Who does Durkon want to marry less than Belkar?

[Benoojian]

Durkon said Belkar was like his 4th choice just in the party (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1151.html), which leaves us with someone he wants less than Belkar.

1.
2.
3.
4.Belkar
5.

And that's assuming he wasn't counting animal companions.

[Fyraltari]

Whoever you think is funniest.

[Grand Arbiter]

From a logical standpoint I’d wager Vaarsuvius is number 5, because afaik they haven’t shared their spouse requesting (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0678.html) a divorce (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0679.html) with the party.

Else, see Fyraltari’s response ^

[D.One]

Durkon said Belkar was like his 4th choice just in the party (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1151.html), which leaves us with someone he wants less than Belkar.

1.
2.
3.
4.Belkar
5.

And that's assuming he wasn't counting animal companions.

No one. In dwarven language, the word for fourth, Kah'erth, sounds very similar to the word for last, Kaerf, and what Durkon was really saying was that Belkar was the last member of the party he would ever marry.

(Also, I'm making this up ;-P )

[Windscion]

Im agreeing with Libro.
Mostly for the same reaons, but there's also the divine/arcane spellcaster issue, to say nothing of the dwarf/elf thing.

Also, a side note. Just because two people are broken up doesn't mean they are broken up. Always wait and see.

[Draconi Redfir]

Probably Elan.

in the party my guess would be

1. Haley
2. Roy
3. Vaarsuvius
4. Belkar
5. Elan


it just makes sense.

[Peelee]

Whoever you think is funniest.

My money's on this.

[Grey Watcher]

Whoever you think is funniest.


My money's on this.

Yeah, I figure the lack of clarification is a joke unto itself. Not unlike, say, the Elan's original plan (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0389.html) for getting back to Azure City. Hinting at it without stating makes for a better joke than just stating it.

That said, this forum would be nothing without wild, unfounded speculation, so carry on, I say!

[woweedd]

You're reading too deeply into what is, even in-universe, an off-the-cuff joke? But, if I had to guess, V.

[Benoojian]

Damn, I wanted there to be competing theories (like whether Haley or Elan would drive him crazy first) but Durkon's already established trait of "my anaconda don't want none if you got a ring, son" makes V pretty certain.

[Cicciograna]

Me
You
Roland St. Jude
Belkar
Me

[Emanick]

Probably Elan.

in the party my guess would be

1. Haley
2. Roy
3. Vaarsuvius
4. Belkar
5. Elan


it just makes sense.

Switch Elan and V, and that's my guess as well. (As for why, see Libro's post.)

[Fyraltari]

Else, see Fyraltari’s response ^


My money's on this.


Yeah, I figure the lack of clarification is a joke unto itself.

This is why I like it when I get early to a thread; witty* replies don't have the same punch a dozen posts down.


*Your mileage may vary.

[Grey Watcher]

This is why I like it when I get early to a thread; witty* replies don't have the same punch a dozen posts down.


*Your mileage may vary.

Of course not. That low, and it's more likely a kick. :smalltongue:

[skim172]

Well, we know that Durkon is definitely attracted to Helga. And we know that he's not attracted to Belkar.
Therefore, by contrasting the attributes of those two, we can determine what Durkon finds most attractive.

And obviously, the answer is Helga's long blonde French braids. He finds that well hot. In comparison, Belkar's got hair like brownish fuzz growing on an egg.

So, we can determine this is Durkon's hawtness order:
0. Helga (sexy long blonde braids)
1. Elan (sexy blonde, no braids)
2. Haley (long hair, orange is sort of like blonde)
3. Vaarsuvius (purple? ugh)
4. Belkar (fuzz on an egg)
5. Roy (nuff said)

It's just logical.

Bald men just can't get a break. Even with hair-fetishist fantasy dwarves.

[Fyraltari]

skip

Hilgya's name is spelled H-i-l-g-y-a.

[skim172]

Hilgya's name is spelled H-i-l-g-y-a.

Dang.

:smallfrown:

[Peelee]

This is why I like it when I get early to a thread; witty* replies don't have the same punch a dozen posts down.

