Chreating a martial artist in 3.5

[shadowseve]

So, I have been inspired by my friend who spent almost two years in Wudang Mountain training in traditional Kung Fu. Wudang is as famous for it's kung fu and their deadly yet elegant sword play. So, I have a character, Xiao Ling, that I want to create as a traditional Chinese martial artist who combines her traditional hand combat and her tia chi sword.

It's been a while since I've played 3.5 and I need help with building her out. I know strait monk is very gimp so I'm open for some opinions. Any help would be appreciated. Happy late New Years btw!

[Telonius]

You'll probably get a whole lot of this kind of suggestion, but: avoid Monk. If the book is available, use Tome of Battle: Book of Nine Swords; the "Swordsage" class fits in extremely well with what you're describing. (The "Unarmed Swordsage" variant is typically cited as one of the better Monk replacements in 3.5).

[tyckspoon]

There are a number of ways to build a concept like that mechanically, but Tome of Battle probably has the best combination of straightforward and effective rules for it. You'll probably want either Warblade or Swordsage as the base class (Warblade is the more warrior-like, with full BAB and a bigger hit die, where Swordsage is the more monkish version with 3/4 BAB progression and access to the more mystically-based martial arts abilities in the book), and the feats Improved Unarmed Strike, Superior Unarmed Strike (grants you a monk-like improved unarmed damage progression) and Snap Kick (lets you add on a bonus unarmed attack when you hit with a normal weapon.)

[sleepyphoenixx]

Afaik there's no jian statted for 3.5, but you can easily refluff any one-handed, finessable martial weapon as one, like a short sword or rapier.
Though those are both piercing weapons and jian are used more for slashing attacks afaik, but there's probably a weapon around that fits.

As for class Telonius has it right. Unarmed Swordsage, probably dex-based, with maneuvers to taste.
For disciplines Diamond Mind should fit well, as should Tiger Claw, Setting Sun and Shadow Hand depending on what style of kung fu you're looking to emulate and where on the scale between realism and wuxia you want to fall.

[shadowseve]

Yeah, the adaptation of unarmed sword sage looks interesting. I do have a question, please forgive me if I ask dumb questions as I'm suffering from some minor brain and neurological issues. So, literally my brain isn't what it used to be, I'm a little slow these days. So, if I'm correct then you just give the character the unarmed damage progression and ditch the light armor? Or how exactly would that work? Would love some ideas on feat progression. Now wouldn't improved natural attack be superior to superior unarmed strike?

We use the pathfinder feat progression so we get a new feat every other level, flaws and such allowed. For the tia chi/jian the stats for the elven thin blade look appropriate, though I imagine one could argue that the jian would also do slashing as well.

Thanks guys.

[tyckspoon]

Yeah, the adaptation of unarmed sword sage looks interesting. I do have a question, please forgive me if I ask dumb questions as I'm suffering from some minor brain and neurological issues. So, literally my brain isn't what it used to be, I'm a little slow these days. So, if I'm correct then you just give the character the unarmed damage progression and ditch the light armor? Or how exactly would that work? Would love some ideas on feat progression. Now wouldn't improved natural attack be superior to superior unarmed strike?


The adaptation info is a little sketchy - they expect you to fill in some gaps for yourself - but yeah, that's roughly it. Remove Light Armor proficiency, drop in the Monk's Unarmed Strike feature. Superior Unarmed Strike is mostly used if you want more Unarmed Strike damage but don't actually want to be a Monk; if you have the Monk progression already then yes I would normally go with Improved Natural Attack.

[Sinner's Garden]

Honestly, taking some levels of Monk isn't really as bad of a deal as some people suggest. With options like Invisible Fist, Martial Monk, and Mantis Leap, it has plenty enough to offer that I can't hate it, and neither should you. That aside, if you're okay with getting a little silly, the trick with enchanted unarmed strikes is always good fun; hardening alone is a pretty amazing benefit for a melee character, and I believe is basically automatic.

[shadowseve]

So, the dm just mentioned possibly going gestalt. Apparently the other PCs are wanting to. If so then would be decent to go sword sage//monk? If so, what would be a good feat progression. Enchanting the fists is allowed but I’m not sure what a good enchant would be.

[ixrisor]

So, the dm just mentioned possibly going gestalt. Apparently the other PCs are wanting to. If so then would be decent to go sword sage//monk? If so, what would be a good feat progression. Enchanting the fists is allowed but I’m not sure what a good enchant would be.

Monk and swordsage give very similar abilities, so it’s probably a bad idea to use both.

[shadowseve]

So, any ideas?

[Crake]

The adaptation info is a little sketchy - they expect you to fill in some gaps for yourself - but yeah, that's roughly it. Remove Light Armor proficiency, drop in the Monk's Unarmed Strike feature. Superior Unarmed Strike is mostly used if you want more Unarmed Strike damage but don't actually want to be a Monk; if you have the Monk progression already then yes I would normally go with Improved Natural Attack.

Why not both?

With regards to what to gestalt with, an egoist psion. Psionics is the manifestation of mental power, an egoist psion is one who focuses their mental power on their body, which lets you mimic monk abilities like purity of body and diamond body (by being able to purge your body of diseases and poisons), diamond mind (by being able to fortify your mind with various psionic defenses), wholeness of body (by being able to heal yourself), while also giving you a whole host of other great monk abilities, like being able to harden your body with your mental power to give yourself damage reduction, being able to boost your ability scores, being able to clear your mind and grant yourself immunity to mind affecting (mind blank).

Obviously there's a whole host of psionic abilities that aren't monk-like at all, but, well, you can just not pick those up.