SW:TRoS: Thread WITHOUT SPOILING ANYTHING

[GrayDeath]

So, ,for all of us who want to know if its wortth watching but (inc ase it IS) dont want to be spoilered, a second Thread.


My 3 main Querstions, that will determne if I will see it:

1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything, and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

and

3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

Thanks in advance.

[napoleon_in_rag]

So, ,for all of us who want to know if its wortth watching but (inc ase it IS) dont want to be spoilered, a second Thread.


My 3 main Querstions, that will determne if I will see it:

1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything, and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

and

3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

Thanks in advance.

I will just say this. It is very obvious now that there was no overarching plan for the trilogy. I don't think you can watch this movie by itself but there is a lot of "remember that shocking thing that happened in TLJ? It doesn't matter."

You find out about a lot of things through exposition that should have been explored in the previous movies. And things happen so fast that you barely have time to digest them before the next big thing happens.

It's pretty much awesome Star Wars spectacle followed by an awesome Star Wars spectacle followed by an awesome Star Wars spectacle. But what combines the different spectacles together is crap.

I suggest waiting until it comes out on Disney+.

[KillianHawkeye]

1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

1. Obviously, Rey and Kylo are intertwined through the heart of the story. But there is a lot of good Po and Finn between the Rey and Kylo parts. Not to mention Luke and Leia weirdly parental relationship with Rey, and some good heartfelt moments between the increasing number of droid sidekicks.


2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything, and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

2. I thought it did surprisingly well at putting together many of the puzzle pieces that the previous films tossed at us. Most of the events of The Last Jedi were kind of ignored except for the Rey/Kylo and Rey/Luke relationships, Po still struggling to be a good leader, and the inevitable conclusion to General Hux's rivalry.


3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

It was pretty good and fun IMO, if a bit fast paced. Other SW films gave us more time to digest and reflect on plot twists and important story revelations. I definitely left the theater satisfied.

Disclaimer: This has been the review of a life-long Star Wars nerd and a true fan of the series (and I don't mean the kind of "fan" that hates on everything and complains all the time, I mean like an actual fan).

[Reddish Mage]

The title of the thread should remove the “spoilerless” since ythe OP is basically asking for some specific spoilers about the plot without ruining the scenes

1. There’s more...but Reylo is out and out in the center of it. Poe/Finn (Stormpilot) is also heavily implied...but, in what sums up my attitude towards the entire movie, it not enough to provoke a strong reaction if you hate the idea and certainly doesn’t satisfy if you love it.

The way you’re asking the question makes me think you will come away from the movie complaining it’s all Keylo x Rey.

2. It does its best to ignore TLJ happened on matters big and small. Explanation and backpedaling is extremely brief however. You might actually like this movie better if you haven’t watched the last Jedi and had to imagine a different middle movie. Would have been a better movie.

3. You would be totally lost if you haven’t watched the original trilogy and the movie is heavily dependent on fan service.

[napoleon_in_rag]

Disclaimer: This has been the review of a life-long Star Wars nerd and a true fan of the series (and I don't mean the kind of "fan" that hates on everything and complains all the time, I mean like an actual fan).

{Scrubbed} Your fandom is not bigger than someone else's just because they have a different opinion than you.

[Hopeless]

Okay I have some questions.

1) Did they ever explain why there was a map to Luke when he clearly didn't want to be found?

2) What happened to that hyperspace tracker the First Order had that could track any ship?

3) What happened to the New Republic?

4) Do you know what happened to the pair from the Battlefront 2 campaign that went looking for help?

5) Does anyone from Star Wars Resistance appear in this movie?

6) What happened to the Wayfinder Luke found during that Battlefront 2 campaign?

7) How long after episode 8 does episode 9 start from?

[Fyraltari]

Okay I have some questions.

1) Did they ever explain why there was a map to Luke when he clearly didn't want to be found?
No but ep VII establishes that it is a map to the Temple where Luke moved to not a map made by Luke for people to find him as many seem to think.


2) What happened to that hyperspace tracker the First Order had that could track any ship?
No mention is made but FO ships are able to pursue through hyperspace so it’s definitely still a thing.


3) What happened to the New Republic?
No mention, the FO controls many planets but there are apparently still free worlds.


4) Do you know what happened to the pair from the Battlefront 2 campaign that went looking for help?
Haven’t play that game.


5) Does anyone from Star Wars Resistance appear in this movie?
Haven’t watched that show.