On the other hand, that means everyone else is punching up.

[Fyraltari]

Of course not. That low, and it's more likely a kick. :smalltongue:

I should have seen this coming. But I didn't and so I let my guard down.

On the other hand, that means everyone else is punching up.
Now, that's a low blow.

[Ruck]

Previous thread. (https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?578149-Ranking-Durkon-s-other-choices-for-marriage-within-the-party)

[Draconi Redfir]

Switch Elan and V, and that's my guess as well. (As for why, see Libro's post.)

i figure it's a "If he absolutely HAS to marry someone in the party" scenario.

Haley would be his first pick because he's attracted to women more then men

Roy is second choice because the two are close friends

V is third choice because they're both intellectuals that can tolerate and respect eachother's presence

Belkar is next

Elan is last because it's really hard to to tolerate the guy if you're not Haley.


Basically i'm looking at it as if the the whole people-already-married thing wasn't an issue.

[Emanick]

i figure it's a "If he absolutely HAS to marry someone in the party" scenario.

Haley would be his first pick because he's attracted to women more then men

Roy is second choice because the two are close friends

V is third choice because they're both intellectuals that can tolerate and respect eachother's presence

Belkar is next

Elan is last because it's really hard to to tolerate the guy if you're not Haley.


Basically i'm looking at it as if the the whole people-already-married thing wasn't an issue.

Makes sense. I was looking at it as if he had to marry one of them but there were no actual changes in anyone's relationship status. It's kind of hard to see him preferring Belkar over Elan (or anyone else) otherwise. (Unless, that is, Skim's Hair Theorem is correct. :smallamused: )

[The Pilgrim]

V is last as she is already married as far as Durkon knows.

[D.One]

On the other hand, that means everyone else is punching up.


Now, that's a low blow.

No, it's not. It's a shoryuken. :smalltongue:

[Precure]

1. Vaarsuvius
2. Haley
3. Elan
4. Belkar
5. Roy

[Ionathus]

Yeah, I figure the lack of clarification is a joke unto itself. Not unlike, say, the Elan's original plan (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0389.html) for getting back to Azure City. Hinting at it without stating makes for a better joke than just stating it.

Honestly, I don't really see it as a joke so much as an interesting character beat for Belkar.

If everyone in the party truly, 100% hated him, he'd be dead last in everyone's books. The fact that he's actually 4th, with Durkon at least, gives him a small bond with Durkon that the strip immediately expands on when the two of them discuss HARDCORE INTROSPECTION.

Part of it might even be connected to "Belkar was the only one who caught on to Durkula early." The two of them are forming a bit of a camaraderie, potentially to twist the knife on Belkar's impending death even harder.

[Seward]

My theory is that Durkon would be thinking more along the terms of who would make a good mate/alliance for his clan rather than sexual attraction for most of the choices although his early-strip reaction to Haley's wardrobe malfunction might help mitigate his likely aversion to her chaotic ways.

I'd guess Roy first for a spouse, due to their bromance and compatable alignments/worldview, Elan next for his good heart and Haley third for sexual attraction. Varsuvius dead last, after Belkar, probably because Varsuvius has a mate, even if the divorce papers are now final, plus the whole Familiacide/deal with fiends would probably bring long term dangers to his clan.

[Ruck]

My theory is that Durkon would be thinking more along the terms of who would make a good mate/alliance for his clan rather than sexual attraction for most of the choices although his early-strip reaction to Haley's wardrobe malfunction might help mitigate his likely aversion to her chaotic ways.

I'd guess Roy first for a spouse, due to their bromance and compatable alignments/worldview, Elan next for his good heart and Haley third for sexual attraction. Varsuvius dead last, after Belkar, probably because Varsuvius has a mate, even if the divorce papers are now final, plus the whole Familiacide/deal with fiends would probably bring long term dangers to his clan.

So, more or less my answer.


