Chameleons and domain spells

[Linearblade]

Do chameleons get access to domain spells?

We are having a bit of confusion on this

It says “has access to any spell on any divine spell casters list” (paraphrasing )

Are domain spells on a divine casters list?

Do chameleons pray to a god to get their spells?
Do they need to pray to a specific god to get specific domain spells?

Surely “god of all that is good and holy” doesn’t go about granting blasphemy to chameleons

[Thurbane]

Are domain spells on a divine casters list?

Technically, yes.

Divine Crusader (CD p.33).


A divine crusader casts divine spells. She may only prepare and cast spells from her chosen domain (see above). Effectively, a divine crusader has a class spell list of only nine spells (one per spell level).

[Linearblade]

Technically, yes.

Divine Crusader (CD p.33).


Wow, thank you. I was trying to figure out how they were pulling domain spells out,

This explains it

[DarkSoul]

Do chameleons get access to domain spells?

We are having a bit of confusion on this

It says “has access to any spell on any divine spell casters list” (paraphrasing )

Are domain spells on a divine casters list?

Do chameleons pray to a god to get their spells?
Do they need to pray to a specific god to get specific domain spells?

Surely “god of all that is good and holy” doesn’t go about granting blasphemy to chameleonsActually no, domain spells aren't part of a cleric's normal spell list. There may be some overlap, but if a spell is only on a domain list it will be listed as such, not as a cleric spell. Furthermore, you can only prepare domain spells in your domain slots, not your normal spell slots if they don't normally appear on your class spell list. For example, Disintegrate is a Destruction 7 spell, not a Cleric 7. Unless you have access to the Destruction domain, your cleric can't prepare Disintegrate at all. If your cleric does have the Destruction domain, they can still only prepare one Disintegrate because it's not a cleric spell, it's a domain spell.

[Linearblade]

Actually no, domain spells aren't part of a cleric's normal spell list. There may be some overlap, but if a spell is only on a domain list it will be listed as such, not as a cleric spell. Furthermore, you can only prepare domain spells in your domain slots, not your normal spell slots if they don't normally appear on your class spell list. For example, Disintegrate is a Destruction 7 spell, not a Cleric 7. Unless you have access to the Destruction domain, your cleric can't prepare Disintegrate at all. If your cleric does have the Destruction domain, they can still only prepare one Disintegrate because it's not a cleric spell, it's a domain spell.



So the chameleon gets domains solely through the prc mentioned above , and without that, no domains.

[Khedrac]

Actually no, domain spells aren't part of a cleric's normal spell list. There may be some overlap, but if a spell is only on a domain list it will be listed as such, not as a cleric spell. Furthermore, you can only prepare domain spells in your domain slots, not your normal spell slots if they don't normally appear on your class spell list. For example, Disintegrate is a Destruction 7 spell, not a Cleric 7. Unless you have access to the Destruction domain, your cleric can't prepare Disintegrate at all. If your cleric does have the Destruction domain, they can still only prepare one Disintegrate because it's not a cleric spell, it's a domain spell.

Nowhere has anyone before you mentioned cleric spell lists - the chameleon restriction is divine spell lists - which includes druid and, as said, divine crusader.

[Troacctid]

I would argue that the divine crusader spell list doesn't include domain spells either. They have an additional class feature that then adds domain spells to their spell list. But without that feature, they don't have any other spells on their class spell list at all. And when removed from the context of an individual divine crusader, the domain class feature isn't in play.

It's like how a warmage can use advanced learning to add a spell to their spell list, but it's only a warmage spell for them, not for anyone else. Similarly, a spell-to-power erudite can learn arcane spells as though they were psionic powers, but that doesn't mean all arcane spells universally count as psionic powers—only the erudite who converts them has the ability to treat them at way.

[DarkSoul]

Nowhere has anyone before you mentioned cleric spell lists - the chameleon restriction is divine spell lists - which includes druid and, as said, divine crusader.I suppose if a chameleon wanted to take Divine Crusader (Elf Domain) for example...

But you're right, I assumed the OP was asking if domain spells are on the cleric spell list.

[Linearblade]

Does anyone have insight as to whether or not the chameleon prays to a god for spells? Gods? Ur priest thievery?