6) What happened to the Wayfinder Luke found during that Battlefront 2 campaign?
Wayfinders are used as plot devices. Don’t see how any of them could have been in Luke’s possession, though. Did he give it away or entrust it to someone?


7) How long after episode 8 does episode 9 start from?
Between a few months and a couple of years. No figures are given.

[KillianHawkeye]

{Scrub the post, scrub the quote}

Your fandom is not bigger than someone else's just because they have a different opinion than you.

I don't have a horse, I'm just saying that I don't hate on the thing I claim to love. {Scrubbed} The word fan is short for fanatic. By definition, it means you're crazy (in a good way) about everything that comes from the object of your fandom. At the very least, you don't complain about meaningless details and try to judge things on the spirit of the work.

It's not a competition, but you seem to be taking my comment personally. I would suggest you think long and hard about why you hate Star Wars and simultaneously call yourself a fan. And don't put words into my mouth that I haven't said. People can dislike aspects of something without ranting and raving against the very thing they claim to love. The prequels didn't ruin Star Wars. Neither did the sequels. Because nothing can ruin Star Wars as long as you believe in what Star Wars represents.

{Scrubbed} .

[Mechalich]

1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

Yes. There's an awful lot of Finn & Poe in this movie. Also a fair bit of Chewie and C-3PO, who may actually have the best parts.


2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything, and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

Short answer: no. Longer answer: Episode IX both directly rebukes Episode VIII at points, writes around it at others, and vaguely acknowledges it in different parts. However, it is clear it would have taken at least an entire other movie to put this movie in the starting position it needed to be in order to succeed.


3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

Good: No. Fun: Yes. This movie isn't a good movie in any sense. The pacing, editing failures, and massive plotholes (to things just within the film itself not other movies) are enough to keep it from being a good movie. However, if you can avoid intellectual investment (and if you can forgive the issues surrounding Leia in this movie by recognizing that there really were no good options), then yes, parts of it are quite fun. It is a Star Wars film in a superficial sense. The look and feel are much better than in TLJ, the music is there (though its kind of a 'greatest hits' approach by John Williams), the acting and general character mood mostly fits the Star Wars mold.

Bottom Line: The best singular comp for Rise of Skywalker is Abrams other second entry in re-doing a beloved franchise: Star Trek Into Darkness. The movies are incredibly similar, oddly paced, massively dumb, occasionally hit with character moments that don't make much sense, but still visually arresting and decently acted. If you thought that film was watchable, then this one is too.

[Callos_DeTerran]

As much as I want to be excited for the Rise of Skywalker, it honestly just has a lot working against it storyline and vision wise with what the Force Awakens set up, the Last Jedi tore down, and etc.

So...my expectations are low but I still expect it to be fun. I'm just looking for more Kylo Ren and Rey quality interactions, a return to form for Finn, a massive series of spectacles, and memorable scenes from the Emperor. If I can get those, I'll be satisfied. :smallsmile:

[dancrilis]

Bare in mind that I have exceedingly low expectations going in and if you choose to see it I would suggest you have them also.




1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

Yes.



2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything,
Yes.


and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

Interacting with - to an extent.



3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

Yes - I would say it is the best of this trilogy (a fairly low bar I will admit).

It does have flaws - many, many flaws and they are obvious ones too - but one can look past them both while watching and when thinking about it after.

Again I would say low expectations are your friend however - if you read the above and think 'this is going to be great, I most run out to watch that' you will likely be disappointed.

[Hopeless]

[QUOTE=Fyraltari;24321228]]
Thank you.

[GrayDeath]

Thank you all for your posts.

So it sounds like its not a TOTAL catastrophe, hmmm, Ill probably watch it then, but my expectations were already pretty low to start with, so ^^

[GloatingSwine]

You know how the prequels were a decent story buried in really bad movies?

This is the opposite. The craft of putting stuff on screen in an exciting and engaging way is there, but what that craft is being used on is Kevin J Anderson tier pish.

[Callos_DeTerran]

You know how the prequels were a decent story buried in really bad movies?

This is the opposite. The craft of putting stuff on screen in an exciting and engaging way is there, but what that craft is being used on is Kevin J Anderson tier pish.

So all spectacle but no substance?

[CarpeGuitarrem]

I personally thought it did a superb idea of finishing what TLJ started, and it all fits together really well, but I guess not everyone sees it that way.