Oh, before I forget, here are my rankings of Durkon's view on OOTS marriage partners:

If he's heterosexual: Haley, Roy, Elan, Belkar, Vaarsuvius
If he's not: Roy, Elan, Haley, Belkar, Vaarsuvius

I put Elan over Haley in case #2 because he's more honest and kind than her, and I think that matters to Durkon. I put Vaarsuvius last due to V's tendency to solve interpersonal conflicts with arcane destruction-- V may be improving in that regard, but given Durkon's most recent relationship experience, I think he's going to be pretty reluctant to be in a marriage where that is on the table.

[trtl]

All things considered, I'm going to agree with V being dead last. I'm pretty sure the rest of the party doesn't know V is divorced right now, here's my ranking

1. Haley
2. Roy
3. Elan
4. Belkar
5. Vaarsuvius

If Durkon is bi than Roy and Haley would probably switch. Unless Durkon sees Roy in to professional a light to consider him romantically, he seems to have a respect for Roy that he doesn't share with the rest of the party.



You're reading too deeply into what is, even in-universe, an off-the-cuff joke? But, if I had to guess, V.

Have you seen some of the things this Forum analyzes? :smallbiggrin:

[The_Weirdo]

It gets weirder if we consider that the OOTS has three or, possibly, if you count Banjo, four non-humanoid members (Blackwing, Mr. Scruffy and Bloodfeast). In that case, Belkar being fourth out of eight or nine isn't that big of a deal, but shame on you, Durkon! Shame on you!!!

[Kantaki]

It gets weirder if we consider that the OOTS has three or, possibly, if you count Banjo, four non-humanoid members (Blackwing, Mr. Scruffy and Bloodfeast). In that case, Belkar being fourth out of eight or nine isn't that big of a deal, but shame on you, Durkon! Shame on you!!!

Let's assume for my sanity's sake that the pets and the puppet aren't on Durkon's list.
I mean the raven can at least talk, but... No. Just No.:smallyuk:

[The_Weirdo]

Let's assume for my sanity's sake that the pets and the puppet aren't on Durkon's list.
I mean the raven can at least talk, but... No. Just No.:smallyuk:

The insanity of the many outweigh the sanity of the few or the one.

[Jannoire]

I should have seen this coming. But I didn't and so I let my guard down.

Which is exactly where you'd want your guard to be when you're dealt a kick...

[137beth]

Me
You
Roland St. Jude
Belkar
Me


You have Roland St. Jude in there but not Rawhide or The Giant?:tongue:

[skim172]

It gets weirder if we consider that the OOTS has three or, possibly, if you count Banjo, four non-humanoid members (Blackwing, Mr. Scruffy and Bloodfeast). In that case, Belkar being fourth out of eight or nine isn't that big of a deal, but shame on you, Durkon! Shame on you!!!

Well, even though the Order members are humanoid, they're still biologically entirely separate species from Durkon. Stepping back from the standard fantasy romantic tropes, it's bizarre for Durkon to be attracted to any of them at all. They are completely different species. Why would Durkon be attracted to any of them? Just because they're roughly the same shape? Chimps superficially resemble humans, but somehow chimp-human romance hasn't quite blossomed the same way elf-human romance has in fantasy novels (which is for the best, as chimps are not caring lovers). My dog has the same general shape as a hyena, but I wouldn't recommend he pursue his chances. Yet it's practically the norm now - it's unusual if your fantasy setting doesn't feature interspecies hanky-panky.

We've seen odder matchups in the Stickverse. We know that half-orcs (https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0555.html) are a thing, as well as half-ogres (https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0216.html), and reptile-human (https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0676.html) relationships have been hinted at, despite the biological hurdles that would need to be overcome there.

Heck, Roy has a long-term relationship with a creature from outside his dimension. A creature who superficially resembles a human, sure, but has a completely different makeup.

So my case here is that it's already unusual that Durkon would be considering any of the other members of the Order for romantic pairings. Adding Blackwing into the mix isn't what makes it weird - it's quite weird already.


Now, you could make the case that since humans and elves and dwarves and halflings and gnomes (and orcs and ogres) can interbreed and give birth to viable hybrid young, it's not that weird. They must be fairly closely related species. Like how Homo sapiens and Neanderthals first met up and decided to get it on. They're just closely related species having sexy hybrid relations.

