

Gloom Stalker 5, then Assassin 5, then Fighter 2, then 8 more levels of Rogue.

Elven Accuracy at Ranger 4, then Sharpshooter at Rogue 4, then Alert at Rogue 8, then Magic Initiate for Minor Illusion, Control Flames, and Find Familiar at Rogue 10, then Skulker at Rogue 12,


or


Gloom Stalker 5, Assassin 5, Battle Master 3, and with the last 8 levels you could go Ranger 6, 7, or 8, then Rogue from there

[Aldo8880]

Gloom Stalker 5, then Assassin 5, then Fighter 2, then 8 more levels of Rogue.

Elven Accuracy at Ranger 4, then Sharpshooter at Rogue 4, then Alert at Rogue 8, then Magic Initiate for Minor Illusion, Control Flames, and Find Familiar at Rogue 10, then Skulker at Rogue 12,


or


Gloom Stalker 5, Assassin 5, Battle Master 3, and with the last 8 levels you could go Ranger 6, 7, or 8, then Rogue from there

Why do you suggest rogue levels over fighter levels? The bonuses for Assassin seem much less useful than the fighter bonuses. They seem only very narrowly applicable.

[CTurbo]

Why do you suggest rogue levels over fighter levels? The bonuses for Assassin seem much less useful than the fighter bonuses. They seem only very narrowly applicable.
I agree that the Assassin subclass features don't really fit the whole Archer king style, but the Rogue's base class features are just SO good and the more Rogue levels you take, the more sneak attack damage you'll do.

Rogue 5 - Uncanny Dodge is GREAT
Rogue 7 - Evasion is also GREAT
Rogue 10 - extra ASI or feat which is pretty good
Rogue 11 - Reliable Talent is actually really strong and under-rated IMO. Starting now, 14 is the lowest you could possibly roll for any skill check that you're trained in. And that turns into an 18 for the 4 skills you have Expertise in.


Either way, you could make a good case for going more Fighter too.


Fighter 12, Gloom Stalker 3, Assassin 5 would be good too with 3 attacks every turn, 4 attacks every first round, and 8 attacks on a first round action surge. Your sneak attack game goes from 6d6 to 3d6 though. On this build, after I hit and used sneak attack, I'd use the -5/+10 from Sharpshooter for every other attack.

[Aldo8880]

I agree that the Assassin subclass features don't really fit the whole Archer king style, but the Rogue's base class features are just SO good and the more Rogue levels you take, the more sneak attack damage you'll do.

Rogue 5 - Uncanny Dodge is GREAT
Rogue 7 - Evasion is also GREAT
Rogue 10 - extra ASI or feat which is pretty good
Rogue 11 - Reliable Talent is actually really strong and under-rated IMO. Starting now, 14 is the lowest you could possibly roll for any skill check that you're trained in. And that turns into an 18 for the 4 skills you have Expertise in.


Either way, you could make a good case for going more Fighter too.


Fighter 12, Gloom Stalker 3, Assassin 5 would be good too with 3 attacks every turn, 4 attacks every first round, and 8 attacks on a first round action surge. Your sneak attack game goes from 6d6 to 3d6 though. On this build, after I hit and used sneak attack, I'd use the -5/+10 from Sharpshooter for every other attack.

You are right about SA damage, I didn’t think to factor that in as well. Still too new and unfamiliar with the Rogue. And SA is Damage every round, although it might mess with target priority to chase that damage. But I’ll be chasing advantage with EA to crit fish anyway, so not much lost.

Sharpshooter with EA appears really strong too. The skill boosts are appealing too from the Rogue.

I still feel like Gloom 4 is the best start to get the first feat soonest. Then Fighter 2 for action surge, Rogue 3 for Assassin. At this point in leveling, it seems like another level in Ranger would be smart to get that extra attack.

How would you do your level progression?

[CTurbo]

What level are you starting at and how high do you think you'll reach?

Assuming you're starting at level 1, I would start and progress assuming that you are never going to make it anywhere near level 20 as most campaigns never even make it to level 10 much less 20.


I would start and take 5 levels of Ranger. From there I would take at LEAST 3 levels of Rogue if not 5. Then re-access where you're at with your build and how things have been going. You never know where the build will take you at this point. I try not to plan more than around 10 levels out because so many things can change. If after 8-10 levels you still want the same build concept, then I would go ahead and grab a couple levels of Fighter.


Just to be clear, I would go Ranger 5, Rogue 3 at the very least before I would consider any Fighter levels, and honestly, Ranger 5, Rogue 5 sounds better.

[da newt]

I'm playing a very similar PC (but I've only hit lvl 4 so far, so I'm no expert).

Personally I'd recommend grabbing 1 lvl of rogue very early just for the 1d6 SA which can help increase DPR in tier 1 quite a bit (expertise is handy too).

Other than that I'd prioritize getting lvl 5 for multi attack ASAP - but then I have trouble deciding if I should start GS Ranger or BM Fighter because GS does so little for you after lvl 3, fighter might be a better choice for more ASIs (and CON saves) ...

Ultimately I'd only want 4 lvls of GS and as much BM (mostly for ASIs) and Assassin as I could get. Fighter 11 for 3x attacks is sweet.

Wood Elf is great for this, but I prefer V.Human with crossbow expert right away (the bonus attack is huge early on).

[Rerem115]

If Revised Gloom Stalker's on the table, there's a case to be made for Ranger 8. Full ASI progression, bonus action dash, free Wisdom saves, +4 damage to two common enemy types, and advantage on saves against one of them. That's a fully effective build right there; anything else is just gravy.