Usable Shadow-caster (Tome of Magic)

[SpicyBoi_Nezu]

Has anyone played with the Shadow-caster and it's 3 respective prestige classes? I planned on playing one for an upcoming campaign, but I'm beginning to have second thoughts. It looks like I could just play a wizard and do exactly the same things. They don't seem very good. I can definitely play with the role-play aspects of being tied to the shadow plane, and have them research it.

My DM had never heard of this class and was encouraging me to play it, but I'm really not sure. I just want to know if there is anyone who has played this class, and can tell me how to play it good. It seems like I can choose to either specialize in many different areas, or buckle down and master one aspect.

[Rebel7284]

It's very flavorful, but yeah, it's much worse than just being a regular caster.

The best you can do is probably Noctumancer/Mystic Theurge to... still do better with spells but have a couple of mysteries for backup.

If you want a powerful character with a shadow theme, there are a ton of options involving Shadowcraft Mage, optionally with Shadow Adept and/or Shadowcrafter for an incredible shadow-focused caster.

[Tzardok]

If you think the shadowcaster in itself is too weak, maybe this (https://www.enworld.org/threads/shadowcaster-fixes-by-mouseferatu.184955/) unofficial fix is the right thing for you. If, on the other hand, you think that there are not enough options for optimizing, you may find additional material here. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?74519-Descent-of-Shadows-Project-Shadow-Returns)
I hope that helped. :smallsmile:

[Troacctid]

It's important to know that shadowcaster has a vital power spike at 7th level, when you gain access to initiate paths and your mysteries per day more than double. You basically go from miserable to playable just like that. Of course even then, the path system is a major pain in the neck, forcing you to take mysteries you don't want in order to get to the ones you do. Sometimes it's actually correct to take a good mystery multiple times.

Anyway, if you're starting below 7th level, I would probably not play a shadowcaster. It's rough at low levels if you don't homebrew some kind of buff for it. (I personally like making mysteries per encounter rather than per day.)

[heavyfuel]

Anyway, if you're starting below 7th level, I would probably not play a shadowcaster. It's rough at low levels if you don't homebrew some kind of buff for it.

I could not agree more with this.

You have zero sustainability from lvs 1 through 6. More than a couple encounters in a day and you're basically no batter than a commoner. Up until level 6 you have a grant total of 6 mysteries per day. Period.

Making Mysteries work per encounter is something I find too strong. I'd go for stright up doubling uses of mysteries per day. You still suck at lvs 1 and 2, but so does almost every class. And now at lv 3 you already some decent (not great) sustainability.

[Bonzai]

I played one, but it was as a shadow pouncer gish build. The other posters are correct. If you play as a pure caster, you are going to be severely lack luster early on. As a shadow pouncer I was primarily interested in Flicker, and focused the rest of my mysteries for utility. Since I was melee focused, it wasn't too bad. I would recomend having something to fall back on other than pure casting at low levels.

You can do some fun stuff with it though. My character had lost both hands and had a peg leg. With the still mystery feat he could still cast, and he used Umbral Hand to do any fine manipulation that needed to be done. Not to many classes can over come that kind of handicap so easily, this class did.

[Fizban]

I have not played or seen it in game, but I have a minimalist fix (which is very emphatically not the usual suggestions)- link (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?568697-Shadowcaster-BBEG-help&p=23360083&viewfull=1#post23360083) to post with full explanation. Or short version:


Shadowcaster

d8 HD, 3/4 BAB, proficiency and cast in light armor, +1 mystery known at every even level. Spell-like and Supernatural mysteries recover automatically each day without rest or preparation, and use a DC of 10+1/2 level+ ability modifier.
A shadowcaster requires both Int and Cha, but the lines blur between them. One score is used to determine the highest level of mysteries they can learn, and the other is used to determine their saving throw DCs, but they can choose which is which each time they ready their spells.
Their bonus feat list now includes all PHB crafting feats.
Shadowcasters qualify for PrCs that require arcane spells, because they cast arcane spells.
Mysteries have full transparency with equivalent arcane items: Pearls of Power and Orbs of Shadow are interchangable, items that trigger or expend arcane spells function with mysteries, etc.

[gorfnab]

First off I would recommend checking out the shadowcaster handbook in my signature. Then take a look at this recent shadowcaster thread, specifically the builds that start on page two. Iron Chef Optimization Challenge: E6 Appetizer Edition (Round XXI) (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?602325-Iron-Chef-Optimization-Challenge-E6-Appetizer-Edition-(Round-XXI))

[martixy]

Just use the word-of-god (https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WordOfGod) shadowcaster fixes (https://www.enworld.org/threads/shadowcaster-fixes-by-mouseferatu.184955/).

[NigelWalmsley]

It looks like I could just play a wizard and do exactly the same things.

Not quite. You could play a Wizard and do much more effective shadow magic. The Shadowcaster is a dog with fleas, and Shadow Magic is a niche that has been explored by a dozen different options that are simply better. Your intuition is correct, and you would be better off simply playing a Wizard/Shadowcraft Mage or Beguiler/Shadowcraft Mage. That's not to say you might not enjoy playing a Shadowcaster with some of these fixes (or even without them), but if all you're concerned about is having shadow fluff, you can get that just fine as a Wizard without needing to jump through hoops.

[Falontani]

Just throwing my hat into the ring: Shadowcaster before level 7 is not a good spellcaster, but can be decent. Do look at the E6 thread's builds, they were quite good, and show paths that work pre level 7. Shadowcasters are not as powerful as other spellcasters at spellcasting. But they have some things that can compete with their spellcasting kin. A theurge can work. They can be entertaining alternatives to primary spellcasters.

I personally think their biggest flaw is due to how few paths actually exist, but if you would play a phb only sorcerer, then they will definitely compete.

[Odin's Eyepatch]

I'm playing a Noctumancer at level 9 at the moment. Due to unorthodox multiclassing and some houseruling, my wizard level is 7, while my shadowcaster level is 5. (so instead of - 3/-3 theurge, I'm -2/-4). We use the unofficial official fixes.

Bearing in mind that peculiar set-up, I've had some good fun so far with Noctumancer. Because i can pick and choose what mysteries i want, i can choose the mysteries that best compliment my wizard spellcasting. I've taken the mage armour mystery, and the see invisibility mystery, which means i never need to prepare them in my wizard slots. I also chose the immediate action DR mystery giving me an emergency defence card that i always have prepared, just in case.

Finally, i took (and will take) mysteries that i would not be able to replicate with wizard spells. Flicker and Night's long fingers are unique, and i look forward at higher levels to getting the umbral "animate object" mystery, control water/air, and the mystery that removes status effects (a wizard with healing?!)

All in all, I had to ignore the usual advice on best mysteries for shadowcasters, and instead think about what mysteries were best for a wizard.

Noctumancer is also pretty interesting. It doesn't come up much, but we play in relatively high magic campaign, so when we do find ourselves versus spellcasters, the class abilities are amazingly useful.

On the downside, only being able to cast 4th level spells while everyone else is using 5th level spells does smart a bit. And my shadowcaster levels are still mostly irrelevant due to their low number of slots, but that might also be because of the difference in power between my wizard and shadowcasting levels.

Overall, I'm still very much enjoying it, despite its shortcomings.

[Lans]

Going the other direction,its possible to have full shadow caster casting on one side because of the creeping darkness rule