To which I would reply - that's insane. Elves live for hundreds of years. Dwarves can see in the dark. Orcs have giant tusks sticking out of their jaws. This suggests they have incredibly different biologies from humans. There is no way these are all closely-related species, much less descendants from a recent common ancestor.

And furthermore, if all these species could interbreed and hybridize so easily - then surely the definitions between species would begin to break down quickly. Humans and elves breed so easily and readily - surely after a few geological ages, the two species would be rather well-blended, possibly to the point that they are indistinguishable. Similar to how Neanderthals eventually boinked themselves out of existence leading to modern man. Yet, in most fantasy, species are extremely, strongly differentiated - which just seems unlikely.


It's like fantasy authors never even considered the broad biological implausibilities of the bio-systems they were creating when writing their hawt elf-on-human love romances. I'm looking at you, Tolkien.

(And don't even get me started with vampire fiction. The undead have sexual desires? Do their glands even function?)

So, anyway, I guess I'm saying, "Durkon+Bloodfeast = aw yeah".

[CriticalFailure]

It's not really weird for occasional partnerships between humanoids to be a thing. I mean, ancient humans boned neanderthals and denisovans for real, so its not exactly dragons and magic level of suspension of disbelief.

Also, Haley is literally the only member of the Order Durkon as been shown to be attracted to.

[Jannoire]

Re Tolkien: If I'm not mistaken, there are not more than two hands full of children from elven and human parents, who could even choose to be mortal or elvish...

Just because elves and humans and dwarves and orks can produce offsprings, doesn't mean that every offspring is a mix. The vast majority will still bone another being of their race.

[hroþila]

I'm going to need a source for "humanoids are only superficially alike and they have completely different makeups". Also, evolution is not a thing in the OotS universe.

[Fyraltari]

I would say that what’s repulsive with zoophilia isn’t The interspeciesm per se, no matter the distance, but that the cognitive difference between the ‘partners’ make any form of romance (or consensual sex) impossible.

Meanwhile elves and dwarves, just like neaderthals, are close enough mentally to modern humans that it isn’t an issue.

[Dion]

Ok, but what about Banjo? I mean, Banjo is literally a god. Is it kind of weird that Durkon ranks Banjo above Belkar? Or is that just a thing, like Minrah and Thor?

[Fyraltari]

Re Tolkien: If I'm not mistaken, there are not more than two hands full of children from elven and human parents, who could even choose to be mortal or elvish...

Just because elves and humans and dwarves and orks can produce offsprings, doesn't mean that every offspring is a mix. The vast majority will still bone another being of their race.

There are for Men-Elves couple that produced children that I know of:

1) Beren (Man) and Lùthien (half Elf, half angel). After they both died they were resurrected by the Valar and Lùthien chose to come back as a (wo)Man. It’s only after that that they had a child, named Dior. Wether Dior was Man or Elf wasn’t made clear and he died too young for the reader to guess based on lifespan. His wife was Elven though, and their daughter was Elwing.

2) Tuor (Man) and Idril (Elf). Tuor was apparently turned into an Elf before he died. Anyway their child, Eärendil married Elwing and they had two kids Elrond and Elros. After Eärendil and Elwing broke the interdiction to go to the Undying Lands they, and their children were offered a choice between Man- and Elvenkind. They all chose Elven except Elros. He and his descendants (up to Aragorn) were Men no questions asked.
Elrond was an Elf and so were his wife (Celebrian) and children Elladan, Elrohir and Arwen.

3) Aragorn and Arwen. Arwen was offered the same choice as her father and grandparents and chose Men. Their children were Men.

4) Imrazôr (Man) and Mithrellas (Elf), their son Galador was the first Prince of Dol Amroth and Legolas can tell with a glance that his far away descendant Prince Imrahil has Elven blood.

So it seems to me that on Arda, when Men and Elves have children together, Mannish blood overrides Elvish one unless a deity intervenes.