War Wizard

[FilthyLucre]

So, I'm used to optimizing 3.5 wizards, so forgive me if I just don't get it, but in the context of 5e is War Wizard not just bonkers good as a generalist? Their level 2 ability seems super stronk to me. At-will boost to any save is extremely good for resisting those debilitating save-or-suck spells. The cost that you can only cantrip until the end of your next turn seems to be exceedingly generous. Any one have any experience with this?

[Teaguethebean]

It is extremely generous early on yes but at lv10 it is a good question whether you want to take 12 less damage from that Fireball or if you want to throw one of your own.

[MaxWilson]

So, I'm used to optimizing 3.5 wizards, so forgive me if I just don't get it, but in the context of 5e is War Wizard not just bonkers good as a generalist? Their level 2 ability seems super stronk to me. At-will boost to any save is extremely good for resisting those debilitating save-or-suck spells. The cost that you can only cantrip until the end of your next turn seems to be exceedingly generous. Any one have any experience with this?

It's pretty good but their level 6 ability is mediocre and level 10 and 14 are merely good. Other wizard subclasses like Diviner have a similar pattern with a strong level 2 ability, while still other subclasses like Necromancer have weak level 2 abilities and strong level 6 abilities.

Overall War Wizard is good defensively but not bonkers good.

[FilthyLucre]

Overall War Wizard is good defensively but not bonkers good.

Bring back Focused Specialist Conjurer + Master Specialist Conjurer :/ Wizard went from my favorite class in 3.5 to probably my least favorite in 5e.

[MaxWilson]

Bring back Focused Specialist Conjurer + Master Specialist Conjurer :/ Wizard went from my favorite class in 3.5 to probably my least favorite in 5e.

I skipped 3E--can you explain please what it would take in 5E to replicate the experience you desire?

[FilthyLucre]

I skipped 3E--can you explain please what it would take in 5E to replicate the experience you desire?

Well, this wasn't really the purpose of this thread... but spell casters in general were much more powerful. With feats (which were not optional) and variant class abilities spell casters, especially wizards, were super OP, but also very modular in a satisfying way. 3.5 spells were also much more powerful.

[MaxWilson]

Well, this wasn't really the purpose of this thread... but spell casters in general were much more powerful. With feats (which were not optional) and variant class abilities spell casters, especially wizards, were super OP, but also very modular in a satisfying way. 3.5 spells were also much more powerful.

I sympathize. One of the things I like better about AD&D than 5E is that AD&D's magic is more complex, and is easier to use in proactive ways. 5E has a limited number of things you can do proactively but it's limited to specific spells like Planar Binding which, weirdly, go against the rest of the apparent 5E design philosophy of "don't let anything matter for longer than 24 hours."

[Theaitetos]

War Wizard is a nice subclass to take when you go for a 2-3 levels multiclassing dip on a non-full caster. I took it on a Tiefling Celestial Warlock, as she could still cast Eldritch Blast or Healing Light, and it was very useful to boost her defenses.

[Nidgit]

War Wizard is an excellent dip for someone like an Eldritch Knight or very MAD Paladin or Ranger. It's less helpful for a primary caster or a completely mundane fighter since some of the resources are going to waste. It's pretty nice on a Moon Druid though!

A primary War Wizard takes some planning to be optimal in combat, though. You want to always be concentrating on something, particularly something that uses your action or bonus action. Things like Minute Meteors, Storm Sphere, and Animate Objects are perfect ways of guaranteeing solid damage on your turn at low to mid levels.

Once you hit Level 13-14, Crown of Stars is your best friend. No concentration bonus action damage leaves you free to concentrate on something like Telekinesis or Sunbeam; you cast powerful spells when you don't need to defend and fall back on one of these when you use Arcane Ward. Deflecting Shroud at 14 isn't particularly strong but it does better incentivize using your Arcane Ward even at higher levels. And hey, if you're expecting heavy fire from attack rolls, Shield is always right there.

Tenser's Transformation is still a mediocre spell but War Wizards are relatively well positioned to use it. You'll have somewhere around a +12 to Con saves so you're unlikely to lose Concentration if nothing else, and without losing your attacking ability too.

[Tharkun]

War Wizard is good. The level 2 at will save boost is great at lower levels and the +int to initiative shines bright at higher levels. It is also good out of combat for saves vs exhaustion, etc since it applies then too.

I am a fan.

[MaxWilson]

Tenser's Transformation is still a mediocre spell but War Wizards are relatively well positioned to use it. You'll have somewhere around a +12 to Con saves so you're unlikely to lose Concentration if nothing else, and without losing your attacking ability too.

Nice find, thanks! Sounds fun actually.

[Contrast]

I would say they are good but relatively boring.

Power Surge is underwhelming and otherwise they mostly just get benefits to maintaining concentration(/other saves). Bonus to initiative is good.

Effective but not as flashy or exciting as a number of abilities some of the other schools get.

[Kane0]

Well, this wasn't really the purpose of this thread... but spell casters in general were much more powerful. With feats (which were not optional) and variant class abilities spell casters, especially wizards, were super OP, but also very modular in a satisfying way. 3.5 spells were also much more powerful.

It's not all bad news, your Spell DC scales and you can mix-and-match spells to slots now.

Edit: oh and caster multiclassing can actually be a good idea too.