About the only thing I can discern is the fluff text. Pg 114 rod, mimic Mansion provides them with weapons armor thieves tools and a fake holy symbol and gibberish spell book.

This seems meh and somewhat contradictory, at least In the case of the arcane side.

Any thoughts on this? Perhaps they just get spells from anyone who will grant them? Or they just slip under the radar via “social engineering?”

[Linearblade]

I suppose if a chameleon wanted to take Divine Crusader (Elf Domain) for example...

But you're right, I assumed the OP was asking if domain spells are on the cleric spell list.

This is correct. I asked two questions:

1) are domain spells on a divine caster list.
- Appears not, except for probably divine champion
- if divine champ is out, then so are domains
2) how is he getting the spells in the first place?
- ur priest style man in the middle attack?
- stolen credentials by watching other priests cast, and essentially stealing login info?
- he’s actually praying for spells from a god?
- any god that will listen?
- Other

[Troacctid]

There is one class that definitively has domains on its class spell list: sha'ir. Its divine spell list includes the the Air, Chaos, Earth, Fire, Knowledge, Law, Luck, Sun, and Water domains.

[Linearblade]

There is one class that definitively has domains on its class spell list: sha'ir. Its divine spell list includes the the Air, Chaos, Earth, Fire, Knowledge, Law, Luck, Sun, and Water domains.
That’s something, along with divine champ. Sort implies some precedence in terms of supporting chameleon and domain casting

[Thurbane]

Does anyone have insight as to whether or not the chameleon prays to a god for spells? Gods? Ur priest thievery?

RoD doesn't really touch much on Chameleons and their divine connection.


You prepare and cast these spells just as a cleric does, except that you cannot spontaneously cast spells. You can only prepare new divine spells at sunrise.

Clerics worship a deity or ideal, so that could be read that Chameleons must do the same. However, classes that do not need to follow a specific deity use similar wording.


A ranger prepares and casts spells the way a cleric does, though he cannot lose a prepared spell to cast a cure spell in its place.

There is also this:


Mimic Mansion provides its graduates with the basics for their transformations. These include armor, weapons, thieves’ tools, a holy symbol (fake), and a spellbook (written in gibberish).

Clerics, druids, and paladins are unfriendly or hostile, actively seeking to expose chameleons as frauds; they pretend to have divine powers, which insults the gods and those who receive their genuine favor.

My own personal take is that they probably gain spells similarly to Archivists, minus the prayer book.


Unlike a cleric, an archivist does not receive his daily spell complement from whatever deity or cosmic force he worships.

While most archivists are religious, it is fundamentally their way to put more stock in the power of the divine than in the divine itself.

The Factotum also may offer some inspiration.


Factotums are legendary for the number of holy symbols, lucky trinkets, and blessed items they keep handy. As the saying goes, there are no atheists in the dungeon.

Most factotums worship a variety of deities and have holy symbols for every occasion. A typical factotum might offer one prayer to Obad-Hai before venturing into the wilds, and another to Moradin while traveling through an abandoned dwarf mine. Factotums seek a higher understanding of the world than a single deity can offer. Besides, they know enough about divine magic to leach energy from a number of gods. It pays to spread the prayers out.

[Rijan_Sai]

My own personal take is that they probably gain spells similarly to Archivists, minus the prayer book.

That's about how I see it, too: if an Archivist can (potentially) put it in his prayer book, a Chameleon can (potentially) prepare it. (Interestingly enough, going through the PHB/SRD any spell that is Domain-only (Chaos Hammer (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/chaosHammer.htm), Holy Smite (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/holySmite.htm), Order's Wrath (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/ordersWrath.htm), and Unholy Blight (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/unholyBlight.htm)) do NOT show up in the DMG's divine scroll list. Some that are on the domain list(s), but also on other lists at different levels, show up in the appropriate (arcane/divine) scroll list at the level of the other spell list, but not the domain (I.E. Cone of Cold (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/coneOfCold.htm)/Disintegrate (https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/disintegrate.htm))
I was not able to find anything that specifically denied domain spells from being put onto scrolls, but they are not in the DMG...)