[Razade]

1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

No. If anything it's even more Rey and Kylo. Like, the entire movie focuses on them. Which is better imho because the other characters are lame and boring. Poe and Finn have a few moments but they're woven around Rey. She's in like 99% of the movie as a front and center figure and the entire plot if focused around her in a way the other movies kinda weren't. TFA at least had Finn having some agency beyond "Gotta help Rey" and had more going on with the few side characters they introduced. TLJ had the split storyline with Rey and Luke and the rest of the characters doing stuff, no matter how terrible it was. RoS has none of that. Main plot point comes up and it's Rey and her two platonic dudebros off to save the galaxy from start to end.


2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything, and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

It more or less ignores the entire movie except for like...one character who has maybe two scenes and references how no one came to help them at the last battle. That's it. It does build, as others have said, on some of the concepts introduced but the only real big pay out is the connection between Rey and Kylo being some tangible Force Power nonsense. I'll have to take a pretty hard stance against the people who said this puts a nice bow on all the mysteries raised by the first two movies of the trilogy though. Going into it would be big spoilers though.


3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

Thanks in advance.

That's a call you'll have to make. I was bored through the whole thing honestly.


I don't have a horse, I'm just saying that I don't hate on the thing I claim to love. People who do that have some psychological issues that I don't want to get into.

You go on to say the person you're responding to is taking things personally...but you just flat out said that people who interact with their fandom in a way you don't are crazy. Like, how judgemental and condescending is that? Arm chair psychology is terrible at the best of times but this just seems...really needlessly thrown in.


I would suggest you think long and hard about why you hate Star Wars and simultaneously call yourself a fan. And don't put words into my mouth that I haven't said.

Unless I missed something here, Napoleon in Rag never said they hated Star Wars so...why are you telling them not to put words in your mouth when you're cramming yours in theirs?

[napoleon_in_rag]

I don't have a horse, I'm just saying that I don't hate on the thing I claim to love. {Scrub the post, scrub the quote} The word fan is short for fanatic. By definition, it means you're crazy (in a good way) about everything that comes from the object of your fandom. At the very least, you don't complain about meaningless details and try to judge things on the spirit of the work.

It's not a competition, but you seem to be taking my comment personally. I would suggest you think long and hard about why you hate Star Wars and simultaneously call yourself a fan. And don't put words into my mouth that I haven't said. People can dislike aspects of something without ranting and raving against the very thing they claim to love. The prequels didn't ruin Star Wars. Neither did the sequels. Because nothing can ruin Star Wars as long as you believe in what Star Wars represents.

{Scrub the post, scrub the quote}.

You are making my point for me. You are saying that because I don't love everything about Star Wars in the exact same way you do, I must have psychological issues, secretly hate Star Wars, and am be a true fan. Its the same thing as when people say "True fans hate The Last Jedi". Its a {Scrubbed} litmus test that does not add anything to a discussion about a movie.

You say you love everything about Star Wars but have you seen "The Star Wars Holiday Special"? That's so bad that George Lucas tried to make it disappear. I have only gotten like 3/4 of the way through it before I had to turn it off. In my opinion, there is very little that is good about it. But I guess you must love it because you are a "true fan of the series".

It's weird that you accuse me of putting words on your mouth in the same paragraph you state that I hate Star Wars. I don't hate Star Wars. I don't hate Episode IX. I think it's in the middle of the pack as far as Star Wars movies go. What I did say is that it is obvious there was no overarching story for the new Trilogy. And that's a big deal because that is something that Star Wars is known for.

Look at all those other popular movies from the late 70s/ early 80s. Rocky, Jaws, Star Trek, Superman*, Indiana Jones, etc. They all got sequels but those sequels didn't tell one story in three parts that was planned out in advance. That's one thing that set Star Wars apart and they didn't do this for the new trilogy.

Yeah, I know Superman 1 and 2 told one story because they were shot simultaneously. But that's because they were originally planned to be one movie but then the story got too big. Superman 3 and 4 are completely separate stories though.

[Psyren]

I personally thought it did a superb idea of finishing what TLJ started, and it all fits together really well, but I guess not everyone sees it that way.

I'm with you as well. But I've given up on Star Wars "fans" being able to agree on anything that isn't ultra-safe Mandalorian porridge.



You say you love everything about Star Wars but have you seen "The Star Wars Holiday Special"? That's so bad that George Lucas tried to make it disappear. I have only gotten like 3/4 of the way through it before I had to turn it off.

I just watched the pitch meeting (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9YQn8j--xs) for it instead, that told me everything I needed to know about it without needing to watch :smallbiggrin:

[GrayDeath]

Well, I watched it.

And while some stuff was a positive surprise, most of it was simply a lot of hectic, Abramsish ignore anything technical/logical and be AWESOME!!!" stuff.

And the end, while very easy to foreseee, was still stupid.

Pro: Humor was much better than the earlier ones, and (except for the end) it at elast kept mostly in line with the in Universe "Feel".

Aside from the general Ultra Super Light Speed drives every ST Movie had so far, that is.


Ah well, at least thats over.

Now if only they get a GOOD DIrector to doe the Thrawn Trilogy. And while were at it, I win big in Lotto. :smalltongue::smallbiggrin:

[Sapphire Guard]

Can someone who watched it recently clarify something for me?

Did healing the sandworm cause Rey to injure her hand? I thought that happened when watching, but I'm not sure if I interpreted that correctly.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Mechalich
[Rise of Skywalker] isn't a good movie in any sense. The pacing, editing failures, and massive plotholes (to things just within the film itself not other movies) are enough to keep it from being a good movie. However, if you can avoid intellectual investment (and if you can forgive the issues surrounding Leia in this movie by recognizing that there really were no good options), then yes, parts of it are quite fun.

This is probably the best take I’ve seen on Episode IX, or at least the one I agree with the most.


Originally Posted by Mechalich
The best singular comp for Rise of Skywalker is Abrams other second entry in re-doing a beloved franchise: Star Trek Into Darkness. The movies are incredibly similar, oddly paced, massively dumb, occasionally hit with character moments that don't make much sense, but still visually arresting and decently acted. If you thought that film was watchable, then this one is too.

I would say they’re broadly comparable, but I really dislike the Abrams take on Trek, and hated Into Darkness in particular. Rise of Skywalker at least has some great character moments, and it has an overall fun vibe, but Into Darkness was an utter waste. “Massively dumb” really gives it too much credit.


Originally Posted by Sapphire Guard
Did healing the sandworm cause Rey to injure her hand? I thought that happened when watching, but I'm not sure if I interpreted that correctly.

I don’t think so—or at least if it did, I didn’t catch it. But I’ve only seen the movie once, and for that scene I was too happy at finally seeing Force healing on the big screen.

Which is just strange, since it was a major part of Splinter of the Mind’s Eye, and clearly one of the earliest uses of the Force that Lucas et al. developed. Not sure why it took them so long to incorporate it into the movies.

[Fyraltari]

I don’t think so—or at least if it did, I didn’t catch it. But I’ve only seen the movie once, and for that scene I was too happy at finally seeing Force healing on the big scrieen.

Which is just strange, since it was a major part of Splinter of the Mind’s Eye, and clearly one of the earliest uses of the Force that Lucas et al. developed. Not sure why it took them so long to incorporate it into the movies.

Healing magic is tricky. If you don’t set very clear limitations and/or drawbacks you risk erasing the notion of consequences from your world entirely. Here it seems that in order to save somebody’s life you need to die in their stead which is fine but I suspect it won’t be long until we get a Jedi that could simply resurrect anybody.

[Tyndmyr]

1.: Is it more than "Rey and Kylo" and some bells and whistles

That's in there. A bunch of other stuff is also in there, including a number of new characters. A fair amount of bells and whistles as you would put it.

2.: Does it somehow manage to overcome the Clusterfudge that was E8 for being the Middle of a Trilogy but still destroying everything, and if so, does it do that by (even if only somewhat) interacting with it or by simply ignoring it?

It tries. It doesn't entirely fix it. I'm not even sure a movie can. 7 and 8 don't mesh, so 9 coming in and trying to retcon them into coherency is rough.

3.: Is it, seen for itself, a Good (or at least fun) STAR WARS Movie?

It's alright. 5/10, maybe? It is certainly superior to Ep 8, probably better than 7. But if you hated both of those, you may not enjoy this one.

[Azuresun]

1: Yes. Finn and Poe in particular get to be cool.

2: Yes, but without overtly retconning stuff, which I appreciated. It builds on the Force stuff, which was one of the bits in TLJ which I liked. Some of the joins do show, but it's a lot more graceful than I was worried it might be.

3: Yes. I'd rate it as the best of the sequels. Plot is....adequate, but it's all about the spectacle and character moments, and I found them more than enough to carry the film.

Go watch it, have fun and don't spend too much time with misery-guts "true fans" on the Internet, who will fall over themselves to tell you why you didn't actually enjoy it. :smallbiggrin: